Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: November 27, 2012 06:50AM

Interesting to note, in the YWD clip posted above (here again, []), in a room full of "members", there are literally only a few people not completely "with the program."

They can be spotted sitting (not standing) during the song at the 1:19 - 1:21 min. mark, down in the front. There's also another lady standing with her arms crossed in the back, alone, looking not too thrilled with what's going on.

It's this minority group that has critical thinking knocking on the door. I know, because I was exactly like that and went thru the same kind of uncomfortable experiences, especially during those moments of mindless group manipulation. I hope people like them find this mb, read and listen to that inner voice telling them something just isn't right.


More FNCC Cult Retreat Propaganda for "YOUTH!"

Welcome to "Ikeda University", become "Peace Rangers" now: []

Note the part at ~ 1:14 min. mark, the dressing down of the "members" -

"You have to OBEY, in order to manifest your buddha-hood, completely, COMPLETELY!!"

They are, of course, talking about The Dear Leader, Ikeda.

Also, notice the YMD who didn't get with the program at 1:50 min. mark, is left out, alone, then transforms into an ideal Ikeda-bot YMD automaton (white shirt, red tie, etc.) and becomes HAPPY!!

The brainwashing details are there, in the clip, for all to see. It may be "humor", but it speaks volumes.


- Hitch

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: November 27, 2012 09:13AM

Not sure if this has ever been posted before:


"When I was working at a (relatively prestigious) firm in Tokyo not too long ago, I noticed through casual conversations with the support staff that there were lots of graduates of Sokka University, SGI’s client institution of higher learning in Hachioji, Tokyo. I mentioned this in passing to my secretary, who had been with the company for more than 15 years, and let me in on what had, and was, happening: as much as 1/2 of the support staff were Sokka Gakkai members. The reason? The head of HR, appointed in 2003, was a member of SGI, and since taking the position had worked hard to surround herself only SGI members. This had come both at the expense of work quality, frustration among non-Sokka Gakkai members of the staff, and had resulted in many valued people leaving for other work. Indeed, the firm was (and is) facing a support staff shortage, and this is reportedly one of the reasons. What’s perhaps more amusing (or tragic), the Western heads of the organization are oblivious to this internal dynamic.

My conclusion: Sokka Gakkai members do join organizations and “infiltrate” them, trying their dardnest to work for SGI’s interests inside the organization. It’s insidious and darn-right creepy, and I’m glad that this Japan Times incident has been made public so people know that this kind of stuff is happening (especially foreigners who may not be aware of this cult-like entity, of which one in ten Japanese people are a member)."


The above, taken from the comments section of this [] article "Japan Times infiltrated by Soka Gakkai?" The "Japan Times" commonly runs op-ed pieces penned by Ikeda, especially around New Year's Time (see article link for an on-line archive to some of the originals).

An interesting article, with equally interesting comments following.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Date: November 27, 2012 05:19PM

There are so many interesting things being posted on this board. I try to keep up. I feel like I was truly more peaceful before I came across chanting Nam Myoho Renge Kyo.

Recently, I visited a Nichiren Shu Temple (Not the same as Nichiren Shoshu, as you probably already know) to see what they do there. I ran into a former Soka Gakkai/ Nichiren Shoshu Practitioner there. What I learned from him was that they only chant at the Nichiren Shu Temple for enlightenment, and not for earthly desires. It was the chanting for things like more drugs and sex, or things like that, that create karma. Is that true?

I know this board is more about talking about leaving chanting altogether, so I hope I haven't offended anyone with my question. I am just trying to unwind my connection to this organization known as the SGI. I sometimes blame myself for getting involved, and having it so drastically change my life.

I didn't know what struggle was before coming to SGI. I had a pretty peaceful life. Everyone I have met in the SGI, seems to have life-changing obstacles all the time. Is this true, or is this my imagination?

Before chanting, I wasn't afraid to drive at all. I have developed this horrific fear of driving, and on top of it, I also don't have as much prosperity as I once did.

