Truth wins Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------> Dharmalion2003, there are many different gurus and many different philosophies.
True but my experience has been that they are all more similar than different. That is why resources like CEI exist. Each group is a bit different and has its own unique characteristics, but the different groups tend to have a lot in common.> In the tradition I was following, guru is key. He is the middle man. Pleasing guru is equal to pleasing God. So guru is taken very seriously. He is your ticket out of the miserable material world.
I think you will find this is true of the group that I was part of as well as of most groups that are discussed on CEI. All of this stuff is true of many groups. Although each group has unique characteristics, the different cult groups tend to be similar more than they are different. That is why resources like CEI exist and why we can learn from each other if we accept the similarity of most of these groups.> In our case, those who stay do not know all the lies and dirty secrets.
I would, however, take this with a bit of skepticism especially since you are speaking in the first person of a group that you are no longer a part of. Since you haven't stayed, how do you know the state of mind of those who do? If you look at the Pair a Docks blog they have a 10-level pyramid model & psychodynamics of cult organization
. If you look at the higher levels in their pyramid, the people at those levels are described using terms like the Sociopaths, the Cynics, and the Willful Slaves. In other words, at least according to this pyramid, those who stay and reach the higher levels do
know about the lies and dirty secrets, but have also become increasingly cynical and stay for whatever real or perceived benefits they might be getting.> When I left it was not because of the guru but the group dynamics. I still had faith in the guru for many years. It is just recently that I found out about all the dirt.
The thing is that although you say you still had faith in the guru, that faith sounds like it was no longer absolute. Had the faith been absolute, you would have stuck it out with the group no matter how bad the group dynamics were. The group dynamics--a here and now pragmatic factor--was the main factor informing your decision of whether to stay or go, not any faith in the supposed godliness of the guru.
I would also put it out there for consideration that the reason you perceived the group dynamics to be bad is that you had fallen out of favor with the guru. Other members of the group who were still in favor with the guru might have been experiencing better group dynamics and so they stayed.
If you look again at the Pair a Docks pyramid structure I mentioned earlier, one can see that especially at the higher levels, the group dynamics become bad for a reason. It isn't something that just happens randomly. At a certain point to progress any higher one needs to start imitating the guru and become abusive to one's peers oneself.
So I'm suggesting that if the group dynamics became bad for you, it is likely because the members of the group you were part of were imitating the guru and starting to become abusive themselves. So the members of the group who stayed were, at least at some level, aware of what was going on and imitating it for cynical reasons.
One thing that former cult members sometimes have trouble with, and that I think you may be struggling with, is that cult members are often betrayed not just by the guru, but by their peers (fellow cult members) as well. The people in your former group who stayed are probably not nearly as innocent as you seem to think they are.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2021 03:18AM by DharmaLion2003.