erner Erhard sponsored visits to the United States by two gurus: Baba Muktananda was recorded as visiting two Tibetan gurus, the XIV Karmapa and Chogyam Trungpa. We learned that Muktananda incorporated est methods into his Siddha Yoga intensives. Gurumayi, Muktananda's successor also uses this stuff. Former Muktananda disciples described this stuff in a listser
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

For persons who want to investigate possible borrowings from Werner Erhard's methods and then applied to Tibetan/Vajrayana Buddhism, here are some places to start. Think this is unlikely? Maybe it the Tibetans did not borrow anything from Werner Erhard. But...Swami Muktananda did borrow from Werner Erhard. Remember, Werner visited Muktananda in India and then helped the guru get to
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

In the first couple of of years after Werner Erhard created est, he met the Karmapa in India -- and sponsored the Karmapa's first visit to the United States. During this visit to India, Werner Erhard also visited Swami Muktananda at Ganeshpuri and also helped M come to the United States. M incorporated Erhard's est methodology in the Siddha Yoga Intensives.(Corboy) . The Enc
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

There are set ups that TRAIN their disciples to anticipate every possible objection you have and desensitize themselves to you. Here is one example that someone did learn about. Disciples of gurus may possibly be taught to pretend to listen to your concerns while silently chanting mantras. Perhaps they are trained to chant mantras if they hear anything from you that comes across as sk
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Baba Muktananda also concealed his tantric background. An article about Muktananda's Kashmiri Shaivite background by Sarah Caldwell. Muktananda was close friends with Werner Erhard, founder of Erhard Seminar Trainings, currently known as Landmark Education. Those who were involved with Muktananda and who later left, reported that Muk incorporated Large Group Awareness Train
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Traumatic Abuse in Cults: A Psychoanalytic Perspective Small excerpt QuoteIn this volume, Traumatic Narcissism: Relational Systems of Subjugation, Daniel Shaw presents a way of understanding the traumatic impact of narcissism as it is engendered developmentally, and as it is enacted relationally. Focusing on the dynamics of narcissism in interpersonal relations, Shaw describes the relati
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Swami Shankarananda The claim of “tantric practices” Possible earlier connection with Muktananda Baba Muktananda had his own claim to fame Muktananda also was friends with Werner Erhard, founder of est, now known as Landmark Education.
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Even in the 1970s some strange alliances were being forged between one of the most important innovators in mind bending tech (Werner Erhard) and the 16th Karmapa and Baba Muktananda. Werner Erhard, creator of EST (Erhard Seminars Training later renamed The Forum and now named Landmark Education) Both Est and Landmark have ample citations in the Ross Institute Archives. (See below) Inter
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

For those who want to discuss the systemic problems some see as integral with vajrayana and tantra there are two threads where this can be discussed without risk of distracting from the specifics of Diamond Way and Ole N. I should have remembered this earlier. My apologies for sidetracking the discussioin away from Ole N and Diamond Way. The other discussion venues: 1) Hindu and Buddhist
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

There are standard methods of inducing sublime experiences, even ecstacies that feel personal intimate and private for the person to whom such methods are applied. They will feel and be encouraged by the others to feel that the ecstatic experience proves the value and truth of whatever belief system is taught. And..they will often unconsciously believe that the group has ownership of this e
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

We have a stunning capacity for ecstacy within us. Tiny children have expecially close access to this, and trance can return us right to the psychological terrain of early childhood. The trappings of Hindu ritual combined with the very powerful methods Werner Erhard taught to Muktananda would unleash quite a charge. Doing this in a group setting would magnify it even further. So to leave SY
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Found this paper, all of which is well worth reading. Over the years, many former members of Siddha and SYDA yoga have written with deep emotion how they came to recognize how abusive the organization was, that they knew in looking back that they had made the right decision to leave. But despite this conscious recognition, many spoke of the bliss they had felt not once, but many times,
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Buddhism, Hinduism as Fig Leaves to Conceal Trance Methods and Large Group Tech This was posted on a discussion of a group called Sokka Gokkai, but is universally applicable. Written by The Anticult on March 15, 2012 04:29AM Quotethat's why its helpful to research and study (from a skeptical cultic viewpoint) all sorts of different cults and sects. At first, it seems overwhelmin
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Concerning Naked Yoga...another venture offered this. Read here. Now, to the matter of secrecy in Muktananda and Gurumayi's Siddha Yoga and SYDA Yoga respectively. Sarah Caldwell, a former devotee of Siddha Yoga, wrote an article entitled The Heart of the Secret, well worth reading. QuoteThe seeds Baba (Muktananda) planted have not withered away, however. Today,nearly twenty years a
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

