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THE_DEAN_001
Let go of all these thoughts and self-judgments and maybe you will begin to understand that these thoughts are the cause of your suffering.
All you need to do is let go of all this obsessive thinking and look within yourself...no guru can do that for you. Allow yourself to be at peace.
My advice would be to spend a few minutes each day asking yourself, "what is it that is noticing these thoughts?". Do NOT expect to find an answer...just asking that question is enough. You can do it in between television programs and you do not have to sit cross-legged to do it. Anytime you find yourself getting carried away with self-destruction thoughts about being too spiritual or not spiritual enough...let go of that guilt and interrupt the pattern you have created by asking this question.
I hope this helps and I would like to end by saying...let the flaming begin!
Thats the thing with all groups sadly.Quote
yasmin
Sallie, you have a good point and it makes a lot of sense.Thank you.
Tsukimoto, can so relate to what you say about sometimes missing the good things in the group.Will never go back, value freedom of thought too much, but there are things that I do miss.
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Sallie
THE_DEAN_001
Your problem isn't really that you don't meditate enough or that you waste a lot of time. Your problem seems to be that you obsess about whether these things are "good" or "bad" or "right" or "wrong". Let go of all these thoughts and self-judgments and maybe you will begin to understand that these thoughts are the cause of your suffering.
Dean,
OK. I give up. I re-read the statement and your explanation several times. Help me out. A thought that ''causes suffering'' would not be good....correct? So the thoughts which ''cause suffering'' and are not good....would be bad...correct? So are you saying that it is ''bad'' to think about what is good or bad because.....nothing is bad????
Or are you saying that only ''thinking something is bad''....is ''bad''.
I admit...I just don't understand your point.
Also...obsessing would be to think repetitively...correct? So if it is bad to obsess then, are you saying it is bad to meditate??
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Sallie
Dean,
One more question. To judge would be to discern and separate....correct? Humans being the complicated creatures that we are.....we tend to create many categories and names for our deductions. Can I assume that you do not categorize the results of your ''discernments'' into groups of good or bad but that, you instead label thoughts as ''ones which cause suffering'' and ''ones which do not cause suffering''?????
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tsukimotoQuote
THE_DEAN_001
Let go of all these thoughts and self-judgments and maybe you will begin to understand that these thoughts are the cause of your suffering.
All you need to do is let go of all this obsessive thinking and look within yourself...no guru can do that for you. Allow yourself to be at peace.
My advice would be to spend a few minutes each day asking yourself, "what is it that is noticing these thoughts?". Do NOT expect to find an answer...just asking that question is enough. You can do it in between television programs and you do not have to sit cross-legged to do it. Anytime you find yourself getting carried away with self-destruction thoughts about being too spiritual or not spiritual enough...let go of that guilt and interrupt the pattern you have created by asking this question.
I hope this helps and I would like to end by saying...let the flaming begin!
Why should we flame you, Dean? Are you a hunka hunka burning love? :-)
Okay, let me start by saying that I think that you are AGREEING with the main point that many of us make: it's important to really look at our thoughts. Are we allowing ourselves to be sucked into patterns of thinking that are inaccurate and created unnecessary guilt, fear, sadness, anger or anxiety? Really looking at -- and consciously changing unrealistic thoughts can help us to be happier, more at peace, and more effective in our lives --and less likely to be manipulated by a group or guru. This is also the point of Rational-emotive Therapy, Cognitive Therapy, and CBT, as promoted by Drs. Albert Ellis, David Burns, and Aaron Beck.
My disagreement with you is not the goal -- but the means of getting there. Telling people "all you need to do is let go of this obsessive thinking...allow yourself to be at peace..." may be helpful for some people, but not others. Some people may feel, "Yeah, it's all very well to say that, but I don't know HOW to let go of my thinking, and be at peace! If I did, I'd have done it already!" If you have learned harmful ways of thinking, then changing it is not going to happen quickly, easily, or overnight. A person may need a therapist or a group of people who are also working on the same issue to provide guidance, suggestions, encouragement and support.
I compare it to getting in shape, physically. Sure, if you have some experience with exercise and fitness, maybe you can plan a good exercise regimen for yourself, and follow it. But if you are out of shape, haven't exercised in years, never did know much about fitness...what do you do? Someone can tell you, "You should exercise more." As the kids say, "Well, DUUUUUH!" You KNOW you need to exercise more! Maybe you walk a bit or do some crunches or push-ups -- and then what? What you need is a trainer, a coach, a book, a website....you need help making your plan, finding the way.
I look at this website as a gym for my thinking! All kinds of people and ideas to work my mind in different ways. But I'll stop for now to retie my sneakers.
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The Anticult
well, my view is the comments from "THE_DEAN_001" sounds like the Eckhart Tolle method.
This is part of my view.
In theology, there is the Original Sin, which most people now reject.
But in the "advice" given, its another form of Original Sin of the Mind.
People like Eckhart Tolle think there is something wrong with the natural human mind, the way nature made it.
What if these guys are completely wrong-headed?
Their example are often wars, killings, and the rest of it. But we all agree that is pathological.
But this idea that "detaching" from ones thoughts is going to help people, is very dubious.
Maybe if you are a monk, or living in a rural area, etc.
Every single new agey cultish group in the world uses this method to get at people, to soften up their heads.
I think these guys don't know what they are talking about, to be blunt. Its great to have an active mind, a curious mind. What if happiness is achieved doing the opposite of what these guys say to do?
Their solution, pardon the bluntness, is something akin to a self-lobotomy. Trying to shut the thinking mind down.
Personally, I find that very destructive and a type of ancient Original Sin of the Mind.
Ignorance is not bliss, and knowledge is great.
Mindfulness meditation is being studied by science now, and in moderation can help with some problems. But its no panacea.
Having an active, curious mind is fun, and natural.
This ancient No-Mind stuff came out of a primitive society, where life was short and brutish. If you are a monk, then fine, shut the mind down, shut your sex down, and good luck to you.
But for regular folk in the modern world, this entire Eckhart Tolle stuff is very regressive.
To be even more blunt, its a new age fad.
The solution is not a mind-lobotomy.
What if a better idea was the exact opposite, to unleash your curious and creative natural mind?
Personally, I'd rather have the curious mind of a cat, than a Zombie.
It does seem that people fear the natural human mind.
More specifically, new age culty leaders fear the independent minds of their followers, so they designed ways to PASSIFY them. That is what it is really about.