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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: November 19, 2009 07:16AM

Confused7609:

No.

I am pointing out the rules, which you agreed to before posting here.

And I have pointed out some common sense issues regarding group leadership and meaningful accountability.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: Confused7609 ()
Date: November 19, 2009 08:49AM

I understand that many times practices continue with change of leadership however I have heard, regarding other cults, that they are getting away from this or that practice, now that someone else is in charge. Isn't that possible with this group a well? I have heard this regarding the group Jeffers headed up. Perhaps it is just propoganda but perhaps it is true. Things can change.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: Sparky ()
Date: November 19, 2009 09:09AM

Confused7609, you need to relax a bit, mate.

Sallie is NOT the topic of the thread and from what I have read, your postings are more and more firey (flame wise). You may or may not have a close personal friendship with Gary Coons, but don't try to champion someone whom others here have been apparently injured by.

Your input IS important.

Please take a deep breath and approach this from another angle. When Sallie posted the NOW FAMOUS R.R. laws of detecting a damaging/questionable cult/religion and you tried to turn it back on her and call her a "cult leader" is absurd and clearly you typed it in the heat of the moment and did not really mean to come across as being so mean-spirited.

Please try to be more respectful. Disagreement is encouraged here but hurtfulness is not.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: rrmoderator ()
Date: November 19, 2009 09:51AM

Confused7609:

Very simple to determine.

Is there an elected board to fixed terms that can fire the pastor if they wish?

Is there a budget published that specfically discloses all salaries, compensation and expenses paid out from contributions?

Has the new leader denounced the abuses of the old leader?

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: brainwashed ()
Date: November 19, 2009 10:36AM

Quote
daddylonglegs
Confused,
Everyone on here IS being watched (ie posts being read) because this forum is public, and known and commented about by people involved in this group. That is no secret. Don't see where the veiled threat is. The "Watchers" that Hickman talked about are aliens/fallen angels- and are our enemies, as they know our every thought, and try to put thoughts in our heads to lead us down the wrong path. Another absurd teaching of this cult that is just another way to make people think they are always under attack, and therefor need to be extra vigilant in their obedience to "The Way". There is a lot of paranoia in this group. Children are taught from a young age that someday the entire world will be against them and that there will be persecution because of who they are (ie. descendants of Jesus, etc).
There are also many levels of "in". Since this is not an organized group the way it seems to have been in the 70-80's, there is no member roster or anything like that. You are considered "in" unless you are "left-sided" meaning you do something to get yourself kicked out. Most people who are "left-sided" are put there because they have decided to "leave" and made that known, or they quietly left, and someone finally figured out they were living a lifestyle not "approved" and they chose to continue it. You have people "inner-circle" I guess who are involved in every teaching/ activity, and you have people on the fringe whose parents are involved, but they hang-out around the edges, go to big get-togethers once in awhile, or barely at all.
In case the post wasn't actually read, when I mentioned law-enforcement, it was one of several carreers mentioned just to point out that people in this cult appear normal on the outside because they participate in general society, with several different professions. They blend-in unlike, say, the Amish or FDLS, or any of those groups who close themselves off to society and stand-out right away. What are they going to do? Pull you over and give you an extra ticket because maybe you wrote on this forum?
It is hard to miss how many people read this forum. I think it has more to do with the time period of this group (30+ years) and the number of people involved over the years (someone earlier on this thread said it was 1-2,000 at one point).

This was great. Dead on.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: Confused7609 ()
Date: November 19, 2009 11:14AM

To my knowledge this is has not happened or is not the case. Thank-you for clarifying.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: My Good Name ()
Date: November 19, 2009 11:14AM

No, Gary has not denounced JH. JH is still the Great Leader that is quoted constantly. Gary cannot be fired and he is considered to be the High Priest of Israel. JH wanted him to be called Zadok by the people, Gary refused and just wanted to be called by his name.

The cult is set up like a pyramid.
-Gary (The Leader)-

--Elders and one David (a person who thinks they will be a king when the messiah comes)--

--------------The Clan Heads who are people in charge of one to several families---------------------

-------------------------------------------------The People----------------------------------------------------------


There also exists a group of "priests" that were picked by JH to spread the doctrine. They have no real power or say in what goes on even though they were told they would.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: brainwashed ()
Date: November 19, 2009 11:30AM

Sparky

concerned doesnt sound half as "fiery" as Sallie does, again and again.

If it wasnt for concerned right now she would be posting more of her "I just had a brainstorm" nonsense and the 1 2 3 4 5 garbage. I think its quite a good conversation and if nothing else at least it makes sense and is a bit funny.

Sallie has made many rude comments about almost everyone on this thread. Go ahead and take a look at all of her posts and see who really is inflammatory and mean spirited. Concerned is not championing GC, just stating that he was a victim. Gary was definitely a victim if ever there was a victim of this group (not to say he was the only one, far from it) Just because he is now the "go to guy" or whatever he is does not mean that he was not victimized. Take Michael Jackson as an example. Because he may have victimized children make him any less of a victim of abuse by his rechid father? It was that abuse that made him who he was. Same with GC.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: brainwashed ()
Date: November 19, 2009 11:43AM

something I have just noticed on this site is that this thread is the most popular. It might not have the most posts but it certainly has the most views from what I see. I hadn't realized that it was always on the top of the list for this reason until today.

Maybe this is becayse most other cults out there have all killed themselves. Maybe because some of them are already established as cults in the main stream religious circles. Maybe because this cult is somehow more interesting than others. I dont know. 21.000+ views. Almost 10 times that of any other. I find that to be quite a thing, and i think it says a lot.

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Re: Jack Hickman
Posted by: daddylonglegs ()
Date: November 20, 2009 03:09AM

Quote
Confused7609
Revisiting the past isn't an issue for me. What I do believe in, is freedom of expression and not having a leader on here, or a people who do not respect the different perspectives of others. As someone who has been subject to thought reform and control, it is important to me that it does not occur on here. There should not be a leader on here, a controlling opinion on here, nor dominant and submissive interactions. I believe no one should feel intimidated by other posts into feeling they can't express the type of effect this group has had on them, just because it does not involve sexual abuse. I don't feel other post should be criticized at all. Posters should feel comfortable to state their experience, opinions, or what will or has helped them.

ditto

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