For readers who are interested in the Werner Erhard 'tech' utilized by Muktananda and his successors in SY, you can read here exactly how it was done. Guy was heavily involved and had it on his conscience what he had done to people. gc4062 was one of our correspondants Manipulating the room set up..a key ingredient of how these large group formats operate. L
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Analysis by Former Devotee of Why Bliss Addiction Yoga Fails Us If Siddha Yoga taught me anything important, it’s that my own experience of life still matters and guides me. Yet, ironically, this is exactly where Siddha Yoga failed, and was bound to fail. I could never see this at the time—during my 20 year hiatus from real life, because I was too addicted to the panacea dour jour—the “perfect
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

"With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility" QuoteYet, “with great power comes great responsibility.” And if one is using one’s good name in any field to give credibility to others, one has a grave responsibility to ensure that the latter are actually some semblance of what they claim to be. Yet, one struggles to find any comprehension of that fact among Wilber and the rest of t
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This article was printed in Yoga Journal in 1985 Three pages. A classic on how the 'trust your experience' was the mantra, even back then. None of the three--the two women apologists/spin doctors and the interviewer--were aware that experiences can be manipulated, even manufactured through social engineering. Diddle neurons in the right manner and you can give someone an orgas
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

"I was asked by a couple that taught NPL to take some books on the subject to the swamis." One of the posts from the Google listserve did not copy the material in its entirety. Here it is. ?... QuoteDiscussion subject changed to "Therapists and NLP" by Annielori9 Newsgroups: alt.support.ex-cult.siddha-yoga From: annielo
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Once again, given this information now available from the Google listserve discussions in the 1990s, NLP does, from these discussions, appear to be part of the brew used by Gurumayi, as well as the EST tech taught to Muktananda by Werner Erhard. If anyone who has served time in Siddha or SYDA yoga still struggles with his or her recovery, investigate the methods used in Large Group Awareness T
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

LGATs (Large Group Awareness Trainings) were all the rage when I was growing up in the 70s. They include Werner Erhart's now-defunct est, its successor The Forum (aka Landmark Education), Lifespring, and many spin-offs. I've never attended these, though the many Intensives I experienced with Swami Muktananda were heavily influenced by Werner, and gave me a strong taste of the group dyna
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

This is not the Siddha Yoga intensive but the Center's Leadership course. Center's Leader Training Course, South Fallsburg Ashram, Summer, 1992 The design of the Center Leader's Training Course that summer was quite unique. (Corboy--was it unique? Or was it merely LGAT on a harsher level?) All participants were required to take not only the CLT courses (of which
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Must mention that attempts to open discussion about Muktananda's covert use of EST/Werner Erhard poison seems to elicit very little interest on other forums and blogs where recovery from Siddha Yoga and SYDA yoga are discussed. This is very sad. So very many persons on such venues report that they are best by flashbacks or night time dreams of life at the ashram and wonder why they are s
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

in m In my opinion, protected by the First Amendment, I would suggest that this is an adroit use of derivative legitimacy. These gurus and teachers are in most cases deceased. RabbiAbraham Heschel fought on the front lines for justice and civil rights[, against the very sort of oppression that has been described for years by Cohen's students. Some had troubled histories (to sa
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Dear SL, welcome. I am not a professional but can pass this on from the Ross Institute Archives. If at some point you want to take your recovery further, send a PM to rrmoderator and obtain a referral to some exit counselors in your area. THat will be the very best way to identify the exact techniques that were done to you when you went through EST. You were on the recieving end of some hig
Forum: Large Group Awareness Training, "Human Potential"

Martin, thanks for this. Even if people choose to keep their exercises private, anyone who has spent time at what I call Andy's Place might benefit from studying the exact point, in time, in place, where one was in emotions and relationships and travels--and yes, finances--when one encountered publicity for AC -- or a recruiter for him. It is important to ID not only the exact point w
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Quote A contributer on Rituals of Disenchantment posted this Anonymous said... BBC documentary series to watch Century of the Self # also can find on Utube Documentary applies to many comments here. Werner Erhardt is in there. Werner helped shape the Siddha Yoga mind control machine for Baba*. Covers his techniques, same as used in Siddha Yoga. *('Baba' means Mu
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

From our thread on Landmark (the current version of EST) and hypnosis. Persons who have been in SYDA/Siddha Yoga intensives, and thus exposed to Werner Erhard EST 'tech' incorporated by Erhards friend Muktananda into the Siddha Yoga Intensive should give close attention to these shares. See whether they apply to what you remember from the SY-Intensives. In the case of SY, music, i
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

The after effect of install the guru in yourself exericises? From a recent post on the rituals of disenchantment thread Quote"The first big question I have is: how do you deal emotionally with the fact that Gurumayi has disappeared?" Hello folks of guru enchantment and disenchantment. Appreciate the blog and especially this question. I think it's a trully great self inquir
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"

Here are a few named because they continue to this day and remain influential, generated derivatives (spin offs) that remain influential to this day, or because so very many were affected as children that they are still haunted by after effects today. EST/Werner Erhard--current form is Landmark Education and many others have taken the template and created their own LGAT (Large Group Awarenes
Forum: "Cults," Sects, and "New Religious Movements"