Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and hypnosis abuses
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:03AM

Its actually only very few who find it intolerable.
And they are correct to find it intolerable.

As once their own people can perceive exactly what they are doing, they are FINISHED. The jig is up.
Once their people can even see only SOME of what they are doing, they are FINISHED.
So its just the few dozen people at the top, who are making the big-money, who are terrified.
They know for a fact, that if their audience learns to be able to perceive what they are doing, IT DOESN'T WORK anymore.

So all they can try to do, is DENY everything, and create confusion.
Its the exact same response one gets from every single professional persuader in the world, when they are unmasked and exposed.
Rage and anger.
Then total denial and lies, and trying to create confusion.

But once people catch-on, the persuaders are dead-meat, it all collapses, it falls flat.
It then backfires, as the seed of doubt is planted, and people see the lies past and present.
And they are now starting to experience that, the house of cards is collapsing in on them. Sure, they will retain a core group, but once people catch-on, they can lose 50-80% of their customers very quickly.

But this attempt to offer information about unethical uses of what started out as techniques of medical hypnosis is being constantly disrupted by people who could if they wished, remain in BK related social venues with persons who agree with them and never have a minutes worth of discomfort.

This venue exists so that persons who want to educate themselves about methods of covert influence can do so.
...the existence of one single single independent discussion venue such as RRcom seems intolerable to so many.
Beautifully stated. Thank you.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: kassy ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:06AM

""""Yeah, the School sounds stupid. I don't know how harmful it is though."

That comment by "Kassy" actually exposes her/his agenda very clearly.

First off, here is a person who is running massive apologetics and misdirection for the Byron Katie business, and they claim to have NOT even attended the Byron Katie 9-day LGAT seminar?
If you believe that, there is a bridge in Brooklyn that is also for sale.""""

So I'm saying the school is stupid, I'm trying to understand this, so that I can trick you guys into being slaves of Byron Katie? I'm not just telling the truth that I read the book and am inspired by the application? Is that what you are saying? That I'm like a zombie in here trying to convert people to the undead? I'm not, but there is no way to convince you. I'll put my spiritual beliefs on the table so that people don't have to speculate that I may be a zombie.

I like Byron Katie, but first and foremost I have been inspired by the Indian sage Ramana Maharshi. If I was going to try to convert anybody to anything it would be Ramana Maharshi's Self-inquiry. Ramana Maharshi's method has been so complete for me that I don't need anything else, but Byron Katie's method of just asking if thoughts are true? I've found that useful too sometimes. I see alot of parallels between the way Byron Katie describes her state and Ramana Maharshi's Enlightenment. Not exactly the same, but similar. Such as the dissolution of the individual into pure Being.

Ramana Maharshi died in 1950, he was a traditional Hindu saint and did not charge money, or make money and lived a poor ascetic lifestyle. So I would not be putting my two cents in for some modern corporate or cult scam, or even a new age guru I like.

But I want you to take a look at the allegation you made without proof. You were willing to say that I was insincerely making comments to manipulate people in service of Byron Katie. That is nuts, not just because of the idea of it. It's nuts that you would assume taht your conclusion is the right one without investigating it, without proof. And just say it. This demonstrates a lack of self-control, that you'll say anything. That is why I made the Crucible statement. I didn't mean it as a metaphor. That is exactly how those things transpire. whisper: I don't know she could be a witch. It's a hyteria way of dealing with things. Even if I was a witch, or a Byron Katie imposter, whcih I'm not, are your ideas so bankrupt that you can't actually engage in an adult conversation with me, that they cannot stand up to scrutiny and honest discussion. So bankrupt that you have to resort to pretending you know anything about me. Who is being dishonest? Think about that, dude! And decide whether you think growing up might be a good idea.

Another reason that I'm not interested in large group things such as the so called, "LGATS" (which I've just heard of from you guys)-lol is I was deeply involved in the punk/anarchist subculture I'm not a big fan of mob mentality or large groups or authority.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Meadow ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:15AM

btw I heard that BK once told the crowd at one of her schools that she herself charges $ 1700 for a private session...

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: kassy ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:33AM

"""Bottom line, its not credible that Kassy is not totally indocrinated into the BKI system. Its not believable. To someone who has seen the LGAT people operate for ages, its very obvious what is being done.

