Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: quackdave ()
Date: December 11, 2008 01:26AM

Thanks everyone, particularly Anticult, for the help I've received reading this entire 101 comments over the past few days. Just this morning, I have deleted my "Work on the Web" (only $39!) and am feeling a little sheepish over my involvement and expenditures with the Byron Katie books and 'work'. I am sure that I was truly doing her bidding by hypnotizing myself, to prepare me for whatever the next level was to be.

Your comments have surely saved me expense and misery, as I have been poised to spend more time and money with Katie (and Steve Sashen, by the way) to fix the problems they have "helped" me to see in myself. What a travesty. I have to agree with the posters who believe that something illegal is going on here, despite all the disclaimers that one is made to sign off on.

I feel like I'm going to be sick; I'm not sure if it's from my disgust or if it's a byproduct of my work on the web.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and The Work on The Web scam
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 11, 2008 04:44AM

quackdave, GREAT job breaking free!!

In my view, your disgust is VERY healthy. Disgust is a primary emotion which drives us AWAY from things that are not good for us. Once a person figures out what Byron Katie is doing, revulsion seems to be the most natural emotion to have.

You are absolutely correct you were being shaped and groomed, its a process. They start you with the countless YouTube videos, website, books and CD's, and then hotline "coaching", and then the "coaches" quietly "suggest" you attend the Byron Katie School LGAT, and once they get the person into that LGAT, if the person is vulnerable, they can be hooked into Byron Katie for many years, and for massive amounts of money spent. From all the evidence there is no limit to the money being spent, not just 10's of thousands, clearly there are people who are going way beyond that, and even turning EVERYTHING over to BKI. Katie keeps pushing people to give EVERYTHING for her, even from her early books and recordings. There are people who are on their knees before Byron Katie and who have turned literally everything over.

Byron Katie and her people are highly sophisticated in persuasion techniques that are difficult to spot. Again, those trained in persuasion, hypnosis and NLP can see them quite quickly, but for people who have not specialized in that, it takes time to see what is going on. They do "invisible persuasion" and it does work on many people.

You have also brought up a very important point about "The Work on the Web".
Many people are going there, and posting their most intimate and vulnerable and revealing thoughts on the internet. Who is looking at them?
These "coaches" who are really just salespeople, and who have no actual training?
This is why psychologists are CONFIDENTIAL, so you can reveal things that you would not want some person who is trying to SELL you stuff to know.

Notice how the Byron Katie hypno-speak gets thrown into the garbage, when her lawyers write the text to protect her and her people.
Notice how buried in this text below, they say you could be LIABLE...

"Neither CI nor BKI will be liable for any loss that you may incur as a result of someone else using your password or account, either with or without your knowledge or permission. However, you may be held liable for any losses incurred by CI and/or BKI or another related party due to someone else using your account or password."

And in the text below, they say that you have given up all your rights if they do something wrong, but if YOU do something wrong, then they can go after you. See how BKI does it? You can't go after them, but they can go after you. Very sinister.

BKI also OWNS every piece of text you send them! Byron Katie OWNS YOUR THOUGHTS for free, according to her. BKI is a corporate monster.

" By sending or transmitting to us creative suggestions, ideas, notes, concepts, information, or other materials (collectively, "Submission Materials") or by posting such Submission Materials on the Platform, you hereby grant BKI and CI full rights, without any compensation due to you, to use these Submission Materials as if these had been created by CI and/or BKI."

There is a lot more sinister information in their General Terms below. BKI knows that 99% of the kind of people who do The Work, will not be able to make sense of the document below.
Notice below this, that their PRIVACY document is another massive bunch of text, with MOST of the information hidden behind a "more details" link. They do this so they can count how many people read more than a paragraph of that stuff, which is very few. There is a lot more nasty information in the text below.

"Privacy"...have not even read the entire thing yet, but they appear to KEEP the data for 1 year even after deleted, if not forever, and they MAY have a service to CHARGE people to remove their names from the data, but not delete it! Its all very confusing...(14. Storage, deletion and access to user data)
Please, anyone reading this...NEVER USE THIS TYPE of "Work On The Web" system...EVER.


Terms of use

General Terms of Use for
"The Work on the Web"

Welcome to The Work on the Web. The Work on the Web consists of Content, a Process, and a Platform on which this program is made available (together called the "Program"). The content (the "Content") and inquiry process (the "Process") used for this Program are provided to you by Byron Katie International ("BKI"). The web-application and technical infrastructure (the "Platform") on which this Program is made available to you (including the payment infrastructure) are provided to you by Coaching Interactive Ltd. ("CI"). The terms and conditions in these General Terms of Use (this "Agreement") sets forth the terms and conditions which govern your use of this Program.

1. Please take some time to read this Agreement before accessing or using the Platform, Content and Services, as well as the privacy Policy document also available on the site, By accessing or using the Platform, Content and Services you agree to be bound by the terms and conditions set forth below inclusive of the privacy policy. If you do not wish to be bound by these terms and conditions, you should not access or use the Platform, Content and/or Services or you should immediately cease to do so. CI and/or BKI may modify this Agreement at any time, and such modifications will be effective immediately upon notice, which may be effected by posting the modified Agreement on the website or via email. We therefore recommend that you review the Agreement posted on the website periodically to be aware of such modifications. The date of last modification(s) will be indicated on the website. By continuing to use the Program following such modifications, you acknowledge your acceptance of the modified Agreement. If required by local or international legislation, you will agree to sign a non-electronic version of this agreement.