I want out! I know I can just leave, but I wish I could unlearn Nam Myoho Renge Kyo, and it hasn't been that easy. The reason being is that part of me still thinks it could work, and that everything they told me in the SGI might be true. Okay, that's enough for now! Thanks for listening!

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: tsukimoto ()
Date: November 27, 2012 08:59PM


As far as chanting is concerned -- some people who've posted here, still chant, some don't. People were chanting long before the Soka Gakkai ever existed. Nam myoho renge kyo does not belong to Ikeda or SGI -- no matter what they tell you. Some posters have joined other Buddhist groups, some have become Christian, some don't practice any formal religion. Do what is right for you.

I don't think that chanting for drugs or sex is a good thing, but as to whether it creates karma -- who knows? Your guess is as good as anybody's.

As to whether SGI has made you more anxious -- it probably has. This is how they hook people in. Everyone's life has ups and downs. SGI encourages members to think of these normal ups and downs as karma, and as being related to their chanting and involvement in SGI. It can be very seductive, just the promise that if you chant enough, and do enough for SGI, you can have anything you want. Several years after leaving SGI, I still can't read online "experiences." I just get sucked in! I find myself wanting to dream some huge dream and then chant a lot to make it happen.

The downside is, when you don't achieve your big dream, when you have problems -- it's easy to start thinking that it's all your fault, that you are not chanting enough, or doing enough for SGI. The anxiety and guilt can increase. You chant and do more for SGI, and still no resolution -- it becomes a vicious, and stressful cycle. There is also the fears that SGI puts into its members -- leave, or question SGI, and your life will go to hell in a handbasket. I didn't realize how much of that I really had until I did begin questioning SGI. I felt anxiety just reading websites where people were criticizing SGI. That in itself made me think -- "What's going on here? Why am I so afraid of just reading someone's opinion?"

It can be scary and stressful to leave SGI, but I have been out for six years now, and my post-SGI life is much more peaceful than my life in SGI. Sometimes my circumstances are great, and sometimes I have struggles -- just like when I was in SGI. The difference is that I accept that life is sometimes going to be difficult -- not because I'm a bad person, not because I've done something to create bad karma, not because I am not chanting enough and giving my all to SGI. I just have difficulties because that's part of life -- for EVERYONE. I take what action I can -- but without that crushing sense of "Oh, God, I've created bad karma, I've chanted a lot and nothing's happening, what's wrong with me, I'm a bad Buddhist, and maybe I deserve this!"

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Shavoy ()
Date: November 28, 2012 04:21AM

tsukimoto's post here brought to mind a concept that was told to us frequently. That being, you will and do have problems in life, you cannot escape them--HOWEVER--by chanting and giving your all to the SGI, you will develop the state of Buddhahood--indestructible happiness--where you will feel true happiness always, no matter what nasty karma's on the plate.

Sooooooo, as long as you chug on down with the program (and now, accept D.I. as The True Mentor), you will achieve this marvelous state!

How many die-harders have confessed to this achievement? I didn't get a lot of that.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: November 28, 2012 05:08AM

Deceptive "front" advertising for the $oka cult [].

Come and join our "noble" goal (bait), you may never realize you've joined a cult (switch).

- Hitch

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: November 28, 2012 05:19AM

For Findingmywaytoday - []

"Meditation may not always be good for you

There are many kinds of meditation being promoted by various individuals, groups, and cults.
Like many cultic groups, meditation cults have varying degrees of membership and commitment, which become known to members only as time goes on. Those who sample only the beginning course may have little or no knowledge of what a long-term association may entail.
A number of persons in the United States have brought legal suits for damages allegedly suffered as a consequence of their participation in meditation programs. Settlements to the individuals were made by the organization offering the programs.

Meditation Casualties

The forgoing brief of the work of several researchers supports my observations based on interviewing or providing therapy to more than seventy persons who had meditated from four to seventeen years in various groups.
A few examples will illustrate these former members' range of impairments, some of which remain after many years out of the cultic group.

Blackout, lack of sensory filters, and anxiety attacks.
Fog and space
Altered states and memory difficulties
Loss of boundaries
Inappropriate and unrelated bursts of emotions
Muscle jerking
Long term emotional flatness
Visual hallucinations

Is Meditation ever beneficial?

