Hi Sister CJ,

You requested that if anyone knows what 'happened in CA' to please post to the group. I live in California and WAS (formerly) a longtime and heavily involved member of Set Free. I personally knew "Pastor" Phil Aguilar (Geronimo Aguilar's dad) and Geronimo as well as their entire family and all the leadership. I am fairly well versed on the happenings at Set Free, past and present. I have shared some of these facts and recountings in this group and in the Set Free (Pastor Phil Aguilar) group. I've also posted links to other news stories and recountings. What specifically do you want to know. I'm more than happy to share anything that I personally can verify as factual and of my own or my friends' experiences in that corrupt church. As I've mentioned repeatedly I urge the members and community to carefully inspect the financial handlings of the Roc church and the practices, specifically with regard to the use of "the homes" as we not-so-affectionately called them here in California. I know that Geronimo has similar ranch-style homes there. On paper, those are supposed to be the cornerstone of their ministry. On paper, they are supposed to be used to help drug and alcohol addicts with a 'loving and Christian-based' environment to help them detox and come to God. That's all on paper though. I speak not only for the California branch of Set Free. I refer to the many Set Free branches found throughout the United States as all of the other Set Frees were off-shoots of Phil's and only started up by him personally 'ordaining' and approving someone to start a ministry elsewhere under his guidance and structure and practices. Thus, all branches of the tree were as poisoned as the roots in Anaheim, California. The reality was that these homes were more often used as isolated punishment for any 'backsliders.' These backsliders were usually deemed as such because they questioned leadership. What healthy church punishes a person for questioning? Even if the leadership were not corrupt what harm would be there in healthy questions? It keeps people honest, right? Also, with regard to the homes, let's not forget that the home leadership are never licensed counselors, psychologists, drug counselors, or anything of that sort. If you are familiar with addiction and recovery you know that there is ALWAYS possibility of both medical and mental issues and problems arising. If you have no trained and licensed medical/psychological staff present you are offering a recovery program with a ticking time bomb for a huge problem to arise. It's just a matter of time for something serious to happen.
As to the finances, here are some piece of information to ponder... Phil Aguilar (Set Free leader, and father to Geronimo Aguilar), who taught and continues to 'counsel' Geronimo on church leadership practices, and his family routinely drive around in tricked out Harleys, ESCALADES, BMW's and Benz'. His wife has had a breast augmentation in the last few years, and he (Phil) was recently able to post $50,000 bail to get himself out of jail. Now... that's just a small assortment of examples. There are many others. The point I'd urge you to ponder is how do he and his sons have THAT KIND OF MONEY if they haven't worked a day in any sort of job? Yes, they sell really troubling t-shirts and a few small items and cd's but by no means are they so popular do those sales have them rolling in the money. No, they are living off of the tithings of church members. Church members who live in a less-than-middle-class community. I don't expect a pastor to live in abject poverty but I'm offended when I see tithings and contributions having the pastor and his family rolling around like pimps.... and worse yet, getting the pastor out of jail $50,000 bail, for charges including ATTEMPTED MURDER of a Hell's ANGEL in a BAR. No, I'm no tee toteler. But what kind of pastor gets involved in bar brawls? Whatever happened to 'turn the other cheek'? Also, let's not forget that Geronimo should rightly have served jail time for his statutory rape of his now wife. He was 21 and she was FOURTEEN when he left his wife Stacee and his little children. And his sexual relationship with Sammy B started while he was still with Stacee and everyone close to the leadership and the 'posse' knew it. I'm not even going to start in on Phil's sexual dalliances with girls in the posse... or the abortion paid for by him for one of my then friends who was a dancer on the posse - with church funds, again. I could keep going and going. What specifically do you want to know?

I'd urge any members of the Roc to pay close attention to Geronimo's and his leadership's behavior when questioned. A healthy church group can field questions and accusations and readily be able to provide documentation or explanation without needing to get defensive or rally people around him to provide him with an impenetrable wall of anger. I hear that Geronimo is already starting to do that. There is no need for a pastor to urge people to be 'part of HIS 300.' We are already part of God's family and accepted and loved. The pastor of a church is merely another brother/sister in christ, that's it. I take my direction from God. I pray directly to him for guidance and understanding. I don't need to look to any other human being (flawed, by nature) to know what is right and wrong. God has provided me with every tool I need to understand his will and remains available to me to pray to him for understanding and peace about any decision in front of me. I love my brothers and sisters in the lord but that doesn't mean that we aren't able to still lovingly ask questions of each other, to help each other keep in check. All of us, me included, are flawed and fallible. I NEED my brothers and sisters in the lord to help keep me in line. I don't push them and accuse them if they question my actions. Please think about that. Watch behavior of the leadership. How do they react to questions? Are they trying to remain open and transparent? Are the policies and financial handling of the church open to all to know and question? That's how it should be. Jesus came to the Earth and urged us to ask questions of the religious leadership at the time. The lord would certainly want us to continue to help keep ourselves in check by thinking and questioning in order to avoid traps and corruption.