This is the tough thing about dealing with these LGAT seminar companies.
The people who promote them and work at them, are very motivated, and they are often very clever, and they will tell falsehoods without blinking. They manipulate people to get them to attend seminars.
They withhold information.
They mislead, and misdirect.
They lie."""

For all I know that's true, alot of businesses employ techniques that. I find it deplorable, and corrupt. So I'm not one of them. You couldn't get me to do work like that. If there is any similarity between me and them coincidental. But I'm also skeptical that they really exist. And if they did, if there really are these Byron Katie Gestapo going around trying to spread disinformation and disrupt dissident organizations, or from any group. Rather then fearfully worrying about it. Make sure your points and organization are strong and true to integrity. Liars can't mess with integrity. The truth is much stonger anyway. But if you spend time in hate speech and lying about people who come here. You've already lost. The truth always wins. Lies always lose. Plain and simple. Organizations that spend their time in lies and hate speech are destroyed. Organizations that align with themselves with the truth prosper.

"""- The incredible dishonesty about how Byron Katie THROWS PEOPLE OUT OF HER SEMINARS, [] also betrays Kassy, when Kassy said the seminar "sounds stupid". This is the same pattern as before, when the BKI people lie and say they have not been to a BK seminar, but then show they know exactly what happens in the seminar. Yes, they will lie. Harsh, but true."""

Fine, so ther are these people, liars who go around trying to infiltrate other organizations on behalf of Byron Katie. I doubt it. But I'm certainly not one of them. To say I'm one of them is cowardly behavior, it's not fit for a forum such as this dedicated to protecting people from abuse. It perverts their suffering, and struggles into mere bigotry and hate speech. If you resort to tactics like taht to invaldiate anybody you disagree with, you are no better!!!!! you are no better!!!!!

Byron Katie, Steve Hardison, $1,500 hr coaching, Psychological Warfare
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:48AM

There needs to be a lot more research done into looking at Steve Hardison, and Steve Chandler
He is also linked with Stephen Mitchell.

“Dear Steve,
Thanks from both of us from the bottom of our hearts. You are the king of manifestors.
Love and gratitude,
Stephen (Mitchell)”

How much does the Steve Hardison "coaching" cost?
$150,000 a year for 100 hrs.
Some clients go up to 3 that would be $450,000.
Paid in advance. No refunds.
$1,500 a hour?
and it appears that Healthcor International is HIS OWN COMPANY? and the "charity" line is good comedy...that is called a 'sucker test'....
QUOTE: "Minimum Coaching Agreement: 100 hours (approximately one year), $150,000.
I work with most clients from one to three years. I have several clients I have worked
with for over five years..."
"All compensation is paid prior to the first coaching session and is non-refundable.
If you choose to quit for any reason, all compensation will go directly to Healthcor International or to a charity of Steve Hardison’s choice. "


Excerpt from: Byron Katie: the Raw Interview, Ojai, California 2007 as shared with N. Taylor []

“N (interviewer): I have some familiarity with the Work. **Melony and Steve H. join the table**
Hi — awesome — you guys joined us...
N: Can you say a little about what is the School for the Work like?
BK: Incredible. So Steve, what is the School for the Work like?
Steve Hardison: Today in fact, happens to be my one-year anniversary having gone to it. [ Oh nice. ] A year ago today. [ Oh nice. ] [ Cheers ] **clank clank clank clank clank of glasses** And I thought it was — and I took my wife — and I thought it was the most extraordinary experience I've ever had in my life. Just extraordinary in looking at who I am as a human being. How to actually increase my personal peace, and to be present with my wife and my children. It was powerful. And then I had such a great experience going to that, that later in the same year in October, I took 21 of my clients* with me and we spent nine days in her School. That's how good it was."


Steve Chandler "says" he spent 4 years in the US ARMY in PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE. Did he?

"100 Ways to Motivate Others is the culmination of many years of successful
leadership coaching and training by best-selling author Steve Chandler and
attorney Scott Richardson...
He graduated from the University of Arizona with a degree in Creative Writing and Political Science, and spent four years in the US Army in Psychological Warfare...."

There is an someone named Scott E Richardson listed. Is this a different person, or the same person? Can anyone clarify that either way?


SCOTT E. RICHARDSON Bar No. 009277; [...] Supreme Court No. SB-07-0073-D By Arizona Supreme Court order dated April26, 2007, Scott E. Richardson, 3203 E.Baseline Rd.,[...] Gilbert, AZ 85234, a suspended member of the State Bar, was dis-barred by consent from the practice of law for failure to properly operate and maintain his trust accounts and for his failure to pay funds belong-ing to clients and third parties..."

