While I, perhaps, should have used the word 'pitious' to describe the YEARS of pleas for help related to Tony Robbins programs,'pitiful' also connotes, worthy of pity. I WAS NOT DEMEANING ANYONE. I investigated the Tony Robbins' organization and talked to survivors and whistleblowers. Based on what they told me, it seems that Robbins should have been the subject o
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Oh yeh, I would add constant, and gratuitous lying to list of behaviors I have seen. I think most humans fib from time to time, and usually to spare someone else's feelings. These people will lie about the weather, will declare that day is night, and the reverse. And, there is constant prevarication about backgrounds, and credentials...usually, a professional bio BEGINS with their b
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

and, see my post, here: I don't know about most people, but I found an evening of watching a child with taped breasts, robotically playing classical music, whilst recieving channelled messages from the beyond through a purple plastic tube, more than a little unsettling. But this was 'entertainment' for my newly-minted 'coach' friend. Here she is: The aud
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I meant what I said, how I described your post, from a complete position of empathy. Me, I have looked at a lot of these posts, and they break my heart, as does what I have seen this 'entity' do in my own community. Also, I know that sticking your head UP and saying something about it just activates the robots. I was actually put 'in touch' with a researcher to help me
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

and/or adults reduced to infantile states by these 'programs'. "To tell you the truth, I always realized Werner was the source of est and thought we just came along with the furniture, you know. “We got to look at what we all brought with us that was actually a part of the integrity of est. You see, without the part that Laurel represents, and without the part the Elaine repr
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Hi Corboy, 'Gangreen' isn't for everyone, either. I went over to Tony Robbins' land, in the CEI forum, and counted 336 posts on (1) thread related to this psychopath. The date of the first post of urgent concern is "2004"....and, the most recent 2019. That is 15 years of shit-baggery. The LEC record is, of course, much more copious. Having attempted the
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

SpeakingUp Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Friends who have done Landmark use terminology and > words that are unrecognised in a normal > conversation. > > They're almost robotic and have no real > personality. I noticed any questions against > landmark or challenging Landmark have a cookie > cutter response. > > It
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I don't understand WHAT is my "conspiracy theory". Can you please explain.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

It occurred to me that for whatever 'woo' is contained in est/Landmark's training/coaching programs, the over-arching programming is pure Kurt Lewin. UNFREEZE -- assail the participant's identity and perceptual frameworks with social constructivist 'woo'(we create our own stories, realities), and further batter with "attack therapy" (the gestalt dimensio
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

And, may I say a little more on the 'technologies'... I joined the world of people and organization development because I wanted to participate in a field that required continuous learning on my part. To my mind, every client and every organization is a 'new' universe, and there is also the dimension of time -- changing economic, political, social conditions. I am ver
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Thank you, EGOLDSTEIN, I remember reference to this fellow in a certain dissertation. I will be categorizing Dr. Fowler as an aider and abettor. This is a long list, as you know, and they do have blood on their hands, and especially so if they lent their brand to Erhard, et al, to provide credence to est/Landmark. I watched, the other day, a 1981 documentary of Erhard/est in which a
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

You wrote in your Reddit post: "While many of the groups mentioned above may or may not meet the standards of "cult" definition suggested in Hassan's BITE Model (as reprinted here), it seems to me that every one of them does meet the standards laid out by Daniel "Emotional Intelligence" Goleman." Could you please explain how you think the "standards l
Forum: Hate Groups

The document I posted was a 'DECLASSIFIED' U.S. State Department: TRANSCRIPT OF THAT PART OF THE NOON PRESS BRIEFING DEALING WITH GUYANA, WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 29, 1978 Date: 1978 November 30, 00:00 (Thursday) Canonical ID: 1978STATE302484_d Original Classification: UNCLASSIFIED I will locate another source for the document. While we are on the topic of "conspiracy
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Interesting find! The 'rationalization' factor in 'est' and other LGAT's is WHY I am following the Epstein matter and following it as a hybrid form of group dynamics training. With Epstein, we have the multi-level marketing dimension, with a female 'coach' training the girls to recruit their counterparts. There is also the steady dehumanization of existin
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Thanks for the link...very interesting. I would simply offer that I don't see money as being the primary driver for at least some of the LGAT's; or, to be more specific, money may be the driver for lower-echelon members but the higher-ups are up to something else entirely. On Icke, I had seen his televised professions of 'god-hood', and consider him a broken clock who ha
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Also, and in re your Kool Aid reference, I spent my weekend reviewing many, many, many accounts of that Kool Aid-drinking event, and it sure seems like not more than a few of the victims actually "drank the Kool Aid". I mean there are about 50 books published on Jonestown, and not more than a few cleave to the official story, which, frankly, makes not a lot of sense. I am thinkin
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

