Quote
sleepy skunk
"Forever Senseless" does have a ring to it doesn't it?

HAHA!! I love it.

Quote
meh
I would watch the dvd's at krg every month and look at the members there . . . all the men dressed like ikeda and all the women dressed like mrs. ikeda, and I felt that there was something deeply wrong and kind of scary. I attributed it to the differences between japanes and american culture, but those folks were absolutely zombified. And most of the people surrounding me in the kaikan were the same way, hanging on every word, clapping like a pod of trained seals and viewing the whole phenom as if they were watching the second coming unfold before their eyes.

Perfect descriptions and very astute observations. Diehard male Ikeda-bots do indeed emulate The Dear Leader & Japanese salaryman dress code. The WD / YWD in Japan also like to wear certain common bright pastel colors to all the official cult org. meetings. It's like some kind of "Leave It To Beaver", alternate world pretend show, time warp. Don't forget to also throw in the mandatory fake enthusiasm and default permanent plastic smiles.

For the uninitiated, I can easily see how creepy it all comes across. It reminds me of a cross between The Amish, Mormon Elders and Fundamentalist Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints all wrapped up into one. The gakkai's equivalent to the mormon underwear is their omamori gohonzon which dangles from their neck on silver chains - the magic, mystical protective shield / amulet. Cult kaikans also have secret Dear Leader rooms, where only the super faithful, hardcore believing Ikeda-bots, are even let in on (I've seen these rooms), where they essentially dream about and perpetually wait (while chanting of course) for The Dear Leader to visit (if the area members have enough "fortune").

Quote
meh
What the heck was I thinking? I guess that's the key . . . when you have ikeda-san to tell you what to think, you really don't need to form any independent thoughts of your own - all the organization has to do is catch you when you're at a low point in your life, and it's easy to persuade you that there's a magical hokey-pokey that can make everything better. I always said that nobody came to sgi because their life was in great shape. That seems so sinister in hindsight.

Another devastatingly accurate observation and summation.

Quote
Shavoy
I used to like going to KRG back in the day.

I always hated krg, always. The only thing that could make me hate it more than usual, was when I had to do MC. (Oh! The horrible memories . . . . !!)

Quote
Shavoy
When I read about your friends who lapsed into jargon, I've seen that, too. The die-harder they are, the more lap-sy it gets. Even from members who feel they are more free-thinking and not towing the Ikeda Line.

All of these observations are so right on the money. Even the one who you think are still somewhat "normal", can surprise you by throwing out the occasional gakkai-cult-org.-lingo when you least expect it. The ones who use it in every other sentence are the ones to really watch out for and who are the most departed from reality. It's a way to quickly gauge how much of a kool-aid-aholic your are dealing with.

I'll never forget the MD member, who resisted for years, his wife's cult practice. Then, suddenly, almost overnight, at one meeting, he was now a "leader" and parroting all of the cliche gakkai cult lingo, perfectly. The transformation was dramatic and shocking to me. I had always thought that he was somewhat normal and had a good strong anchor in reality. Well, I was wrong. Somebody or something got to him and used some heavy duty bolt cutters, yanking him into the deep end. Like I said, I'll never forget that.


- Hitch

I used to enjoy krg. I practiced in Albuquerque, Las Cruces and El Paso before I moved back to the east coast; the Hispanic cultural influence was everywhere, and it was just plain fun. We had wd meetings, and it was real human-to-human stuff. There was talk about our practices, but mostly we just listened to and supported each other in our ordinary, daily tribulations. Moving back, I was surprised at how different it was. The population was different, obviously, but what a bunch of self-important yo-yo's.

I had a job interview today, my first since I stopped chanting - it was a really interesting experience. I felt like the whole thing was entirely in my hands, and no worries about whether I'd chanted enough daimoku. I'm not sure if I'll get the job (they wanted some specific experience that I don't have), but I don't have anyone leaning over my shoulder telling me to chant for it, despite the reality that there are people out there who would be much more suitable. Not being negative or self-deprecatory, but realistic.

Quote

Diehard male Ikeda-bots do indeed emulate The Dear Leader & Japanese salaryman dress code. The WD / YWD in Japan also like to wear certain common bright pastel colors to all the official cult org. meetings.

I joined up in early 1987, and for some months after that, the SGI - which was still called NSA at that point - was still segregating men and women on different sides of the room with an aisle in between! That seemed DEFINITELY weird! What, were they afraid that, if allowed to sit next to each other, things would degenerate into a wild orgy within minutes???

Quote

The gakkai's equivalent to the mormon underwear is their omamori gohonzon which dangles from their neck on silver chains - the magic, mystical protective shield / amulet.