The Anticult
There are more guys named STEVE who are linked with Byron Katie.

Steve Chandler
Steve Hardison
Stephen McGhee []

Julie Blake []
"As I write this, tears of unbelievable gratitude flow from my eyes for Steve Chandler, Stephen McGhee and Steve Hardison...While attending Katie’s 9-day School Julie experienced her first totally fearless day – and found heaven on Earth…the present moment."

These guys are almost off the charts, and need to be researched and looked into very carefully.
Notice below how quickly they get into "money issues" and "disappearing". Yes, money is going to be disappearing and not returning, that is for certain.
There is a horde of these "coaches" who have jumped on the Byron Katie gravy-train, and are using the same techniques, and making a killing.

One can find Byron Katie information on these people, by search for their name in "quotes", and the name "Byron Katie" in quotes. Like...

"Steve ______" "byron katie"

_______QUOTE excerpts for educational research and analysis___________________
Steve Chandler []
QUOTE: "So when I attended Byron Katie's 9-day school I was amazed by the power of it. I had long been an admirer of Katie's CDs and books. My friend Steve Hardison had recently been to her 9-day school and came back so enthused that I was taken aback. ...
When I got home after the 9-day school I was so happy I decided to call my next book "Fearless." I had already made a CD called "Fearless" long before the school, and it was everybody's favorite of all the books and CDs. (You can download it by clicking on "audio" at the top of this page.)
Then after writing a lot of it, I thought about calling it "Better Than Heaven." I was basing that on this quote from Katie, "There is something better than heaven. It is the eternal, meaningless, infinitely creative mind. It can't stop for time or space or even joy. It is so brilliant that it will shake what's left of you to the depths of all-consuming wonder."
Life was better than heaven after the school. Everything looked different. Felt different. New joy and music and color in everything. Katie kept asking us, "Who would you be without your story?"
...One thing that happened in the Byron Katie school was that all my money worries disappeared and have not returned."

Steve Hardison.
Steve Hardison markets himself as the legendary Ultimate Coach Steve Hardison.
Apparently a close personal friend of Byron Katie?

QUOTE: "I adore you Steve Hardison!...I love you... ...Thank you Steve, for knowing the way.
xoxoxo kt (Byron Katie)"

Have a look at the almost unbelievable level of exploitation and manipulation being attempted, but believe it.

_______QUOTE excerpts for educational research and analysis___________________

Steve Hardison “The Ultimate Coach” Joins the Miracle Leader Hall of Fame

"Steve came to the microphone and stood there soaking up the room. His presence was palpable. It was truly remarkable as his azure blue eyes glistened through his glasses at the audience. He stood silently looking out at all of us. While Steve was not looking directly at me, I could really feel his presence, and something began to shift in my body as if he was my very Soul was opening up my Soul … He was calm and powerful, relaxed and nervous all in the same breath. How can that be? There was raw power there. He wasn’t saying anything – not a word. The room was hushed and got grew increasingly quiet as we all waited for him to speak…a few people began to shift in their seats…. It was apparent that many people were uncomfortable with the silence. What would he say? Would he ever speak at all? The clock ticked…30 seconds. He looked out at us again, this time more fully…he connected more deeply. It was as if he was going deeper into his own heart…his own Spirit and as he went deeper I felt myself go deeper. This was so weird. “Say something”, I thought to myself. “I want you to speak. I want to hear what you have to say.”

His mouth finally opened and the words tried to come out. The first word was broken. He swallowed hard and began again. This time his heart connected with his mouth and his every ounce of being. His eyes filled with emotion and power filled integrity. He said, “My Name is Steve Hardison and I want all of you to know I LOVE YOU.”

The room grew quieter still as if they were in the calm before a hurricane. The hurricane did come immediately following that statement in the form of a thunderous round of applause which erupted as thousands of people gave a standing ovation for the powerful demonstration Steve had given us. He said very little and yet his five minutes spoke volumes to all of us." ...

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/08/2009 05:55AM by The Anticult.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Stoic ()
Date: July 08, 2009 05:53AM

Carlos B,

'This kind of stuff is particularly pernicious because the initiate is made to feel responsible for the development of a higher cause which leads to massive guilt should someone begin break free from the cult. Many come away drowning in shame and believing they simply weren't up to the task dropped onto them by the cult leader.'

