The aura and function of charisma is that it dictate we put all of our spiritual eggs in one basket. What happens when that basket is moldy, cracked, and full of holes, but still looks good from some angles? The personality Adept at wielding charismatic power is always going to try to show the nicer side of the basket. The Hallmark of humilty would dictate that they show us the whole damn basket,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The mantras are described as all powerful, there should be little to few excuses for them to work or not. In other words, intent, mood, etc, are shown in many vedic stories to have no influence over the mantras efficacy. Yet we are told thier effect is hinged upon just about every rule under the sun. Just like butler will not eat a meal unless 8 pages of rules are followed. It negates the so call
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

In my own situation I was very fearful initially to speak out against this group/butler. It was not till I started to study vaishnava history, mythology and had been through similar group dynamics in other groups that I started to gain some courage. My childhood was lost and I felt a deep anxiety about what I had gone through. Once this forum, and various other blogs came around mirroring my expe
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The process of initiation is they're to create hierarchy and Status. No matter how you slice it, the most unqualified people have more status within the group if they are initiated. This done creates a sense of tension. As there are many non- initiated folks who are 1000 fold more committed in various aspects of the mission then certain initiated disciples are. Butler went through many phase
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

That about sums it up Vox. It's missing the stuff about the PI schools or even his time in the PI and attempts at starting groups/centers/followings in Poland, Russia, NZ etc. The man has lived in beachfront homes paid for by his devotees for over 40 years. It's really incredible. I think it makes sense that there was a steady evolution of this character named Siddhaswarupanan
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Cognitive dissonance
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Classic. Control over even the acts giving prashadam and the name gets blasted for not being a bonafide activity because someone on the fringe of the group has not given approval. Everything has to be done in some abstract specific way to appease the guru's taste and style. There is no independence and personal relationship with god. It's all through the conduit of the guru who is himse
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Discipline and chastisement are one thing for a child—these disciples are all grown adults. Not even a full-scale restaurant has this many rules to follow. This controlling list gives too many opportunities for butler to "chastise". When there is this many rules and restrictions a person cannot even fathom and have faith in their own brain to make decisions. You are inadvertently settin
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Not sure if you guys saw these lecture transcripts and kitchen policy files of butlers. Astounding obsession. We listened to this and MANY more lectures as young kids. Devotees laughed as Butler cracked "fag" jokes and spent an inordinate amount of time expressing his hate for homosexuals. Also, his ridiculous kitchen policies wherein he is micromanaging people like slaves and literally
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

And for the record DeWatcher, detest/disdain/contempt—they all mean the same thing. And faggot has not referred to a bundle of twigs singe at least the 60s. Homosexuality was considered a mental disorder in America well into the 80s. The fact is Butler has some odd fixation with homosexuality. It literally eats at him and scares and bothers him immensely. He detests it, has disdain and contempt t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Gaudiya Vaishnavism has nothing to do with generating homosexual hate. A Gaudiya guru has no reason to spend any time discussing sex life, let alone with such vulgar language and description and to kids. Gaudiya Vaishnavism is a spiritual practice that forbids sex unless it be for creating more little Krishna kids. That's it. Butler used a lot of energy to create hate towards a group of peop
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The damage definitely last a lifetime. It's completely reconfigures your brain and how you relate to the world, your family and friends and other personal relationships. The philosophy, mythology, rituals and other practices create and isolated state where you're only source of comfort Independence comes from Butler. And when you cannot have access to your teacher you're left to fe
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Moral of the story: When you see a video of a guy walking down some beach with his beads—run the other way.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Always ready to dramatize and drum up how "happy" the next SIF guru is as he drags his japa mala along the ground... Throwing happiness to the wind, Balakiya explains why he was so happy before he ever met Butler and how he got an ounce more happier after hearing his gurus amazing rants and raves: It must help ones happiness meter when you never had to work and could just stroll
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Courtesy of Blue River productions: Making your happy guru, even happier...
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

By the way, please feel free to write me in Polish on the direct message so that we don't bog this form down worth things that or not relevant to the discussion or in a different language and so forth. Happy holidays and all the best.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Hi DaWatcher— I understand your points. I may take the time to translate it all if there is some interest from others besides ourselves discussing all this in a vacuum at this stage. The topic of Manu Smahita being preached or even highlighted in some way by a gudiya Vaishnava is, in my opinion, very similar to the whole Yoga Nidra thing happening in SIF. It has not context and religion place
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Present...
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Must be some mindfulness technique she's practicing. Being present is very zen of her. LOL.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Hi DaWatcher: I appreciate your reply. I am not sure if it is a confusion on my part or a language barrier, but I have a very difficult time following your wording and writing style. It's just hard for me to follow the points you are making. I am not sure if polish is your first language, but please do feel free to post in Polish. I can read in Polish and we can use good translate if it i
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Yeah I liked Mantra Electric too, but for lack of being allowed to listen to anything else. This whole yoga Nidra things is funny in that the inventor was accused of sexual misconduct. I never understood why these groups continue to promote the work of these less savory characters. Just drop it like a bad habit and move on. The guy was obviously a fraud.It only puts a bad light on your cult if
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

They probably feel that the Yoga Nidra practice is purified by dovetailing it with Mantra meditation. This is the general justification for a lot of concessions the Cult makes regarding core traditions. If you Dovetail with service to Guru and Krishna its Justified and purified.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

DaWatcher: I just left a post on the link you gave to the SIF wisdom.yoga site. I am sure we can all attempt a nice effort to spread the joy of the season by posting on these various sites to wake up some spirit souls! Jiv Jago! Jiv Jago: There is no rigorous scientific proof that mediation or yoga Nidra will give you any more rest and recovery than getting 7-8 hours of rest. Power down the
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Butler could not care less as long as the check comes in to cover the monthly cost of tin foil.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I see, thanks for the post DaWatcher. It does seem they push some heavy Yoga Nidra stuff. That's classic. I wonder how far back that started. My hunch is they are getting some major money from some donors in those Yoga Nidra groups and that was part of the deal...
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

I am sorry if my opinions have I offended anyone and it is not my intention to disturb your faith. It is my hope that my personal testimony and opinions regarding this cult can act in support of those who are looking to get out of the mess they find themselves in and do so with a clear and confident conscience. I want such Seekers to feel supported in their feelings and not confused and made to f
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Dudley: I think it's going to be expected that there are going to be vocal opponents of the cult at hand on a cult forum don't you? I know that you are trying to create a separate entity out of Chris Butler in terms of his position and place vaishnava history, but his is very much a reflection of the cult in its entirety. The fact of the matter is is that he is part of the WEA as ar
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The moral of the story is I don't think anyone has been selling apple pie from the beginning.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

DeWstcher: I understand your argument about authenticity in the practices of the tradition of godia vaishnavism. However, as I pointed out before, this is not a new thing in gaudia vaishnavim. The fact of the matter is is that even the adoption of the Sacred thread by siddhanta Saraswati was a made-up practice meant to appeal to the Brahmin community and to gain more followers. Never in the hi
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

For the hundredth time guys: YES. TULSI WENT TO THE SIF SCHOOL FOR GIRLS IN THE PI. HER FATHER ALSO RAN GURU-KULAS IN SAMOA AND OTHER DEVOTEES HAVE ATTEMPTED TO OPERATE SCHOOLS FOR KIDS FOR BUTLER. TO THIS DAY SCHOOLS FOR KIDS OPERATE IN THE PI FOR SIF. MADANA MOHANA ACADEMY IS ONE SUCH SCHOOL. Tulsi's father, Mike Gabbard AKA Krishna Katha Das was a secretary of Butler's and also he
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"