2. Who may benefit from the Program and what is it all intended for? You must be eighteen (18) years or older to access the Program. If you are under eighteen (18) years of age, you are not permitted to access this Program for any reason. Due to the age restrictions for use of this Program, no information obtained by or available through this Program falls within the child online privacy act (COPA) and is not monitored as doing so. The main purpose of the Program is to make "The Work of Byron Katie", a BKI-owned inquiry process, available to everyone by providing it over the web, to enable people to grow to their full potential.

3. Parental Responsibility: Some consider Coaching to be the next trend in modern education; however, parents should always supervise their children's use of the Internet in general and of the CI site and services in particular, as it involves processes that may be of strong influence on their children. CI makes the best possible effort to assure that only highly qualified content and personnel use the site for coaching and education, nevertheless, it is the parent's responsibility to assure that the proper coach and coaching process is offered to their children in addition to the fact that there are commercial and financial aspects to the use of the site which must be approved. Some products are available commercially for that purpose and for the filtering material that may be consider harmful to minors, an example is available for instance at [].

4. What is the Program not intended for? The Program does not provide you with medical or financial counseling advice and is not intended as a substitute for the advice and/or supervision of your personal physician or of your financial advisor. Any application of the recommendations provided to you through the Program is at your discretion and sole risk and responsibility. For purposes of this Agreement, the practice of medical and financial counseling includes, without limitation, psychiatry, psychology, psychotherapy, or providing health care treatment, instructions, diagnosis, prognosis or advice, financial advisors, financial planners, tax advisors, corporate attorneys, business attorneys, board certified business planners life coaching, personal development coaching or any other personal coaching. No warranty is granted that the Program will not contain material that you or other individuals may find objectionable. However, we will investigate complaints and appreciate your input. Please submit any such feedback directly to CI and/or BKI using our contact page on the Platform.

5. Purchase of your license and required information The access to the Program is offered for license on the Platform. After purchasing the Program license, acknowledging and accepting the terms set forth in this Agreement, CI and BKI will grant you a limited personal, non-exclusive, non-commercial and non-transferable right and license to use the Program made available to you on the Platform for self-coaching purposes. You may be requested to provide certain information, including but without limitation, your full name, address, telephone number and credit card information. You acknowledge that in order to be granted and retain access to the Program, and to comply with the terms and conditions of this Agreement and any other agreement related to the Program license purchased, the information you will provide must be accurate, complete and current. You agree to update such information, from time to time, if required to ensure that such information is accurate, complete and current. You will be responsible for all charges incurred through your account as well as for paying any applicable taxes. CI nor BKI will be responsible for your use of the Program and you will have no claims or demands against CI and/or BKI in connection with these.

6. Your responsibility in maintaining security and confidentiality of your account information: As part of the registration process and setting up an account, you will be asked to select a username and password to access the Program. You acknowledge that you are entirely responsible for maintaining the security and confidentiality of your user name and password, and for all activities, whether by you or anyone else, that are conducted through your account. You agree to notify CI and BKI immediately, through means of the contact page made available on the Platform, of any unauthorized use of your account or any other breach of security. Neither CI nor BKI will be liable for any loss that you may incur as a result of someone else using your password or account, either with or without your knowledge or permission. However, you may be held liable for any losses incurred by CI and/or BKI or another related party due to someone else using your account or password. CI and/or BKI may provide limited and controlled access to private data you enter into the platform to technical personnel if and when a technical question arises regarding the functionality of the Program or financial matters regarding its use. By accepting this Agreement you acknowledge that you understand and agree with such limited access as described above.

7. Service and support The Program has been built using widely applied technologies as Web browsing and Flash™, proprietary and open source media presentation technologies. CI and BKI provide no guarantee relative to the operability of such services on any specific computer hardware and software platform. Furthermore, the nature of the Program and cost of the Program license does not support provisioning of support services. The Program is intended for use by experienced computer and internet users familiar with Flash™ media presentation techniques, using computers capable of operating these technologies. CI may elect to provide email help support which will respond to critical issues raised by registered paying users.

8. Money back guarantee: CI and BKI are committed to provide you with a high quality and valuable Program. As such we offer a money back guarantee whereby a client will be refunded for the amount paid if not satisfied within 14 days from the initial registration date. To be refunded a client will have to e-mail to and explain in detail the reason for lack of satisfaction. This information will be used by CI and BKI to improve the service.

9. Proprietary Rights and Confidential Information: You acknowledge and agree that the Program contains proprietary and confidential information that is protected by applicable intellectual property and other laws, and are the sole property of BKI and/or CI or their licensors. No rights are being granted to you except for the limited license mentioned above. By sending or transmitting to us creative suggestions, ideas, notes, concepts, information, or other materials (collectively, "Submission Materials") or by posting such Submission Materials on the Platform, you hereby grant BKI and CI full rights, without any compensation due to you, to use these Submission Materials as if these had been created by CI and/or BKI.

