Here’s a look inside an easily overlooked area when involved in abusive groups.

Is the contempt shown towards abusive behaviour more important than the abusive behaviour itself?

Contempt for abuse is an adequate, valid feeling state which is instrumental in being able to move on from abuse.

Long have we all been taught to have compassion for people who continuously set out to harm others at a benefit to themselves, yet hide behind the protection of their own unquestionable “compassion for all” teachings.

In my own recovery, I eventually learned that there is no right to compassion and kindness on the part of the abuser. These things are to be earned, not automatically expected (and therefore given) as if like dealing with those who have a respected genuine, yet healthier societal status.

Learning that I could grant my own trust and distrust based entirely upon my own personal perspective and judgement has been instrumental in my own landing back into reality.

When they weaponise people against themselves, using perceived personal information and interactions as the weapon - judge it. It is a very good insight into a persons character.

If a person is weaponised against themselves in any way, it is out and out abuse, not a spiritual, teaching, or healing situation.

When contempt for abuse is used against a person calling them out for an obvious act of abuse, it is a tool to distract away from the abusers actions.

They save face, and are able carry on with their unhealthy treatment of other human beings until the next person calling them out comes along, and the weaponising cycle continues again.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/30/2021 12:52AM by facet.

You are so right about this.

I've read many a discussion about abusive gurus where people expended more time and attention trying to commiserate with the guru's burdens than with the predicament of the guru's victims.

It seemed that the more compassion shown toward abusers the more this demonstrated superior spiritual attainment.

Facet is right - contempt, dismay and disgust toward abusive behavior are valid responses.

The first step to creating a community of enablers is for the abuser to convince us that our fellow feeling for abused persons is wrong, stupid, lacking in sophistication.

Thank you for validating my experience, and that of others too Corboy.

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The first step to creating a community of enablers is for the abuser to convince us that our fellow feeling for abused persons is wrong, stupid, lacking in sophistication.

- this point is so important for everyone to understand.

A long time ago, I wrote something about abusers methods of weaponizing humor and teasing.

Here's a link for further reading.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Please add your own questions and observations. There's not a lot of info available on this topic.

This is very true. I've been through this exact same thing and it left me in a tough bind. How do I have self-compassion for my own prior problems as an abuse survivor (eating disorders, self-harm, addiction, unstable relationships) whilst also feeling appropriate anger towards abusers who were struggling equally with trauma? If their actions were worthy of contempt, aren't I also? And if I am, doesn't that mean I deserved abuse? It's a vicious cycle.

I think part of this is that abusive people tend to have no idea how their actions are interpreted by others, especially children. I was just talking to someone about the example of an emotionally abusive parent who is struggling financially. If she can no longer continue to pay for music lessons for her child, she might be too ashamed to admit it and instead say something like, "well your music sounds awful, I'm not going to waste any more money on someone so untalented." The child is crushed and blames himself, and spends the rest of his life thinking that he failed at his passion and is unworthy. But the parent will probably forget the incident almost immediately, since the explanation was never true in the first place. Maybe she'll buy him a bicycle for his birthday six months later to alleviate any lingering guilt. Years later, when the child says, "you crushed my dreams of becoming a musician," she will answer with something like, "don't be silly! That never happened, we just had to tighten our belts! You can afford your own lessons now, why are you still blaming me?" If anyone continued to push it, she'd go into extreme detail about how incredibly hard it was to survive as a single parent, and so forth.

These kinds of situations are amplified in cults and closed movements because there is so much pressure to save face, be holier-than-thou, come across as superhuman. To be above flaws and human concerns. I think that spiritual leaders are so invested in this self-image that they discard any action on their own part that is less than perfect; a kind of ultimate cognitive dissonance. Any hint of imperfection and humanity has to be immediately hidden or their business model falls apart... yes, 'spiritual leader' is a career choice. Yes, they are getting paid for it. Yes, your membership dues and 'voluntary contributions' and books and meditation app subscriptions are paying for someone else's food and accommodation. Yes, by renouncing your worldly belongings you are supplementing theirs. You are balancing the books for a real-world organisation that has a bank account and a tax code. They only keep profiting if everyone keeps buying into the myth that they are somehow more than human.

So everything they do has to be sympathetic. They can't admit to mistakes. They can't turn around and say, "gee, I know I told you all to sell your townhouses and move to the jungle. Well that didn't work and all the money is gone. Guess I misinterpreted that dream I had. Oops." The impact that gurus have on their followers' lives is measured in tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars per person, and in years and decades of their lives. They can't admit to the mistake because they can't possibly make reparations for it. If you destroy the lives of five people for two years, you might find a way to make it up to them. If you destroy the lives of a hundred people for twenty years, you will never ever pay off that debt.

So the only choice is to keep denying, keep minimising, keep accusing the victims of being weak and unspiritual, keep reminding the world that you suffered way more and survived better and are therefore much stronger. Keep pretending over and over that your actions were logical and made perfect sense. It reminds me of the story of the Buddha turning all incoming arrows into rainbows through his own inner peace. In the guru's mind, it isn't THEIR fault if they unleash a bunch of rainbows which turn back to arrows when they reach the crowd. That's just the followers' fault for not being more enlightened, right?

I wanted to write about the stories we tell ourselves in a cult, but this is getting long so I'll stop here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/30/2021 06:29PM by Jupiter.

I was sure that I had responded to this post here, but it seems to not have happened..

I think that humour does have its place, in my own observation there has been a movement, mostly fuelled by social media where humour is simply not allowed anymore and I think that this says much about the structure of social media and how it is shaping our brains as humans.. there is poor taste humour and there is weaponised humour, then those bully’s who are stood up to with humour and then just told that they are wrong as anything they say or do is weaponised against them.. just what can ya do these days hey? :D

Jupiter, it seems like it is the same discrediting of things that brings superiority complex into play for cults and their leaders, behaviour that is often then spread down as usual or normal (if I am allowed to say that) to attendees. “If I discredit this, then it serves that .. and it gives me more power” - wether that is power to survive, to cope emotionally, to make something rationally right in the situation of the person.

Unfortunately, I was in two cults and in both the "guru" weaponized us against each other. It was done through the concepts we were taught. In the first cult, if someone was having difficulty with meditating, we told them it was "roughness" and "purification", implying that it was their problem that they were having trouble with the practice. I not only said this to others but said it to myself! It's been posted elsewhere in this forum on the dangers of meditation so I won't go into it here. If we had difficulty in a relationship, we were told to look at how we were "100% responsible" for the situation. It's one thing to suggest that if it's a spat with a friend. But it's horrible and compounds the trauma to tell an abuse victim to do that, which I personally experienced. Another thing we were taught was to not "collude" with each other or to say anything "negative", which was a way of keeping us from sharing our concerns and criticisms and making any constructive changes. In the second cult, we kept ourselves and each other in line by pointing out when we were being "materialistic", too concerned with the physical world. Anything physical and enjoyed by our senses was to be denied as being "materialistic". In short, I learned to gaslight myself as well as others in the mistaken belief that the spiritual experience was more important than the physical. So very sad and regrettable.