I didn't post them because there are some major differences in the steps of XA groups. For example, in AA step 1 is powerless to alcohol, whereas NA is powerless to our addiction. The difference between being powerless to a substance and powerless to a problem/spiritual/moral deficiency changes a core part of the program. RR, I have never seen your steps, even in AA literature. May
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

nami is the National Alliance on Mental Illnesses. When you hear recovery, they are referencing recovery from mental illness. They deal very little with addiction (only in terms of the duel diagnosed), but they are pro 12 steps. QuoteProviders should recognize that denial is an inherent part of the problem. Patients often do not have insight as to the seriousness and scope of the problem.
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

zeuszor, if ever possible, I would be very interested in hearing your story, names and places changed to protect the innocent of course. QuoteThat we should forgive and pray for the Duncans and Glenna Whitley for their misguided sensationalism. It is finished. That is what he said to the assembled Ole-ites at their last Big Group. Did Ole say "It is finished"? Could you elaborate as
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotebarabaraI was told the Big Book IS the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. Those aren't my interpretations, anyway; they are the writings of "agent orange". All of his quotes from the Big Book are verifiable. I have read them. We studied them in Big Book and 12 step study groups. ;) Maybe not too many people actually believe in the Big Book; in my experience quite a fe
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteupsidedownnewspaperQuotebarabaraQuote It's about predatorial people in society.. It isn't about having a discussion; It's about causing disruption to one, maybe because you don't like what's being said. It's about trying to kill a thread. It's about how much you enjoy baiting others here. Kind of like the way you baited Richard Green on another threa
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Thank you for taking the time to post all of this experience. I really appreciate it. I have had very little experience with LGATs and you were very helpful in putting me in the room.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I actually find Rebecca Moore and her website quite balanced.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuoteMcVeigh had called the National Alliance several times prior to the bombing. Quote 1995 Timothy McVeigh, aided by Army pal Terry Nichols, blows up the Oklahoma City federal building, killing 168 people. The day before, officials say, McVeigh called a National Alliance recorded message line seven times. As for your question if it is still around. Quote "It's on shaky ground
Forum: Hate Groups

Quotecounselor47Thank you for that feedback, dwest. I guess I did come off like I was flogging the book pretty hard. However, in my own defense let me say that we had to start our own publishing company in order to publish this book and sink our own money into it. We are still a long way from selling enough books to break even, much less get rich. That does not matter, because our real intere
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I also hope this doesn't turn you off to yoga. My step-mother had a horrible experience with SRF. She went in expecting yoga. I learned from her experience and researched and found a good, non cult, yoga program. I recommend you not return or have a friend meet you right afterward so you can prevent them from 'catching' you after class.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I have found this thread interesting. At first, I must admit I brushed off the original poster as someone just pushing his wife's book. Then when he said there was too much to share and I'd have to buy the book I really brushed him off. But after reading this article, and hearing her story, along with several others that corroborated her story, I am opening my eyes. It has been a g
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

QuotebarabaraI also feel that "rules" for meetings are not the answer. I think it needs to be made very, very clear to the newcomer that it is up to them to protect themselves, that there are no "gurus", (in the sense that no one can give you enlightenment), and that not every one in the rooms is compassionate, kind or trustworthy. The only problem is the sponsor is such an
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteupsidedownnewspaperControversial groups like Scientology and Landmark produce complaints only once a member is outside of the influence of the group. From my reading of this thread (I am only halfway through) it seems that the complaints arising from AA come from participants before, during and after participation in the group. That, to me, is what distinguishes AA from being destructi
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteHopeAlcoholism is not genetic in the sense that you have a gene that causes alcoholism. Alcoholism is a complex mix of nature and nurture. The reasons why people can "hold" their alcohol or not are just as complex, having to do with fat metabolim, insulin and a host of other factors. It cannot be prayed away either. It is genetic. QuoteMay 26, 2004 -- A new study links a g
Forum: Recovery from Destructive Cults and Groups