10. Copyright Policy: The Digital Millennium Copyright Act of 1998 (the "DMCA") provides recourse for copyright owners who believe that material appearing on the Internet infringes their rights under the U.S. copyright law. If you believe in good faith that materials hosted by CI infringe your copyright, you, or your agent may send to CI a notice requesting that the material be removed or access to it be blocked. Any notification by a copyright owner or a person authorized to act on its behalf that fails to comply with requirements of the DMCA shall not be considered sufficient notice and shall not be deemed to confer upon CI actual knowledge of facts or circumstances from which infringing material or acts are evident. If you believe in good faith that a notice of copyright infringement has been wrongly filed against you, the DMCA permits you to send to CI a counter-notice. All notices and counter notices must meet the then current statutory requirements imposed by the DMCA; see [] for details. We suggest that you consult your legal advisor before filing a notice or counter-notice. Also, be aware that there can be penalties for false claims under the DMCA.

11. Disclaimer Regarding Links: Any links provided as part of the Program have been provided as a convenience, but neither CI nor BKI control or endorse these linked websites, and neither CI nor BKI have reviewed or approved the content which appears on the linked websites. Neither CI nor BKI are responsible for the legality, accuracy or inappropriate nature of any content, advertising, products or other materials on or available from any linked websites. You acknowledge and agree that neither CI nor BKI will be held responsible or liable, directly or indirectly, for any damage or loss caused or alleged to be caused by or in connection with the use of any of the links, content, goods or services available on or through the linked websites.

12. Disclaimer of Warranties: THE PROGRAM IS PROVIDED "AS IS", "AS AVAILABLE", AND WITHOUT WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, IMPLIED OR EXPRESS, AS TO THE ACCURACY, COMPLETENESS, USEFULNESS OR APPROPRIATENESS FOR ANY PURPOSE. Neither CI nor BKI endorse nor are responsible for the accuracy and reliability of any opinion, advice, or statement made on the Platform by anyone other than an authorized CI and/or BKI representative while acting in its official capacity. Your participation, correspondence or business dealings with any coach or any other third party found on or engaged through the Platform, regarding payment and delivery of specific goods and services, and any other terms, conditions, representations or warranties associated with such dealings, are solely between you and such coach or third party. You agree that neither CI nor BKI will be responsible or liable for any loss, damage, or other matters of any sort incurred as the result of such dealings.

13. Limitation of Liability: Neither CI, BKI nor anyone officially representing CI or BKI, is responsible or liable to you or anyone else for any damages, loss or injury relating in any way to (i) The use of or inability to use the Program made available; (ii) Any content contained on the Platform; (iii) Statements or conduct posted or made publicly available on the Platform; (iv) Any Content purchased or obtained through the Platform; (v) Any action taken in response to or as a result of any information available on the Platform; (vi) Any damage caused by loss of access to, deletion of, failure to store, failure to back up, or alteration of any content on the Platform, or (vii) Any other matter relating to the use of the Program. CI’s and BKI’s aggregate total liability to you for any and all damages, losses, costs, expenses or injuries will never exceed the amount paid by you, if any, for using the Program.

14. Indemnification: You agree to indemnify, defend, and hold CI, BKI and their respective subsidiaries, affiliates, officers, directors, agents, co-branders or other partners, employees, and representatives harmless from and against any and all claims, damages, losses, costs or expenses (including reasonable attorneys' fees and disbursements) which arise directly or indirectly out of or from:
(i) Your breach of this Agreement,
(ii) Any allegation that any materials that you submit to CI and/or BKI or post on any forums (e.g., message boards, chat rooms) infringe or otherwise violate the copyright, trade secret, trademark or other intellectual property rights of a third party, and
(iii) Your access or use of the Program.

This Section shall survive in the event this Agreement is terminated for any reason.

15. Termination: This Agreement shall remain in effect for as long as you continue to have access to the Program and pay all applicable fees in connection with such access, or until terminated in accordance with these terms and conditions. You agree that CI and/or BKI, in its sole discretion, may terminate access to the Program, in whole or in part, and remove and discard any content within the Platform, if CI considers this Agreement has been breached. You agree that any actions taken under this Section may be effective without prior notice to you. In the event of termination, however, those Sections in this Agreement which provide for continuing obligations on your part, shall survive indefinitely.

16. General Information: This Agreement constitutes the entire agreement and understanding between you, CI and BKI and governs your use of the Program, superseding any prior agreements related to this Program between you, CI and/or BKI. This Agreement and the relationship between you, CI and BKI shall be governed by and construed in accordance with the laws of the State of Israel, without regard to its conflict of law provisions. You, CI and BKI irrevocably agree to submit to the personal and exclusive jurisdiction of the competent courts located in Tel Aviv, Israel, and waive any jurisdictional, venue, or inconvenient forum objections to such courts. The failure of CI and/or BKI to exercise or enforce any right or provision of this Agreement shall not constitute a waiver of such right or provision. If any provision of this Agreement is found by a court of competent jurisdiction to be unlawful, void or for any reason unenforceable, then that provision shall be deemed severed here from and shall not affect the validity and enforceability of any remaining provisions. The section titles in this Agreement are for convenience purposes only and have no legal or contractual effect. This Agreement is not assignable, transferable or sub-licensable by you except with our prior written consent of CI and BKI. However, CI and BKI may assign this Agreement to any third party whom we choose without your consent.