This is very interesting, thank you for the link. Of late, I have come to view the term, "X + leadership", or "leadership + X" as potentially coded language. How is that for paranoia!?! There is, to be sure, a field called Leadership Studies, and some really good work has been done, but this is a complex topic, and especially complex when one discusses or trains '
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

I really like your question regarding ACE, IQ, mental health issues, autism spectrum, and CULT recruitment. I will look into whether any work has been done in this area. While not an LF, or LEC survivor, I have been exposed to plenty of these tactics in the context of 'coaching' conferences, which honestly go on for days and days, and incorporate some elements of LGAT. I would as
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Request for clarification: When you said, "If you know of any work of this kind or of other people involved in a similar endeavour in an academic context, please let me know.I would be particularly interested in work related to the new 'ontological leadeship' training developed by Erhard." do you mean work/research/programs that are similar to Erhard's "Ont
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Yep, yep, yep, that is just the sort of driver I was suggesting. Utopian movements, or organizations with stated utopian goals happily use any strategy and means thought necessary to achieve, well, and muhaha, global transformation/control. So, we might see all kinds of M.O.'s in play: MLM, clickbait farms, the production of elegant but 'fake' research papers -- a hook for
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

This topic will focus on the lastest Landmark iteration and its academic, and institutional enablers. Details to follow in coming posts. Bakkagirl
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

"Additionally, I think that to focus on Erhard in all of this is akin to focusing on Jim Jones, or Koresh, or Raniere, as the prime movers in various cult debacles. In all cases, there are many, many enablers, and enablers are different than KoolAid-drinking dupes." The thing we need to remember is that people are in this to make a lot money, Both the figureheads and their entou
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Additionally, I think that to focus on Erhard in all of this is akin to focusing on Jim Jones, or Koresh, or Raniere, as the prime movers in various cult debacles. In all cases, there are many, many enablers, and enablers are different than KoolAid-drinking dupes. In Erhard's case, the enablers have Ph.D's, JD's, cash, and lot's of resources. Important to look at
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Beyond the Harvard case study dispute you mention, those, and other institutions have hosted Erhard as a speaker and provided Landmark with laboratory and other resources for 'research'. He/Landmark have used these brands to enhance credibility and still do. Agree with you on the heroin/meth analogy.
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

and, the media... Which takes me back to my "Drinking the Kool-Aid" post, BECAUSE, point of fact, these shit-bag cults would die a natural death were it not for 'sponsorship'. I would suggest that Landmark would have died a natural death upon the OUTING by 60 Minutes, and quite a few other concerned journalistic bodies of the time, of its founder; his character and habit
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Well, quite a lot has been written about Landmark's 'blame the victim' culture. Seems that this might be a perverse expression of its foundational denial of 'victimhood'. Really, I am much more interested in the 'technology' of these organizations than in the personality of their founder's, BUT IN THIS CASE, we have a classic abuser of wives, children
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

kdag wrote: "I wonder how many people stick around at this point hoping to do some type of "damage control," or even hoping against hope that, if they can figure out what these people want, the damage was either not real, or could somehow be undone/reversed. I think that's what I was hoping. And the cognitive dissonance at this point was so bad, that I truly did not believe
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Your likening of the psychology of domestic abuse and LGAT abuse makes sense to me in so far as: 1) abusive spouses tend to impose new, and tyrannical sets of rules on their victims -- the walking on eggshells thing; 2) abusive spouses gaslight their victims to the extent that they doubt their own feelings and judgment; 3) the psychic glue in both dynamics might be love-bombing, or simply th
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

"And the Sociopaths are the criminals running it." I would amend "it" to "them". Bakkagirl
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Dear Jkall, It would seem that there is a small army of mothers out there with your same concern. My query above is directed at people who have approached various resources for help with concerns about LGATs. I have raised this question based on my own experience of attempting to 'get help' from folks in psychological services, legal services, citizen action groups, and/or to jus
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"