Good point you make.

Carrying the burden of 'saving the world' or 'evolving to a higher plane to help all beings' has to be the epitome of utterly impossible unreachable goals. Which is helpful for the cult leader as it gives him endless leeway to keep moving the goal posts. The initiate will never be good enough and the cult leader has a follower forever--or at least until the poor initiate cracks up under the strain of trying to reach an impossible goal.

I think shame is the most corrosive possible feeling. But there is no shame in realising that 'saving the world' is beyond my capabilities or that we are all muddling along here by trial and error and that anyone claiming to be on a higher plane is conning at least themselves.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: kassy ()
Date: July 08, 2009 06:37AM

""""With regard to subjective experience, I would like to make the point that there is a percentage of people who are, for whatever reason, unable to feel empathy with others. They are able to acknowledge feelings in themselves but not accord that same capacity to others.

It is estimated that approximately 10% of any given population has this lack. In neuroscience this is seen in the lack of 'mirror neurons' in a persons brain. Mirror neurons are thought to be involved in the aquisition of language, the ability to imitate behaviour and the ability to feel empathy for others. It is also theorised that their lack is involved with the spectrum of autism.""""

I am an Asperger's dianosee. Actually people with Asperger's do not have a delay in language developement or ability. It is also a myth that people on the Autistic spectrum lack empathy. I'm as empathetic if not more then most people I know according to them, but difficulty at comprehending intention and non-verbal cues that are given between people. So it's in inability to understand and respond fluidly to others.

I will think if it's funny if anticult siezes upon this to go, "yeah, see, I told you kassy lacks empathy". That seems to be the way with some round these parts is siezing on anything they can use against you rather then having an intelligent discussion, it's interesting.

Not you Stoic, you seem pretyt level headed.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Christa ()
Date: July 08, 2009 07:06AM

This Ultimate Coach guy -- did anyone else notice he obtained a degree from the University of Santa Monica in 2001?

Isn't that John-Roger's place? MSIA?

I'm surprised. I'm not sure why.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: Christa ()
Date: July 08, 2009 07:13AM

I'm really struck by Katie's extraordinary facility with tweet-speak, and net-speak in general. There are teen-agers who don't have the lingo down so well.

This might be part of her overall skill with the manipulation of language; IDK. It's noteworthy, though. Even if she has assistants tweeting for her, the voice is thoroughly recognizable.

Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Steve Chandler, Psychological Warfare
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: July 08, 2009 07:37AM

Steve Chandler claims variations of he "spent four years in the US Army in Language and Psychological Warfare".

search Google for:

"steve chandler" "psychological warfare"

He seems to be making this claim all over the place. Why?
Did he really do it? The only way to prove it, is for him to post his actual credentials.

Why ask if its true?
Because there are many many people in the persuasion field, and the NLP persuasion area, who claim to have been "consultants to the CIA", and things like that.
Why do they do it? As its uncheckable, and it makes them sound cool to the other wannabe mind-fuckers who they are trying to sell things to.
They just lie, and make it up, and say its "secret". Its an easy scam to pull off.

There are all sorts of salespeople out there, who spend a lot of time trying to figure out ways to screw with people's minds. And when they see someone claiming to be in "Psychological Warfare" they start to salivate.

Frankly, it sounds like bullshit. Where are the credentials? Which Army unit, which dates? Unless its proven, its just more bullshit, in a large pile.
People who are really experts in miltary level Psy-Ops, generally don't post it in hundreds of places on the internet to promote themselves.
But it all comes down to evidence. Where is Steve Chandler's military service record?
(oops, forgot, its all Top Secret CIA spooky stuff...)

whatever dude, just infantile marketing games that have been done for decades.

But its interesting how the techniques of PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE would come into the discussion so openly.
That is actually a very good term for what Byron Katie is doing to people's minds.

Even Guruphiliac, (before he back-pedalled after his phone-call with a former BK-insider, who is his "good friend")..
said about the Byron Katie LGAt seminar...
"It's all seeming quite culty to us. Her nice lady image aside, it sounds a lot more like psych-ops being run at a CIA black site..."

Byron Katie, Steve Chandler and Psychological Warfare.
birds of a feather flock together.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/08/2009 07:48AM by The Anticult.

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