17. Prohibited Activities: In connection with your use of the Program, you acknowledge and agree that you will not:
o Copy, reverse engineer, reverse assemble, otherwise attempt to discover the source code, distribute, transmit, display, perform, reproduce, publish, license, create derivative works from, transfer or sell or distribute any information, software, products or services obtained through the Program;
o Access the Program by any means other than through the standard industry-accepted or CI-provided interfaces;
o Transmit any message, information, data, text, software or image, or other content that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortuous, vulgar, obscene, libelous, or otherwise objectionable which may invade another's right of privacy or publicity;
o Impersonate any person or entity, including but without limitation, a CI or BKI official, forum leader, chat room monitor, guide or host, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with such a person or entity;
o Post or transmit any material that contains a virus or corrupted data;
o Delete any author attributions, legal notices or proprietary designations or labels that you upload to any communication feature;
o Use of the Program’s communications features in a manner that adversely affects the availability of its resources to other users (e.g., excessive shouting, use of all caps, or flooding continuous postings of repetitive text);
o Post or transmit any unsolicited advertising, promotional materials, "junk mail", "spam" "chain letters," "pyramid schemes" or any other form of solicitation or any non-resume information such as opinions or notices, commercial or otherwise;
o Violate any applicable local, state, national or international law;
o Upload or transmit any material that infringes any patent, trademark, trade secret, copyright or other proprietary rights of any party;
o Delete or revise any material posted by any other person or entity;
o Manipulate or otherwise display the Program by using framing or similar navigational technology;
o Register, subscribe, attempt to register, attempt to subscribe, unsubscribe, or attempt to unsubscribe, any party, if you are not expressly authorized by such party to do so;
o Use the Program for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by these terms and conditions;
o Use the Program in any manner that could damage, disable, overburden or impair the Platform or networks, or interfere with any other user's use of the Program;
o Gain or attempt to gain unauthorized access to the Program, accounts, computer systems or networks connected to the Platform through hacking, password mining or any other means; and
o Obtain or attempt to obtain any materials or information through any means not intentionally made available through the Program.


Coaching Interactive Privacy Policy

Coaching Interactive (CI) considers protection of its clients’ privacy a primary company value; we acknowledge the fact that people entrust CI with private personal information and we do our best to protect their privacy.

The following document describes CI’s policy regarding the protection of client and coach privacy data .

By accepting the Coaching Interactive General Terms of Use of the web site you indicate that you understand and accept the CI Privacy Policy as stated herein, as updated periodically to assure continued improvement.

This document specifies the following topics

1. Brief summary and concept
2. Terms definitions
3. What personally identifiable information is collected from you through the web site?
4. Who provides the coaching service? (TM>CM>CO) & 3rd party
5. Who has access to the coaching information and under what conditions?
6. Limitations on use of information
7. With whom may the information be shared
8. How can inaccuracies in the information be corrected.
9. CI obligation to make its best to protect privacy.
10. Security procedures practiced to protect loss, misuse or alteration of info by CI
11. Strict enforcement and improvement of the security policy and procedures
12. The limitations and risks associated with use of digital data, computers and internet.
13. Commitment not to actively transfer private information to other parties without permission.
14. Storage, deletion and access to user data
15. Information which is private or proprietary of CI and CI’s partners
16. CI owns the log files and statistical data on the technical use of the site.
17. Registration information collected by CI (CC, contact info, addresses etc.)
18. Client–Coach Communication Using the CI Service
19.. Education, minors and parents responsibility
20. Contacting us

The Coaching Interactive system provides an enabling platform for coaching; Coaching is done independently by clients using self coaching programs or interactively with a personal coach.

Statement of Policy

The private information stored on the system relates to clients and coaches and is relevant to the coaching process performed on the system. This information belongs to the client or the coach and will not be used for any other purpose.