Dear freeatlast,
Thanks for your input, I still would like to know it the pastor of the Roc met his father in a park in CA where he was playing basketball, or he meet him in a little church all stung out on drugs and ready to take his life.
The book explains that He(his father) was told where his son was and the secretary of Set Free was being the go between the two. He lived with his Jews Grandparents after his Mother past away.He was of the age of 15 at the time, when they met so the book says.And not knowing the Lord at this time.
What do you know about his life after his Mother pasted away and how he met his father?
The testimony that is being told is do different ,then what the books says.This is what brings so many people to the Roc and the support of other Churches.
Have you read the book Christianitys Executioner?

Hey Sister,

Yeah, Geronimo and Phil both have told numerous stories about this. What you must realize is that they both are masters (Geronimo learned from his father) at self promotion and propaganda (shamelessly so). They want to weave stories that make sure people see them as having lived a truly hardened life and have come to Christ under the most outrageously amazing circumstances. In fact, Phil has, for years, painted himself as some former hardass, badass to all the bikers he loves to court (like he's a 16 year old girl with a crush!). The truth is that yes, he, Phil, was a heroin addict (briefly) and an alcoholic. The truth is also that he was in prison for child abuse charges... one of those being the naughty naughty kind, one of them being the downright aweful beating type of a wee little kid of his then girlfriend. He was more a weasely little addict, child-abusing butthead. In fact, his "jailhouse conversion" was probably the thing that saved his life in prison because cons don't take kindly to child abusers. If you keep in mind that of all the stories that Geronimo has given for his conversion and his meeting with his father... we may not necessarily have the REAL story in any of them... but the story that seemed most possible (when he was still back here in Anaheim, California) was that he finally was sought out by his dad (Phil). Yes, the people in the stories are correct (there was a secretary, Lois Trader and a right-hand-man named Ranch with Phil and Set Free at that time) but the whole "I walked into this stranger's church and SURPRISE he's my father" story was not a big one here so I don't believe it.

If you search the varied articles about Phil Aguilar, Set Free and Geronimo (with a G) Aguilar and the Roc as well as read "Churches That Abuse" by Ronald M. Enroth. He, along with PRC(?) group helped so many of us sort-of deprogram and carefully and clinically examine all of the doctrine that was taught to us from Set Free (and Phil) and to talk openly about the corrupt things happening with the leadership of the church that we experienced and saw. Those meetings, which went on for something like a couple of months, were so helpful...no, crucial, to recovery from the cult-like hold/practices and doctrines we'd been force fed from the church. It took me and many others some time to weed through all those experiences and doctrines to determine what of it had been God and what had been corrupt man. It took a much longer time to come to recognize (in that church, and in others) the practices and policies of cults and charismatic leader-led churches. Nowadays, I feel more equipped to recognize those early signs and typically have the strength to avoid them. I find my relationship with God is a more intimate (personal) one for me and I refused to allow my relationship with god be goalee'd by any individual. I now also shy away from strongly organized churches or organizations (lots of 'em). Ok, enough of the ranting....

Ok, so if you or anyone you know are members of the ROC please keep repeating and asking these questions:

1. How old was Sammy B and he when they started their affair while he was still married to Stacee in 1991? He was 21 and she was FOURTEEN! He's never seen a day in jail for that statutory rape!
2. Why would a pastor, called by God to minister to others, leave his young wife and children for a young girl and essentially abandon Stacee to 'The ranches' or work homes? Why wouldn't a pastor (struggling with his life like the rest of us) not go through counseling and try to work out the marriage? Is marriage not a Godly sanctioned union that should be approached with the mindset of people willing to struggle, strive toward and work together even during hardships?
3. What is a church doing with 'recovery homes' or 'discipleship homes' as they often like to call them without any licensed medical personnel or licensed psychological personnel? What if one single addict had some sort of breakdown, psychotic break, became violent or suicidal or had a major physical reaction to withdrawals? Someone could be harmed or even die.
4. What type of homes, cars and accessories (clothes, toys, etc) do the pastor (Geronimo) and other leaders in the church roll with? Are they expensive?
5. If so, are any of them gainfully employed and able to afford such expensive items while the remainder of the church body are lower and middle class and living month to month? (that was always true of our church, Set Free)
6. Is your pastor legally divorced from Stacee? Is he paying alimony and child support?
7. How are people treated in the church if they ask questions about the church and the leadership and the money? Are they rebuffed? Are they treated like 'backsliders' or 'Judas' or even ostracized from fellow friends and family in the church as punishment until they "Get right with God"? (That was my favorite one that Phil always used. He'd make it sound like he was a loving dude and cared for those who were currently 'struggling' and 'backsliding' and even encourage the congregation to pray for their backsliding/struggling brother or sister in the lord. What he was essentially doing, though, was outting someone and putting a flashlight on that person or persons to say "Hey, don't hang out with this person. They aren't with the program." Yeah, Phil loved saying "Get yourself right with God." and "Get with the Program" But those were always recriminations to get right with HIS (Phil's) agenda. Does Geronimo do similar things? Does he encourage this "300" soldiers and create a feeling of inclusion for those people who blindly follow his leadership and make others who 'aren't with the program' or who are 'not his 300' feel ostracized and like backsliders? That is a CLASSIC cult practice. Make people first feel like they are included into a special group. Make them feel part of the group and loved. That is how cults buy their support from people. It's easy. We ALL want to be included, we ALL want to be loved. We are human and need this. It is part of our DNA. Then, when we are supplicated and happy and complacently within the group cult leaders then feel free to continually get more and more relaxed in their outrageous demands or actions or words. When the first mumbles and grumblings arise against their behavior the cult leader starts to threaten the members' inclusion with the group. They ostracize them temporarily to make them again feel outside of a group and not accepted or loved. For most people that works. That makes them shut up and come back, tail between the legs, begging to be part of the group again. To rejoin the euphoria. If you get close enough to the leaders the thing you will find, and this was ALWAYS the case with SEt Free and Phil and Geronimo, that their sexual escapades were outrageous!

Phil slept with so many of the girls in the church it was ridiculous! He paid for the abortion of one of my friends, who was sleeping with him when she was only 19! Geronimo slept with the girls in "the posse" including and finally with Sammy B. I'd have a REALLY HARD TIME believing he isn't doing it still in Richmond. Watch who he hangs out with. How often is he alone with girls or women (don't pay attention to their ages or if they are married as that never bothered him or his dad).

Also, there was one night in Anaheim when we were told that one of our church's leadership o.d.'d in our chapel on Heroin.

Oh, I could go on but I have to sign off for the moment. so I'll continue in additional post with some more questions to examine at THE ROC.

Quote
sisterCJ
Dear freeatlast,
Thanks for your input, I still would like to know it the pastor of the Roc met his father in a park in CA where he was playing basketball, or he meet him in a little church all stung out on drugs and ready to take his life.
The book explains that He(his father) was told where his son was and the secretary of Set Free was being the go between the two. He lived with his Jews Grandparents after his Mother past away.He was of the age of 15 at the time, when they met so the book says.And not knowing the Lord at this time.
What do you know about his life after his Mother pasted away and how he met his father?
The testimony that is being told is do different ,then what the books says.This is what brings so many people to the Roc and the support of other Churches.
Have you read the book Christianitys Executioner?

The testimony that he stands up there and gives his church and other churches is false. He met his dad long before he was ever saved. This story was concocted because "it sold" as was stated by one in his leadership. It is sad the number of faithful people that are being deceived by this one lie, let alone all the others that are being told. The biggest lie of all is that people are led to believe that all they have to do is say a prayer and they are saved - there is no repenting, no mentoring, no really having a relationship with Christ. A sheperd misleading his flock.

Yes, the testimony is a lie, but that is only the beginning of all the lies and deceit. How sad it makes my heart to realize how deceived we were and how so many people are still being lied to and will be so hurt in the end. There are so many good people at the ROC who serve the Lord with all their heart and who love the people that they serve. Most of the people who attend the ROC know nothing of all the lies, sexual activity with minors, affairs in leaderhip, drugs, using ROC money GODS MONEY for ones own GAIN of material things, such as vehicles, trips, clothes and anything else that they
desire to purchase for themselves. I pray that anyone who reads this and knows the truth would leave a message on this board. We have a
responsibility to our brothers and sisters in Christ to share the TRUTH. I can not tell you how many times in the past I had to defend the
ROC when people would say that it was a cult. Thank you God for removing the blinders and showing me the truth. I pray that you would do
the same for all those at the ROC that are searching for the truth. Protect them and guide them in your ways. Protect all of the young people
who can so easily be drawn in and manipulated. Please protect them father!