QuoteThen there was the fundamentalism of the "old-timers"; most old-timers would not agree to sponsor a newcomer, (whether the "old-timer" went to the Alano club or not), but they would "take your inventory" for you, and beat you with "the big book", and tell you to "fake it till you make it", and, (worst of all), tell you you "weren't
Forum: Recovery from Destructive Cults and Groups

QuotebarabaraI think the title "savage therapy" is quite apt. My relative, who feels that she suffered great mental anguish during AA "therapy" would love it. My heart goes out to your relative. Quote From what she told me, and from watching the changes she has gone through, AA taught her a lot, about herself and about others. She said that once she recovered from the ne
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

I have heard wonderful things about this while in production. Thank you for the heads up! It is not on DVD yet, but it has been shown at several major film festivals including Tribeca. According to the director, since PBS is involved, if its not picked up by theaters, PBS WILL release it next year. Tribeca Site Official website I love the first two lines at the official website "N
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

barabara, I will try to post more on this tomorrow. It is late and your post has set off a lot of harsh memories. It was always "my" fault. I had never worked the program well enough. I must have skipped something while doing my steps. Quote She said that once she recovered from the new wounds she received in AA she was a much better person. I believe it, I'm still recoveri
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteThat was always my biggest objection to AA dogma; being told we hadn't "worked our steps" whenever we questioned the program or the behavior of its members. That is why I first felt XA was cultish. I was told what and how to think. What and how to read. QuoteAlso, just look at all the anti-AA information I found out about because of your posts. I was completely unaware
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

I had one at a well respected physical therapy institute that tried to convert me to some form of 'cult' type of group. It was similar to a meditation cult (TM, SRF). I don't remember the name, but this woman did not last at the institute for long.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quote Have you considered that your ax to grind with AA is "alarmingly similar" to religious persecution? Where have I heard that thinking before? Oh yes, in terms of others that are involved in/defend 'cult-like' organizations. As I have said, I am religious so my problems with XA have nothing to do with that. My problems have to do with the fact the most recent studi
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

barabara, your post brought back many memories. QuoteSeveral children of AA members were physically abused. This was common knowledge among the club members, but no one did anything about it. I befriended the children, (and the parents), and tried to intervene on their behalf, but, once again, I had very little influence. I did not turn anyone in to child protective services. I was put
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteMillwallJamesI am writing this to maybe get some validation for my extreme distrust and anger toward Alcoholics Anonymous. I spent two years in this fellowship, and was told that if I did not doubt my own thinking, judgement, intuition, then I would die. Its as simple as that. I was told to embrace the programs belief system in meeting after meeting, over and over – its ‘this way or jails
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

QuoteColter Almost without fail those who are critical of AA's twelve steps are bitter people who never actually tried them so rather they concoct in their mind a thousand and one reasons why they don't need to do them. They make that which is good out to be evil and that which is evil out to be good. Self delusion is a common characteristic of those with addictive behavior. I will
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

I agree that one size fits all does not work. But bring up SOS or SMART in an AA/NA/Al-Anon meeting and all heck breaks loose. You get those looks at you like "poor newbie doesn't get it". Some members may outright tell you that they are giving up on you. It is very sad that the XA programs can not admit there are other 'truths' out there, and that people are differe
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Elaine, here is one place to start:
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I had a family member who was ordered to AA by a judge. Not NA, but AA even though the problem was prescription drugs. What a waste of everyones time. There was no other option. They also had been given time served so it was not a question of AA or jail. I attended meetings with this person. They were told, in slogans, to shut up, to fake it til they made it (ie, keep going until you believ
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Could you pm me on how you did that? I am getting a debug error if I give it from a weblink, and a not valid .jpg .gif .png error, even after converting the file by hand in Paint Shop Pro. And yes, it is the correct size.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

If you are looking for an alternative to AA, I also recommend SMART. Its not so rabid anti-AA as RR has become, and it also focuses on CBT.
Forum: Clergy and Therapy Abuse

Wow, this brings back memories. My family was one in which religion was taught in the home, and education was very important. If I went to a school that was not my religion but the education was excellent, then we would discuss the religion portion after dinner. I was exposed to many wonderful religions this way, and a couple weird ones as well. In the early 1980s I was exposed to PACE. M
Forum: Destructive Churches