1. Brief summary and concept

Coaching Interactive (CI) provides an Interactive Coaching Platform, Self Coaching tools, and Best Sellers Coaching (BSC) content and Personal Coaches to clients around the world, making coaching available to everyone. Using the platform, clients record sensitive private information for their personal use and for intimate sharing with their personal coaches. As such, maintaining data privacy is a fundamental corner stone of the service provided by CI. To assure the privacy of the clients’ and coaches’ personal data, CI has established and is implementing a very unique and rigorous privacy policy, practices and procedures which is described in brief in this document, which attempts to relate to the all aspects of securing the data ranging from the technical to the practical, procedures and enforcement mechanism applied. The document describes who has access to what information and under what condition. What personally identifiable information is, and how it is collected from clients who uses the web site. What is the intended use of the information and who is providing the coaching services to the client and as such has access to the coaching information, describes the uses and limitations on use of such information and with whom and under what circumstances it may be shared or corrected. The document outlines CI’s obligation and methods of protecting the private information and the security procedures practiced for that purpose to prevent loss, misuse or alteration and how they are being enforced. On the other hand it does also list the inherent privacy risks associated with the use of digital data, computers and internet. The document also lists access provided to the data for distinct well defined purposes such as quality assurance supervision and technical support when and if requested by clients and coaches. It continues to describe how data is stored, deleted or accessed by present and past clients. A special chapter handles privacy with relation to third party providers with whom CI collaborates to offer a more complete and comprehensive coaching offering (with client’s awareness and approval). What happens to the data if a client’s personal coach terminates his use of the CI system? Some information relating the use of the site is logged and a paragraph addresses the ownership and potential use of such logged data, including the registration details collected by CI. The nature of use of the platform for coach client communication is briefly outlined and attention is given to the special responsibility of parents with young children who may have access and may use the site. CI does not share information with others for promotion; however we may share necessary information with third party service providers which a client elects to use. CI will also encourage clients and coaches to share their experiences; all these are done on a pre approved consent basis which is described and detailed below.

Click here for more details

2. Terms definitions

Caching Interactive (CI) System, Platform is a web based system used for providing clients with coaching content and personal coach guidance and communication. Coaches mean personal coaches who provide a coaching service to client and are in turn part of a hierarchical set up including Coach Managers and Coaching Territory Managers who act to support and manage the use of the CI Platform. Client Private Data, Personal Details is information posted on the System by a client voluntarily for the purpose of facilitating the provision or the conduct of a coaching service and as such may be private to the client and must therefore be properly protected. Coaching Sessions, Program means a structured set of modular content units used to enable interactive coaching over the web. It may include text, images and questionnaires. A Program is made of Sessions; a Super Program is a combined set of Programs. One or a few Sessions nominally emulate a face to face coaching engagement between a client and a coach. Self Coaching means a Session in which a client works with the System without the involvement of a Coach. Interactive Coaching is a web based coaching platform where a live Personal Coach interacts with the client (a–synchronously, namely the coach and the client do not work together at the same time but rather interact at different times, similar to the way e–mails are exchanged. Accredited Coach is a coach which was accredited by CI or a Territory CI Manager to provide interactive coaching on the CI platform. Supervisor Coach is a highly experienced and qualified coach who supervises and guides coaching by providing interactive services over the CI Platform.

3. What personally identifiable information is collected from you through the web site?

User registration details, use of the site log, and mostly private information posted by the user during the self or interactive coaching sessions. During Interactive Coaching only, the coach is exposed to data posted by the client during all his coaching sessions in the coach’s site, (including data entered in Self coaching, but excluding data entered during self or interactive coaching in other coaches site)

4. Who provides the coaching service? (CO>CM>LTM) & 3rd party)

During Self programs which are used without a coach, the only party that has access to the information is the client. When the service is provided in collaboration with a third party content, methodology or process provider, such as with Best Seller Coaching, The client can consult on matters relating to the coaching methodology directly with a support agent established by the third party.

5. Who has access to the coaching information and under what conditions?

5.1. Only the client has access to the information in Self Coaching only application.
5.2. Client and Coach on Coach’s sessions performed in a personal coach site.
5.3. A Certified QA Coaching Supervisor when operating on the site.
5.4. A qualified technical team, with special security training, when and if called in by a client and a coach for technical support on a specific client request.
5.5. Private registration information (User contact, payment records etc) is accessible to CI administration and management, billing and technical support team.

6. Limitations on use of information

Registered users may not use information gathered through a site transaction to defame, abuse, harass, stalk, threaten or otherwise violate the legal and civil rights of any other registered user. Registered users may not use information gathered through the CI site and any activity related to it or facilitated by it, to sell any goods or services for any commercial purpose outside the scope of the CI service. Email addresses and personal information may not be used to forward surveys contents, pyramid schemes or chain letters, or to post the same message repeatedly (a practice referred to as "spamming"). CI may terminate the ability of any Client or Coach to use the CI service if the privacy policy is not strictly adhered to by them.

7. With whom may the information be shared

Coaches are strictly bounded by the coaching agreement with the client (as well as with CI) to protect client private data. Such data may not be used without prior client consent, with any one and for any purpose. Data may be partially shared with third party providers if and when a client expresses a desire to benefit from such third party service providers (for example Web based Self Assessment providers). Only information required to facilitate such use of third party services will be provided. CI will encourage clients and coaches sharing of information with other coaches and clients. Sharing experiences in this manner is known to improve user experience and effectiveness of the coaching processes both for the contributors and users of such content, Such shared information may include testimonials and case studies, papers, and other forms of best coaching practices and wisdom. However sharing of used contributed content of this nature will be strictly on a voluntary basis. Sharing will be facilitated by the CI system with proper administration aimed to assure user awareness of the shared nature of the contribution. CI currently does not share aggregated demographic information with partners or advertisers, but CI reserves the right to do so in the future. However this will not be linked to any personal information that can identify any individual person. We use a credit card processing company to bill users for use of the service. This company does not retain, share, store or use personally identifiable information for any secondary purposes. We reserve the right to partner with third parties to provide specific services. When the user signs up for these services, we will share names, or other contact information that is necessary for the third party to provide such services. These parties will not be allowed to use personally identifiable information except for the purpose of providing these services. Tell–A–Friend – If a user elects to use our referral service for informing a friend about our site, we ask them for the friend’s name and e–mail address and automatically send the friend a one–time e–mail inviting him/her to visit the CI site and store this information for the sole purpose of sending the one–time e–mail. The friend may then contact CI at a prescribed e–mail address.