If a man who calls himself a pastor, a man of God, would lie about how he came to know Christ, he would LIE about anything!

I completely agree with all the above. People may have a great desire to serve. The Word says my people perish for the lack of knowledge, everyone wants to serve but its not just about the serving. It's about the changing of our hearts and minds towards God. We allow this to happen with prayer and reading, and if people aren't reading and praying they don't know God at all. It is a heart condition that God has changed in our hearts to walk after him. Not just to read the Word and pray because I have to, but I have a full dependence on God and not myself.

I think the bottom of the problem lies in the fact that we don't truly believe the Word of God, we don't beleive that what he says is true and that he will judge us from his Word.

2 Thess 1:7-8 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Obeying the Gospel is believing Christ's Words. At the ROC many people who were once remarried are married again, but where in the Word does it state a believer can remarry. Now of course we can seperate, but not to remarry unless our spouse has died. Look for yourselves if God allows remarriage on any other instance. By the way, it is not called remarrigage but Adulterey. People read the Word about the qualifications of a bishop, pastor, elder, whatever you call it, we see that they should be above reproach and married to one wife. But yet there are people in many churches that do not feel these qualifications, so why do we let them in the podium?

PEOPLE DONT BELIEVE THE WORD, BECAUSE THEY HEAR MORE FROM THE PASTORS, MUSIC, BOOKS, T.V. THAN FROM GODS WORD ITSELF.

When are we going to open our eyes, our war is not just to expose the ROC. I am not exposing the ROC but rather standing for the truth. And when you stand for the truth, it will expose the darkness.
People are spending more time enjoying there lives, than giving them to God. We spend more time watching sports, T.V., movies, hobbies, shopping, rather than being in the presence of God. God has called us to give ourselves completely over to him but we dont.

1 Timothy 5:24 Some men's sins are open beforehand, going before to judgment; and some men they follow after(They remain hidden in their hearts until the judgement, They know of the sin but no one else does)

The ROC's sins are more obvious, but what about the ones in our hearts. The reason the ROC prevails, or even there Gospel prevails which is not of Jesus Christ, is for the fact that we have not stood for the truth. Neither has the churches. Everyone wants revival but we can't have revival, we can not have a change untill we begin to repent for our involvement. Repentance is not just understanding our conviction and feeling bad. But we turn from what we have done with a faith that responds towards our conviction. A faith that responds back to Christ, and of course laying in us a great Fear of the Lord that we hate the things that God hates, and love the things that God loves. When will we begin to hate sin so much that we will want nothing to do with it at all. When will the so called professed church not just repent of there sins but of their dead works. We must awaken.

Churches like the ROC will become more prevelant, and there doctrine already is, which I have seen in fundamental baptist, majority of the assemblies of God, I hear on all these Christian radio stations, you watch on T.V., see books about it in every Christian bookstore, really, it is the prominent doctrine believed by the majority of evangelical churches. We must began to examine these doctrines and see if they line up with the Word of God. We must look at the full counsel of God. Do we not believe when Christ says if we are luke warm he will spit us out of his mouth. So my warning is to examine our selves, as well on whether we truly believe the Word of God to be inspired and sufficient for every aspect of our daily walk, are we living with comprimising situations that would show us to be luke warm. Do we have a hatred for sin? Can we go before God with a clear conscience?

If we can't we must repent. I repent, for my war is not just with the ROC. But with all the workers of unrighteousness, against all False prophets and teachers, against all professed beleivers that live in hypocrisy and blasphemize the Great name of our Savior Jesus Christ.

May the grace of God abound in us that we will walk in truth, and hold fast towards our profession. I pray that we may lay hold on eternal life, and that we may make our election sure. I pray that we are awakened

