QuoteelenaHi skeptic, <snip> Also, in a free society people are free to make mistakes. And there will always be those who hide inside "freedoms" to practice their nefarious deeds; as the Co$ uses the First Amendment as both weapon and shield. Ellen Well done!! I might add that calls for legislation, while the intent I understand is good, may do more harm t
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteDynamixLet me clarify my previous statement: None of us have actually , so it's impossible to say if it is manipulative and controlling without either participating in the course ourselves, or closely monitoring a participant of the course from a 3rd person perspective. I'd feel more comfortable with the second option, as I am certain that no one is immune to manipulation of
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteAcid ReindeerQuoteMarkusWelchCan you not see then a contradiction with your previous statement: "Yeah you're right. None of us have actually been, so it's impossible to say if it is manipulative and controlling." please don't put words in my mouth. Fair enough.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteAcid ReindeerQuoteMarkusWelchDoes one need to experience the event as a participant in order to properly criticize it? The logic you are using here, Acid Reindeer, is that the entire event is new to one's experience and cannot be criticized by someone who has not participated. not really. just asking you all, if you would, to hold out for more evidence to support your conclusions bef
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteAcid ReindeerCaligari, though you keep harping on this damage or whatever that could happen, like I said, possibility does not equal certainty. if you looked into the folkways of any culture on Earth you will find losing identity as a central human experience. you will a lot more freaky business than Cuddle Party on this planet of ours. try ritualistic scarification ceremonies, group sex, Ap
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuotecaligariQuoteelenaQuotecaligari I read "Outrageous Betrayal" by Pressman about four years ago. While it he did interviews and based information on that (or claims to since no references are provided), much of it is speculative. One example, is Pressman imagines Jack Rosenbergs thoughts while he's on a plane leaving Philadelphia. I find no basis for this passage of "
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotewarytraveller2What point are you trying to make Markus? Just say it, it shouldn't be hard. I am making multiple points. Nothing is difficult about it for me. Quotewarytraveller2 You wrote: "You are still missing my points. Any system would be better than communism for you, but would be perfect for someone else?" Who said anything about perfection? But there ar
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotewarytraveller2Markus wrote: “But that was not my complete thought, and it is not even a good strawman. Did you read my entire post? Are there better forms of government than communism? “ Sorry, I thought you were being ironic. To answer your question about communism, almost any would be better for me. But are you implying that if you think something is better than something else that
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotewarytraveller2Markus wrote: "For example, communism may just be bad, lacking a good side, especially for those who think there are better forms of government" Exactly her point. If you view things as simply black or white there can not be any shades of gray. Let's make it contempory. But that was not my complete thought, and it is not even a good strawman. Did you re
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Ana, Your remarks for and against Landmark are noted but have you considered that putting a positive spin (forgive the wording) on Landmark or communism may not be the best course of action? This is much different than being an optimist or using "positive thinking" techniques. For example, communism may just be bad, lacking a good side, especially for those who think there are bett
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteOriginally posted by corboy Out of consideration for members who have privately communicated their concerns to me, I will no longer permit further posts to go through that continue this pattern of name calling. I will keep the offensive posts queued and refer them to Rick for his consideration. Helpful posts will go through. If anyone disapproves of this, they are welcome to discuss the
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteOriginally posted by corboy this site exists as an archive, a salon, and above all, a sanctuary for persons who have had painful experiences with LGATs and who feel they have been harmed, or that one of their loved ones has been harmed. Agreed. Quote Calling people names is not helpful, and does nothing to remedy the problem. It only makes new visitors feel unwelcome, and we dont wan
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quoteliz yes the seminarr business is unregulated but no one is holdng a gun to anyoneshead to make them become an unpaid staffer/slave.. In the case of my husband that was volunteering until woke up, I think it made him feel important to be a part of something- until he eventually realized that he was being abused and also realized all of his long /hard hours were
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Jack, What are you defending? Yourself? That is great!! I applaud it. But if you are defending your participation, well that is another story, particularly if it is because of participation!! It is easy to separate them, try it. :) Regards, Markus QuoteJackSF Markus, As best I can understand your argument, you are saying that because I've done Landmark I am now prog
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Jack, 1. You claim you dissent and you participate which amounts to what? No Jack, not on your terms...their terms. What does it amount to on their terms? We can talk about your terms too, but recognize that this is not the point of the question, or the majority of the comments/questions directed to you. 2. Re-read some of the comments you quoted here (below) as something other than an
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

<Snipped> Quote Is dissent possible in this forum? Or must it always be met with derision and ad hominem attacks such as the above? Jack, First, what makes you think you are dissenting? Lack of your identification of the concepts involved does not equal dissent. Have you dismissed the fact that you are spending *your* money, yet again, to determine if something is *worth
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

QuoteJackSF It's nice to see that the threads I started here are still pretty active. After being attacked on this board and on a Landmark board for not getting with the respective programs of either vilifying Landmark or supporting it, I took a break. Then I talked to my friend whose example led me to consider the Forum. She said that if I was concerned that Landmark was a cult, then t
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Hope, You come to one of the conclusions I have think. If they can be proven in court to be practicing psychology, no matter the degree, w/o a license, perhaps this is the avenue. In fact one question to ask future and past participants is obvious along those lines considering the psych waiver. But this would place emphasis on the current laws and what is known about this type of psycho
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

RTF, New legislation is not the answer in consideration that cultic manipulation is not a violation of rights, meaning life, liberty and happiness. What is needed is education on the nature of cults, which also is not a right. The reasons why cults are profitable are knowable...otherwise they would not engage in the activity. There is no way to force this type of knowledge. People must
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Ellen posted previously: Snipped..... "the sociopaths are often in charge because it is those qualities of ruthless self-advancement and entitlement that get those smart enough to operate within the law to the positions of wealth and power." Ellen, The law may be the issue, not men, and not nature. Understood? Regards, MarkusW
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Quotekico Everyone, I copied my last post here to corboy's new thread on Enlightenment vs. Depersonalisation where I hope we can comtinue this discussion. I saw a great BBC Horizon documentary this week (about the nature of 'reality') which I will post about on the new thread, which postulates a new mathematical theory that we might all be living in a virtual world created by
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

"The Dragons of Eden" I'd suggest as well. Regards, MarkusW
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Jack, They *got* your money, again...... Shine without involving fraud. It is possible. No course required. No justification required. No cult required. Stop with the silencing.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

There is no cult question. Perhaps you do not know what a cult is. THAT is the ignorance LEC uses. And once you have been scrubbed...good luck finding the definition of cult again unless it all collapses for you. Not the way most psychologists would suggest exiting a manipulative org, i'd think. And forget your contradiction bullshit Jack. That is where cog dissonance starts. If you
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

They're human. If they see life as looking for meaning, they will look for it. I hope they find it. Maybe it's the "thing" to do.
Forum: Celebrities associated with "cult-like" groups