8. How can inaccuracies in the information be corrected.

Users who have access to the CI system and services can always modify and alter data (other than User Name used to log into the system) via My Office > My details function. Modifiable data includes and is not limited to personal details (Given and family name, etc), contact information and payment means (Credit cards, PayPal, etc.). Users of Best Seller Coaching can do so by pressing the Change Password link or contact

9. CI obligation to make its best effort to protect privacy.

CI considers client and coach privacy as the primary company value. Coaching Interactive is committed to make its best possible effort to take all measures and protect the private information of clients and coaches.

10. Security procedures practiced to protect loss, misuse or alteration of info by CI

In order to assure consistent high quality and constantly improving security measures to protect client private data, a detailed effective procedure is executed, enforced and monitored. It relates to issues such as who has access to what information, how passwords are kept and refreshed, what training CI personnel have to undergo to be qualified to provide service to clients and coaches at the various administrative levels, and it spells out specific processes for the tracking of security challenges, experience and lessons learned (a learning organization structure)

10.1. Data communication security we provide. This website takes every precaution to protect our users’ information. When, in the registration form, users are asked to enter sensitive information (such as a credit card number), the information is encrypted. CI uses the industry standard Secure Socket Layer (SSL) encryption and firewalls to protect against loss, misuse, and alteration of any personal data under our control. While on a secure page such as our payment form, appears a "locked" icon on the top of web browsers such as Microsoft Internet Explorer. If you have any questions about the security at our website, you can send an e–mail to

11. Strict enforcement and improvement of the security policy and security procedure

The above procedure and the overall security status of the company and its service are periodically reviewed. Record is taken. Recorded instances of security events are analyzed, with conclusions and recommendations effectively deduced and implemented. As a result the security procedure itself is constantly updated, when changes and updates relates to the users or coaches, the territories are alerted to inform the hierarchical Coach management, coaches and clients structure.

12. The limitations and risks associated with use of digital data, computers and internet.

Notwithstanding the measures which CI takes as mentioned above to assure best available security to its clients and coaches, the very fact that data is handled in a digital manner which is easily transferable over the internet or other digital storage and communication media and is ubiquitous form, presents a security hazard users should be aware of. To improve protection, a forum is established within CI to constantly examine potential security concerns, with the sole purpose of alerting the system in case of such security hazard, in order to address such weak points as best as we can. However one has to bear in mind that such potential security breaches may come about and protect accordingly. While CI does make best effort to protect client data it cannot assure 100% unbreakable solution, and such potential breaches may come about unintentionally or even due to hackers direct attack.

13. Commitment not to actively transfer private information to other parties without permission.

CI does not share user data for promotion and marketing purposes. If in the future such use of the data may become useful for CI’s users, as envisioned by CI, it will be provided only with user consent provided via the CI system. Such use of data will not be user specific, with user details properly concealed.

14. Storage, deletion and access to user data

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/11/2008 04:51AM by The Anticult.

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Byron Katie - Wayne Dyer knows where the money is...Abraham Hicks
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 11, 2008 06:11AM

In the CD program, Wayne Dyer comes out as a big supporter of Abraham Hicks, as well.
Of course, Hay House has business deals with all these people, its all cross-marketing business.
Then Wayne Dyer says you can prevent Alzheimer’s by not thinking about it, like his mother supposedly did. So Wayne Dyer is saying if you get Alzheimer’s, you created it.

As far as Byron Katie in this CD, it really is revulsive. She adopts a type of "babytalk" tonality style of speaking to her mostly female audience. Like a mother talking to a 6 year old child. (that is intentional, as she speaks differently in other contexts).
She picks subjects that appeal to her audience, relationships, kids, family.

Then Byron Katie runs her patterns and story again, the Cockroach, etc.
She uses the word INVITE constantly, which is the perfect word to lure her audience in, people who can't say NO to an invitation.
She softens up their minds by telling them to OPEN THEIR MIND and OPEN THE HEART, this is all just about softening people up. Same as the so-called non-judgement and passivity she preaches, its meant to soften up people's heads.

She calls everyone SWEETHEART over and over, this again is meant to soften up the mind.
She uses the YES FRAME over and over by asking group questions with only one answer.

She uses the phrase...STEP INTO MY PARLOR, over and over. That is a hypnotic cue. Too bad people can't see that...that is a brilliant INSTANT HYPNOTIC INDUCTION...STEP INTO MY PARLOR...she can put people under with those 4 words...