Hi Sister CJ,

I've never read that book. I looked it up and didn't find a synopsis but gleaned from the comments the subject. As soon as I saw it was written by Lois, who I knew well, I was skeptical. You must know that Lois was Phil's bulldog. She was his staunchest supporter and often resorted to some angry, mean-spirited and cold-hearted attacks against those who came against Phil. She is educated and well-spoken and so often can make an incredibly convincing case for her arguments. The book doesn't seem to be on sale anymore but I'll look into finding a copy, if possible. But, my inclination is to believe that it would be in support of Phil and paint a skewed picture of him. If she truly found the light of truth she would write a tell-all confessional book including all of the dastardly things she did to protect him and his leadership from their own evil doings. Is that the case with this book? Because, from the comments on the book it doesn't seem to be the case. Please go through the main Rick Ross web site and do searched for Phil Aguilar and even Lois Trader. You'll easily find some of her nasty postings from years past directed at Rick himself. Now, I'm not supporting Rick. I don't know the man. But when I read her postings/letters I felt that maybe Rick was on to the right thing if she was against him. Remember that I mentioned several of us went through a sort of deprogramming? Coming from years of involvement with Set Free and being so thoroughly immersed in the lies I, and the others in the group, desperately needed it. We weren't poisoned against Set Free or Phil. It was more an open forum for us to honestly share our misgivings, our own experiences and things we knew were going on. We were given an open forum to discuss them, analyze them and ask critical questions from a biblical perspective. I feel that the meetings were blessedly free of anti-Phil or anti-Set Free dogma. If we had walked directly from our years of staunch support of Set Free into meetings which were openly anti-Set Free we would have walked right out. Rather, the meetings were merely an open forum to talk, think out loud and examine what happened. While involved in Set Free we were never allowed to do that. We weren't allowed to question the practices of the leadership. We would have been treated as backsliders and even ostracized from our friends.

So, until I read that book I'm highly skeptical that it paints an honest portrayal of Phil Aguilar or Set Free. I'd refer you to read "Churches that Abuse" by Enroth.

Here's another reference from a moderator about a Set Free conversation. In it, he includes an article that references the goings on, the counseling some of us went through, and even Lois: [forum.culteducation.com]

Here is a link to more articles about Set Free's shenanigans: [www.culteducation.com]

And, although this seems a digression from the main topic here (The ROC), it really isn't. To understand Geronimo Aguilar and The ROC you must first investigate his father's church and leadership. That is where Geronimo learned all his tricks. He learned how to spin a story that would sell him and his church activities well. He learned how to use church money to his personal use. He learned how easily the leadership can get away with drug use, sexually inappropriate behavior and activities. He learned first-hand that the entire church can be built on total corruption and still the large part of the members and the community would believe them to be godly and 'doing God's calling' and even staunchly support and defend them and their actions.

They provide entertainment and fun stories and constant and exciting activities so most people don't bother asking questions. They LOVE drug addicts and downtrodden types.... because they more than anyone know how to hide the truth and lie and get away with it.

I'd love to see more people from The ROC share here some specific stories of things currently or previously taking place at the ROC. It can be cathartic and healing to have such an open forum to discuss things you have seen or heard or know such as I did when I came to see the truth about Set Free.

By the way, if you search this site and more specifically find the "Wall of Flames" you can find this posting, made eons ago, by Lois Trader, Phil's ex-bulldog.

"Your categorization of Phil Aguilar was so slanderous and damaging that I have turned it over to our attorneys. I am the right hand/arm [of Phil Aguilar]--the famous Lois T.. I wrote a book [and] I can now add you. Wish I knew of you before--I would have dedicated a whole chapter to you. You sicken me. Don't bother to email me back unless it's to tell me you are deleting off your site anything concerning Phil Aguilar. Why don't you get a life. Who the h--l cares what Phil went to prison for--22 years ago. All you guys are the same. You probably sit home and play with yourselves while you talk and write about others." Note: Lois T. later left "Set Free" and renounced her one-time leader Phil Aguilar.

The lies are rampant through the church. Yes, there are good people there who love God and they are being deceived. Drugs are a normal part of life there - he chooses the downtrodden because they are duped into believing they have no place to go and they are used as free labor while the pockets of the leadership are being lined and stuffed. Fact: steriods were at one point being used and found at the Pastor's house, in his bedroom. This is not speculation, this is fact. Fact: his leadership is well aware of what is going on. You should hear him in deacon meetings and leadership meetings - he basically states that it is his church, he will do what he wants and if people don't like it, he will tell them the deacons okayed for him to purchase a particular thing, etc., I heard him do this on several ocassions. Fact: he once stated at a leadership meeting that he was being blackmailed by a certain person who had had an affair with his father and he was giving her 20,000 (out of his own pocket of course) He also constantly states in his "sermons" (which lately have been the best way to blast someone that has confronted him about the sin that is on-going) that if you don't like it, there's the door and there are 15 other people waiting to take your seat. People, wake up - let God remove the scales that cover your eyes - God calls us to remove ourselves from our brothers and sisters that are openly engaging in sin - read James. I'm sick with grief and sadness that people we care about don't see what is going on -

souzacircle:

Please don't offer sermons here about your beliefs.

It's against the rules you agreed to before posting here.

Please focus on ROC, which the subject of this thread.