Personally, I never observed this as any sort of uniform-type norm. I can't remember seeing a single instance of someone wearing his/her omamori gohonzon around. I saw a few sitting next to the gohonzon inside home altars, but where I saw them, I was led to understand that they remained in the butsudan until the owner went traveling. It would have shocked me to see a local wearing one around like a piece of jewelry.

Quote

I always said that nobody came to sgi because their life was in great shape. That seems so sinister in hindsight.

QFT

Quote

I always hated krg, always. The only thing that could make me hate it more than usual, was when I had to do MC. (Oh! The horrible memories . . . . !!)

Me too. DREADED it. And all the meetings - the only meetings I looked forward to were the early ones, when I was still a YWD, in Minneapolis, where there was a vibrant youth division. We'd go to meetings overflowing with youth division, and then after, we'd go to a movie or out for drinks - it was terrific. That was my first 5 years, and even though I remained in for over 20 years, I never enjoyed the activities after that the way I had in those first years. This is not uncommon, at least among women - to remain in a relationship on the strength of a great first year, or even first 3 weeks!, even though the entire rest of the time was ick. We women have a knack for deluding ourselves that that wonderful first short period of time was reality, and the ick thereafter was only temporary, that the relationship would soon return to the wonderfulness of that first short period. Problem is that the person (or the organization) was on company manners - best behavior - in order to woo and win us. Once he/they felt we were "hooked," he/they then felt confident about letting the REAL him/them show through. And it was awful. I remember reading an article once written by a woman who stayed with a man for five years - and had a child with him! - because they had such a great first three weeks. The entire 5 years minus 3 weeks after was horrible, but such is the tenacity of someone who is determined to believe that her fantasy is reality. Does this happen with men, too, I wonder?

Quote
TaitenAndProud

Quote

Diehard male Ikeda-bots do indeed emulate The Dear Leader & Japanese salaryman dress code. The WD / YWD in Japan also like to wear certain common bright pastel colors to all the official cult org. meetings.

I joined up in early 1987, and for some months after that, the SGI - which was still called NSA at that point - was still segregating men and women on different sides of the room with an aisle in between! That seemed DEFINITELY weird! What, were they afraid that, if allowed to sit next to each other, things would degenerate into a wild orgy within minutes???

We were segregated for the whole time that I was in, or at least very "active" (more cult lingo) in the "YOUTH!" The only time we ever got to mingle with the YWD, was when we went on long distance trips, either across country (U.S.A.) or to the cult motherland (tozan), on the buses or planes only and only for short periods of time while we were traveling. Otherwise, intermingling was a definite understood "no-no" and segregation was the norm.

Quote
TaitenAndProud

Quote

The gakkai's equivalent to the mormon underwear is their omamori gohonzon which dangles from their neck on silver chains - the magic, mystical protective shield / amulet.

Personally, I never observed this as any sort of uniform-type norm. I can't remember seeing a single instance of someone wearing his/her omamori gohonzon around. I saw a few sitting next to the gohonzon inside home altars, but where I saw them, I was led to understand that they remained in the butsudan until the owner went traveling. It would have shocked me to see a local wearing one around like a piece of jewelry.

Only a few diehards would wear them regularly in America. I also remember some salaried "leaders" who semi-regularly wore them. During conventions or tozan trips, however, many had them (you practically had to, in order to do gongyo in your rooms - people would congregate into the rooms for group gongyos with those who had their magic amulets, and some even had miniature elaborate custom made butsudans to set them up in). It's more common in Japan and The Dear Leader almost always has his on (which is, of course, emulated by all the hardcore Ikeda-bots).


- Hitch



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/05/2013 06:20PM by Hitch.

I was reminded that I almost got hooked into another Buddhist cult a number of years ago - New Kadampa Tradition. They were such an obvious personality-cult and had a clear proscription about reading from other traditions that even I recognized the signs. Apparently, I need to be hit over the head with a 2x4 (or possibly 6x6). Interestingly, I didn't find any postings on this entire site about them.

Okay, so the "so sorry for any misunderstanding!" and "don't give up!" Cards are arriving - are greeting cards possibly another line of business for sgi? Most notably, there was a card from the general chapter leader who, other than to call me a few weeks ago to reprimand me for my disharmonious behavior, has had no direct contact with me whatsoever.

I'd originally thought about completely ignoring all of the crap, but am thinking that maybe responding might be a good thing to do. After all, these whackadoos actually believe that at any moment, the earth will open and I will be sucked into the deepest of hells reserved for former-sgi members; maybe it might do them good to hear that I haven't "given up," and that I'm moving along in my happy, productive post-sgi life.

I wonder if it would be helpful for anybody, or if this is just a windmill I would be tilting at.