She wants to completely undermine her targets thinking processes, and create massive self-doubt. She is Thought-Leading, turning your mind back in on itself, and creating SELF-BLAME. (where are YOU disruptive?).
You see how each session ends with the woman engaging in severe SELF-BLAME, which creates depression and pain, which leads the person towards Byron Katie. In that way, it has some similarities to Scientology, it looks for the person's weak spots, and then hammers them there.

Its a real drag she is able to do this to these folks...Byron Katie targets folks who are "too nice" and who seem to never be able to say NO to an "invitation".
What a trickster. Its like a spider dancing around on its web, con-vincing the clie-ants to come and take one step into her web...all it takes is that first step....

The Anticult
a CD set arrived from the library...its a Hay House cross-marketing product with Wayne Dyer with Byron Katie.

The thing really is quite nauseating from the beginning, Wayne Dyer's voice is slick and like a sales professional.
Wayne Dyer opens by defending James Frey, and saying he called James Frey and told him he would publish any of his books after Oprah criticized James Frey for his printed and spoken lies.

(A Million Little Lies: Exposing James Frey's Fiction Addiction)

The message is clear, Wayne Dyer thinks is perfectly ok to fabricate and lie to sell books! One has to wonder why Wayne Dyer begins by defending the fabrications of James Frey?
How much has Wayne Dyer fabricated? Are his books also filled with similar fabrications?

Dyer then outs his own daughter for having a serious drug addiction for 10 years. What a great dad.
Why doesn't Wayne Dyer instead talk about the rumors about his own alleged addictions?

Making Your Thoughts Work For You 4-CD Live Lecture [AUDIOBOOK] [CD] (Audio CD)
by Wayne W. Dyer (Author), Byron Katie (Author)

Audio CD
Publisher: Hay House (March 1, 2007)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 1401911897
ISBN-13: 978-1401911898

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: helpme2times ()
Date: December 11, 2008 08:42AM

Hey there Dave, I also want to congratulate you on freeing yourself from the bonds of the BK system. I hope you will be able to ease yourself back into normalcy as quickly as possible.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: December 11, 2008 10:11PM

QDave, congratulations.

Right now you are feeling disgusted, but you know what? That disgust is the early recovery-room stage of GETTING YOUR OWN POWER BACK.

You have given yourself an winter holiday gift that will last you a lifetime.

And you are gonna make your own reality in a very basic way.

You are going to save your money and save your mental and emotional energy at a time in our history when we all have to be careful stewards of our minds----and our money.

Our economy is messed up and unpredictable.

You need your money far more than BK does.

Charity begins at home.


Anticult wrote:

Disgust is a primary emotion which drives us AWAY from things that are not good for us.

People will spend years and thousands of dollars rather than face the pain and disgust of waking up and feeling betrayed, feeling used.

Some will even come up with the most elaborate rhetoric to claim there is no such thing as being a victim and no such thing as being used, rather than face that life giving disgust of acknowledging they've been betrayed.

But the price of getting out the Matrix that initial feeling of disgust.

Most people would rather never, ever feel that disgust of waking up to and that is what keeps them in the Matrix.

And The Anticult is right about this disgust being a lifesaving matter.

Notice how often we get an aversion to any kind of food that we connect with an upset stomach? Thats biologically wired into us and cant be eradicated.

At most someone can screw with our neo cortex and temporarily con us into ignoring what our basic instincts are screaming to tell us, but eventually truth either comes into our awareness, or we act it out.

There's a huge New Age cottage industry based on exactly this kind of 'betrayal is just a story you tell yourself.' This is the real Matrix.

If you have decayed teeth you dont make the decay go away by refusing to get X rays and dental exams.

Eventually that tooth is going to blow up on you.

And BK cant keep her own teeth white by thinking good thoughts.

She has to go to a dental hygienist.

Her hair is going to keep growing even if she tells herself long hair is just a story to tell yourself.

She keeps her appointments at the hairdresser's, or her hair would be down past her shoulders.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: quackdave ()
Date: December 11, 2008 10:24PM

Thanks again, Anticult, helpme2times and everyone. I feel a little guilty accepting any congratulations at this point, although I am freer by the minute over the last few days. You see, I am over sixty years old and started VERY early with cults and scamsters. At nine years old I started my religious "alter calls" out of the fear that was injected into me by evangelists, found myself following a David Koresh type in the sixties, Maharishi's TM in the seventies, a martial arts cult in the eighties (this one was the most expensive--over $8,000.00), a follower of all the self help gurus, including Ron Hubbard, Tony Robbins, Guy Finley, Jonathan Parker and others (spending yet another tidy sum) in the nineties, and here I am in the new millenium barely escaping the BKI machine. So, actually, I have been preparing myself for BKI (doing it's bidding) all my life!

I write this in hopes that others might see that it's never too late! Now, I just need to keep from making you folks my new gurus, which is easy for a person like me who has thoroughly hypnotized himself for the better part of 60 years. Sad, but hopeful.

