I am not a mental therapist but I do work with bodywork and healing. Most of the people I work with are not involved with Krishna Consciousness but ordinary folks. My wife is employed by with the NZ social services. Her work is mainly with people from the lower economic levels of society. Her religion motivates her in the sense that she feels compassion and wants to help others. Anything wrong with that?

I am very weak when it comes to arguing or debating which is why I might appear to avoid conflict. I also do not have a lot of formal education, so I do not always feel comfortable in such situations. I I will leave that to others who need to exercise their male superiority. Psychologically the need to be correct and the need to be aggressive is not where I am at. I do not mind admitting when I am wrong or my weaknesses. I personally know a lot of therapists involved within Iskcon who are helping a lot of people. I really don't see what the problem with that is?

Mens groups are a GOOD THING and I suggest that you investigate for yourself and draw your own conclusions. It might help you work through your own anti-cult fanaticism. My wife agrees and she has worked with a lot of people over the years. I know that in my own personal recovery growing up I did not always have healthy role models. Most of us who are raised in this day and age are not in touch with our emotions. I am writing this all not as a "Iskcon Devotee" but as a fellow human being and male who has worked a lot on his self and continues to do so. Mens groups help us to identify behaviors and attitudes that limit us and our relationships with others. They offer constructive support and resources for getting past whatever blocks might be there. Please do not limit me by placing a label on me.

This has nothing to do with Iskcon or any spiritual organization but is something that can only assist in helping men get past negative behavior and certainly can help men recognize their need to lord it over others and exploit women. The abusers in Iskcon were screwed up long before they joined Iskcon. This is a problem that affects everyone.

I highly recommend anyone reading this post to check out the mens movement. Steven Botkin a therapist started a mens resource center in the States in Massachusetts their web site is; [www.mensresourcecenter.org]

I am deeply skeptical concerning Prasadam Das and his purpose posting here.

It seems to me that his primary concern is not helping people, but helping ISKCON.

And given ISKCON's horrific history of violence, crimes, child sexual abuse, wife abuse etc. it should be understood that historically they are one of the most notorious "cults" of the 20th Century, right up there with Rev. Moon and Scientology.

See [www.culteducation.com]

Anyone reading Prasadam Das should consider this and then look at all his posts. He really does come across as an apologist whose purpose posting here apparently is to soften whatever impression readers may have of ISKCON.

Don't be taken in by his smooth talk or seemingly benign advice.

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Most of us who are raised in this day and age are not in touch with our emotions

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I am not a mental therapist but I do work with bodywork and healing

A synapsis of the New Age\Alternative Healing movement. Most, if not all, practitioners advertise about how "We" live in an age of (fill in the blank - materialism, separation from our higher power, isolation, blah, blah, blah). "We" suppress this, suppress that, and conventional doctors, western religion and psychotherapy just doesn't get it, whereas those who are not mental therapists do, and can save us all.

Hope,

I am not a mental health specialist. My wife is.

Besides Swedish and Deep Tissue work most of my work is medical massage. The majority of my clients are referred to me by their GP. This is fairly common in NZ and most of Europe. I am not sure why you assume that massage therapy is new age as most traditional forms of healing from many parts of the world involve forms of bodywork. I also get a lot of athletes who come to me for treatment for sports injuries.

Many leading mental health therapists in the field of treating survivors of sexual abuse utilize forms of massage and touch in their work.

Study the facts before you make uninformed critical assumptions. All the Best to you!

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My wife is a social worker and family therapist and does a lot in our city to help familes with situations involviing abuse. I also work part time with massage and spiritual healing to help people

[b:c2e0322b2b] I also work part time with massage and spiritual healing to help people[/b:c2e0322b2b]

You "also" in the passage quoted above implies that you also do something in the healing field other than massage. But the spiritual healing is what bothers me. Someone with no training, who is taking referrals of clients who purportedly have been sexually abused, is a rather frightening thought. It's not that I think you are touching them inappropriately, it's the psychological and emotional issues that result in the presence of an untrained "healer" that concern me - someone whose been there, done that.

Prasadam Das says that "treating survivors of sexual abuse utilize forms of massage and touch." And that he is some kind of "spiritual healer."

This type of "bodywork" is well known within the "New Age" movement and based upon the belief that by "massaging" people you can "release" toxic energy, memories etc.

It's an example of "New Age" mumbo jumbo, that may produce "recovered" or "false memories" of abuse.

No science to support this nonsense.

Prasadam Das should just stick to rub downs at the gym or health clubs in NZ and not try to pass himself off as a "spiritual healer."

The best he can do is deal with muscle pain, the rest is better handled by trained and certified professionals. And I wouldn't recommend his wife the ISKCON social worker either.

Maybe she is a referral source for him regarding his so-called "spiritual healing" business?

'I am not a mental therapist but I do work with bodywork and healing.'

Then, after being challenged, backtracked and said his wife was the one who did psychotherapy.

If you're having trouble keeping the facts straight about what you and your wife do, how can we trust you to give an honest, accurate assessment of ISKON?

And it is interesting that you've returned as soon as we posted a URL on the 'Fallen Guru Gossip' threadabout Solocana Das' expose of the succession battles within ISKON after Prabhubada died.

Two days after he finished writing 'The Guru Business'--Solocana Das was murdered.

He makes a detailed case, quoting Scriptures and Prahubpada's own texts that Prabhupada himself appointed *no official sucessor/s*, and contended that those who took leadership after after Prabhupada's death and demanded veneration as realized gurus went contrary to the master's own wishes.

'The Guru Business' is now available online here:

[www.geocities.com]

I used to live at an ISKCON temple ten years ago. After leaving, another cult came along guised as wanting to help me through the pain and alienation I felt from ISKCON, only they pretended to be political and about social justice.
The problem is that they preyed on very emotionally unstable people who didn't quite fit into the world around them yet from their cult experiences. It scares most people away when you admit to joining a cult. So when someone listens and gives you attention and "picks you up," it is comforting.
It utterly pisses me off that ISKCON would dare to come on a recovery forum to profess their cruel dogma on people who just want to have some balance in thier lives that NO ONE CAN GET FROM A CULT.
As someone who is trying to get away from cults, I would strongly urge you to leave this forum and stop trying to manipulate those who need to think for themselves and not be drawn into another mindless drab.
Don't you think you have tortured enough people with your warped reality already? The people on this forum have had enough from the likes of you.
Oh, and so everyone knows Prabhupada said that women have half the brain that men do and that women cannot attain spirituality themselves, they need a man to teach it to them. So don't you dare lie to people and claim that a woman who is dirty for holding a baby or for having a womenly cycle once a month is equal to men in your eyes. If a woman was on her period, would you allow her to serve the dieties? But men are never dirty on their own. You disgust me.

Out of all the cults the hare krishna people are the only ones I have met who were truthful. what other cult did you join and what did they do to you that hurt you so much?

Supermonkey:

See [www.culteducation.com]

Hare Krishna (ISKCON) has a horrible history of well documented abuse.