An insight offered by an Amazon Books reviewer
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: February 02, 2015 02:03AM

.This was written by Jean-Paul Guignette, in a review
on Amazon Books -- the book Msr. Guignette refers to is the
memoir, Serpent Rising, by Mary Garden

Mary Garden remained for years with a horribly abusive guru
because he had seemed to trigger an ecstatic experience for
her early in the relationship and other ecstatic experiences
as well.

Msr. Guignette has encountered gurus and such experiences himself.

On page 233 she wrote "I vowed to myself that never again would I be dependent on anyone else's energy field, whether guru or teacher".

I found this statement about "energy fields" most interesting because I had a similar experience with a tantric guru who would "enslave" the disciple with psychic experiences.

Most fortunately in my case, I received strong warnings about such experiences prior to the meeting of this guru.

So I could manage to discriminate when most disciples were delighted and mesmerized by the unfolding of siddhis.

What is quite interesting is that others have attested
to these incidents.

In his memoir of the Sixties and Seventies, Rabbi Alan Lew*
told how many of his friends would go to gurus, see fabulous
visions, then because of the visions or ecstatic experiences,
then feel obligated to obey the guru, follow him for the
rest of their lives.

One such was guru Maharaj Ji. Lots of people reported
seeing a dazzling white light. Then, as Lew put it,
years later, some if lucky would realize that
just because one had some amazing experience didn't
mean it proved the guru had to be obeyed for ones lifetime.

We see a Fourth of July fireworks display.

Does that mean we worship the pyro technician for the rest of our lives?

Lets hope not.

One can do fireworks displays, do them well, and not be a nice person.

The experiences feel tenderly personal, meaningful, unique, seem
to prove something.

They do not.

Moods, however ecstatic cannot prove anything.


One thing learned on this message board and via the archives
of Cult Education and Mr Ross's new book is that there is no
shortage of gurus and workshop maestros who have the know how
needed to create stories, PR, spaces, crowd management, room
set up and additional methods that create surges and shifts
in brain chemistry that generate powerful emotional and
physical 'fireworks'.

This skill set doenst prove the person is wise, kind, or
at all interested in your well being, whether in this life
or in the next.

People slouching in subways, dark parking lots, nooks in clubs
selling ecstacy in powdered or chunk form -- that doenst
prove they are nice people, or wise people, or that they
love you.

Their chemicals diddle many of the same brain chemicals and
nerve bundles as are diddled via meditations and various
forms of guru-theatre.

In the case where guru centered practices are done in repetition
year after year, as is done in ngondro and the further
tantric practices in Vajrayana, where you have hundreds, thousands
of people doing these very same guru prescribed and guru
centered rituals and who then gather in
groups to venerate the guru in person --
the coordinated emotional focus must be
remarkably powerful.

But...its discipline. And in the end,
its not wisdom and compassion.

Its all about power.

Re: Tantra--Hindu, Himalayan Buddhist--problems
Posted by: chlew ()
Date: February 02, 2015 06:56PM

Hi, I'm researching the way cults change their members psychology in my EPQ, if anyone would feel comfortable answering 10 questions about their own/ someone they know's experience in a cult please fill out my survey: []. There is no registration required its free and everyone will be able to remain 100% anonymous. This would be so helpful to my research, thank you!!!

Re: Tantra--Hindu, Himalayan Buddhist--problems
Posted by: ultraspring ()
Date: February 28, 2015 03:39AM

Corboy, you make a good point. People should rely less on these "psychic" experiences and look closely into the lives of the people they are thinking of following. What are their true beliefs (ie how do they live vs what they say), are they compassionate toward others, selfless? Do they really want to help others without a desire to exploit, or are they driven by a lust for power, control, sex, money... which is what what we so often see.

Another situation in the news Shiva Yoga Australia
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: March 09, 2015 05:05AM

Swami Shankarananda


The claim of “tantric practices”


Possible earlier connection with Muktananda


Baba Muktananda had his own claim to fame


Muktananda also was friends with Werner Erhard, founder of est, now
known as Landmark Education.


Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2015 05:11AM by corboy.

Re: Tantra--Hindu, Himalayan Buddhist--problems
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: September 06, 2016 09:45PM

Re: Tantra--Hindu, Himalayan Buddhist--problems
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: November 28, 2016 10:21PM

If you are considering a Vajrayana tantric lineage, you owe it to yourself
to check whether the guru/rinpoche was ever a sanyassin with Rajneesh/Osho.


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