Quote
meh
Okay, so the "so sorry for any misunderstanding!" and "don't give up!" Cards are arriving - are greeting cards possibly another line of business for sgi? Most notably, there was a card from the general chapter leader who, other than to call me a few weeks ago to reprimand me for my disharmonious behavior, has had no direct contact with me whatsoever.

I'd originally thought about completely ignoring all of the crap, but am thinking that maybe responding might be a good thing to do. After all, these whackadoos actually believe that at any moment, the earth will open and I will be sucked into the deepest of hells reserved for former-sgi members; maybe it might do them good to hear that I haven't "given up," and that I'm moving along in my happy, productive post-sgi life.

I wonder if it would be helpful for anybody, or if this is just a windmill I would be tilting at.

Go for it, meh! These leaders reaching out to you now (right on schedule), especially the chapter leader, are just doing what they feel they have to do: Pressuring encouragement to beef up their own Karma-Busting Karts.

I think in different areas of the country, there are obviously different lines of attack. This card thing--I've never seen it where I'm at now.

So, yeah, shoot 'em off a card of your own! If you stay firm and keep the foot down, they should get the message and retreat back out to sea. Thanks for sharing about your interview---good luck!

Quote

I'd originally thought about completely ignoring all of the crap, but am thinking that maybe responding might be a good thing to do. After all, these whackadoos actually believe that at any moment, the earth will open and I will be sucked into the deepest of hells reserved for former-sgi members; maybe it might do them good to hear that I haven't "given up," and that I'm moving along in my happy, productive post-sgi life.

Tell them you're taiten and proud - no longer advancing in the wrong direction!

:D

Quote
meh
I was reminded that I almost got hooked into another Buddhist cult a number of years ago - New Kadampa Tradition. They were such an obvious personality-cult and had a clear proscription about reading from other traditions that even I recognized the signs. Apparently, I need to be hit over the head with a 2x4 (or possibly 6x6). Interestingly, I didn't find any postings on this entire site about them.

It's the first I've heard of them, but there does appear to be some discussion here about the group:

[forum.culteducation.com]

Quote
meh
Okay, so the "so sorry for any misunderstanding!" and "don't give up!" Cards are arriving - are greeting cards possibly another line of business for sgi? Most notably, there was a card from the general chapter leader who, other than to call me a few weeks ago to reprimand me for my disharmonious behavior, has had no direct contact with me whatsoever.

Isn't that hilarious!

Nope, no "misunderstandings" at all, it's quite the opposite in fact, . . . . this is when people begin to understand very well what's going on.

I know what you mean and how you feel about getting unsolicited "friendly", long lost buddy messages in the mail from people who didn't even know your face or name before. I just laughed and tossed the stuff. I didn't fall for it, not even for a second. I even remember my first immediate thought about it after I finished laughing, . . . . "these people are a joke and must think I'm stupid." It was yet another one of those turning point moments that forever altered the way I viewed some "leaders" and the gakkai cult org.. They have no shame whatsoever.

Quote
meh
I wonder if it would be helpful for anybody, or if this is just a windmill I would be tilting at.

Trust me, you are definitely tilting at windmills if you engage them. It doesn't matter what you say or do, nothing will ever alter their view of you - that you are a defective Ikeda-bot, in need of repair.

****

Quote
Shavoy
So, yeah, shoot 'em off a card of your own! If you stay firm and keep the foot down, they should get the message and retreat back out to sea. Thanks for sharing about your interview---good luck!

Yeah, but they'll continue to wash back in with the tide from time to time.



- Hitch

PS - I second Shavoy's words re: your job interview.

New jobs, new schools, whenever life takes on a new direction (as all normal people's lives inevitably do from time to time), this is when the gakkai cult org. members and "leaders" all begin to circle like a bunch of hungry sharks whispering in you ear, "CHANT!, CHANT!, CHANT!", "YOUR'E GONNA GET A BIG BENEFIT!", "YESSIREE, A BIG BIG ONE!" (And once you do, you gotta come give an experience, do more shakubuku, more activities in appreciation and more zaimu next May!" / Oh, and if you don't, well, then you better "re-examine" your faith (more cult lingo) and redouble all your cult org. efforts. Either way, they always win, if you let them.)

I do seem to be genetically predisposed to getting the last word in and at this point, it feels like sport. No one has ever accused me of being overly mature. Since I don't have anybody's addresses any more, it'll have to be an email; I love the sound of "Taiten and proud," if TAP doesn't mind me borrowing the moniker. I will need to add "not giving up, happy as crap, and leave me the frak alone." I may mention a restraining order just to give their chain a jiggle . . . most of them don't know any better anyway. It won't make a whit of difference to them; they will sigh about my delusions and just get in touch with me next May to see if I've come to my senses, want to kiss and make up, and remind that it's time for me to make a great cause by forking my dollars over.

Meanwhile, the calls seem to be coming in.