Keep up the great job! (yeah, it took me a minute avoiding the other words that might have been appropriate)

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: quackdave ()
Date: December 11, 2008 10:44PM

Wow! This is amazing. I sat around "recovery tables" for over a decade because I found a kinship to other addicted folks. This is more to the heart of the matter, though. It encourages me to see so many of you having escaped the whole BKI machine. I hope my story (yeah, I kinda like my story) will help to encourage others. ENCOURAGE...what a great word. To enable with courage; to counter fear. Yes, fear is what I feel now. Add to that the feeling that I'm adrift in space, without a paddle. I find that to be logical, though, given the circumstances. So I guess I'll learn to face it and not run; to continue to learn from it and about it. Thanks for your insights into what I reveal, as I type.

Thanks Anticult, for showing me the overlooked items in the WOTW disclaimer. I've, of course, deleted all the stuff and I'm sure it's all been backed up at their end. One bright spot in the 'policies' is that the writings are said to be property of only me and 'the counselor' and it points out that it will be illegal for it to be shared beyond that. So, if some "facilitator" or some such comes to me with ANYTHING regarding what I've deleted (luckily, nothing too Earth-shaking), I will be forced to tell them to 'turn around' and get the hell out of my face. (is getting a set of balls part of the recovery process?)

I hope the library has Sagan's book; it seems to be one of the next logical steps. Thanks for the info.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and Eckhart Tolle Legit??
Posted by: quackdave ()
Date: December 11, 2008 11:07PM

I like the statement about the value of disgust, in the healing/recovering/escaping process. Oddly, it was just my attempt at a joke at the time. I was referring back to ralpher (how it may have been the name of one of BK's pukers) and inferring that my WOTW had added me to the Pukers for Katie Club.

Anyhow, I guess that shows that our speech is loaded with gems to be looked at. I am glad for this forum and shall add my two cents periodically.

Please don't be offended if I haven't mentioned your nickname in my thanks; rest assured, I have been reading/re-reading and benefitting from this entire thread. Every one of you, especially the escapees, has helped me more than you might realize.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and deprogramming yourself online
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 12, 2008 08:13AM

hey Dave, I think that is the point of these kinds of online forums, people can think out loud, and deprogram themselves, and at the same time maybe others can read some of it, and it can help them too.
Most people who are into BK, have a string of dozens of other involvements over the years. So everyone is pretty much in the same boat.

The great thing, is that figuring out what someone like Byron Katie is doing, can then be applied to any other Guru of the day. Once a person can figure out how one works, then it becomes easier to see how the others do it. They really do use many of the exact same techniques.
So its learning that can be generalized.

Byron Katie is interesting, as there is very little critical analyses of her methods out there. Just professional blogs, shill blogs, and fansites.

On another note, I saw some BK text a while back, where she was talking about the economy and how some people had lost something like 75% of their money. Now, she was using this to say that its OK to lose not just 75%, but 100%. Not only is it ok, but she will try to teach people that it is WONDERUL to LOSE EVERYTHING.
Why would she, and others, do this?
Donations. Some people will literally "donate" everything they have to "the cause".
That actually happens, they will take every cent they have from their house and retirement, and zip, its all "given" away to groups like BKI, and others too. Hundreds of grand...gone.

All of these groups LOOK for people who have perhaps large pools of family money, and not as much common sense.
As the world and economy increase the fear in the public, groups like BKI generally do better, as people are looking for some escape.

As I said before, put Byron Katie in front of a room full of NLP persuasion and hypnosis experts, and she is literally powerless. Some would be amused by her methods, others horrified at how she is abusing those tools.
This is why her target audience are nice regular folks who have no training in what she is doing to them behind the flowery words of distraction.

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Re: Byron Katie (the Work) and the Life Coaching scam
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: December 13, 2008 08:58AM

by the way, why do so many people like Byron Katie & Co go into so-called Life Coaching, and so-called Spiritual Therapy?

Because its totally unregulated.
Its not like if you are an MD, or a licensed plumber, or even a licensed hot-dog vendor. In those cases you have people you have to report to and standards to follow.

But if you are a so-called Spiritual Life Coach, then you are completely unregulated, its the wild west of Life Coach snake oil salespeople.
One of the only recourses people have against you is civil law, and when you are as rich as Byron Katie and others, they can crush almost anyone.

This is why the "Life Coach" area has grown so fast.
They have no credentials, no accreditation. All they need is a phone, or a small office.
They can charge whatever they can get away with, its all persuasion. They can charge you $1,000 an hour if you will pay it. They can charge you 10x more than a brain surgeon if they feel like it.

This is why all unregulated Life Coaches, or anyone like this, needs to be completely avoided, in every case. You have no idea of what you are dealing with.
Byron Katie is unregulated, and unlicensed.

AND, she forces you to sign away all your rights if you get hurt by her processes or people.
For that reason alone, Byron Katie should be avoided by everyone.

This is why all the crooks, cons and cranks go into Life Coaching. Its the best way to make tons of money with no overhead, and no oversight or regulation.
When you buy a hotdog on the street, its 100x more regulated than Byron Katie splitting your psyche wide open and performing Soul Surgery on you.

One hopes people will learn to stay away from all of these unlicensed scammers like Byron Katie.
Its very dangerous for YOU, as she is protected by all those disclaimers.
Just try to get one person from BKI to sign anything before they "treat" you. They will throw you out the door.
But they make you sign these massive disclaimers.

That's all anyone needs to know.

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