Meditation, in itself, is not good or bad. But when a venal person wants to sell you courses and persuade you to turn over your life to him, you must beware. If you end up a slave to a money-making power-seeking organization that pays no heed to the real difficulties you may experience as a result of certain practices, that is a bad use of those powerful practices."


I once got into an argument with a clutch of pioneer members, that the magic chant (etc.) was *just* a form of "meditation." Oh boy, oh boy, .... did they ever hit the roof with that one.

- Hitch

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Rothaus ()
Date: November 29, 2012 12:32AM

@ Findingmywaytoday
Well it comes natural that you will find quite an amount of differences when comparing what you have learned and practised while with SGI to the rest of Nichiren Buddhism and indeed Buddhism as a whole.
Another difference is that in many other, lets say traditional, Nichiren Schools you will not come across such as extensive chanting marathons and indeed see more weight being given to Buddhist studies. Also other forms of (silent) meditation and calligraphy are being practised. At any rate I can relate to the fact that you are now finding out more about Nichiren Buddhism. This is something I did as well only to realise that what is being thought in SGI a little to do with Buddhism or even Nichiren Buddhism. I have not joined any other group yet – if I ever were it would be Nichiren Shu, but nothing rushes me on that one – not even ministers from Nichiren Shu.
What I also found helpful is to get a neutral opinion on Nichiren Buddhism. I have mentioned the book before, but if you can get a hold of ‘Fire in the Lotus’ by Danie B. Montgomery it will give you quite an insight into Nichiren Buddhism form a relatively neutral point of view. It is out of print now but maybe you can get hold of a second hand copy via Amazon or inter library system. I found it to be fascinating read, especially because half of what I was told about other Nichiren Schools by SGIists turned out to be lies anyway. At the time I got the book I was still in SGI … but already sceptical enough to realise that when I mentioned the book to other SGIists they turned up their noses it must be a good book then.

So in the end rationalising that what you have practised all those years is not really what you have thought to have practised is a good learning process too. And as another forum member said we all made various decisions after leaving SGI. Some joined other Nichiren Schools, other Buddhist traditions / religions or became agnostics.

In the end Religion in itself is in my books nothing bad per se, mostly it’s the “ground personnel” that messes things up :-)

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Rothaus ()
Date: November 29, 2012 06:09AM

Note the part at ~ 1:14 min. mark, the dressing down of the "members" -

"You have to OBEY, in order to manifest your buddha-hood, completely, COMPLETELY!!"

They are, of course, talking about The Dear Leader, Ikeda

... well from what I see in the video they still stuff that down peoples throat about the priests ... for gods sake these kids did not even shit their pants when that occured. And as as they did not do so they won't realise that the priest or his supposed role has been replaced by to obey to Ikeda. This is so sick folks.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: November 29, 2012 08:24AM

I came across the two posts below, outside of this regular "SGI" thread, and would like to respond to them here, within the main thread (because many may miss them otherwise, like I did) -

Sorry about the re post, I am new to this forum. This is where I meant to put it.
This is my first post. I have been practicing Theravada for 4 years now. I do both sitting and walking meditation daily. I strive to be mindful always. So when I met a lovely woman who said she was a Buddhist thought this could be a great relationship. As I got to know her though she said she couldn't date me because I practiced Theravada. I had never heard of such a thing from any Buddhist (religious prejudice). I then found out that she was SGI. I went to a concert at their New York City center and I couldn't believe how different it was from where I practice. People talking about their greed and envy as if it were a good thing. Totally the opposite of what I practice. I then did some research online and to my surprise on the bottom of the Google page (for suggested alternate searches) was SGI cult. That is how I found this site. So after doing more research on SGI, both on what they had to say and from the many people who had negative things to say about it this is my opinion. I do not think SGI is Buddhism- it ignores so much of what Buddha taught. Buddha was enlightened by meditating, not by chanting. Buddha gave up a life of luxury to find an end to suffering, not to chant for greed and possessions he chose to gave up. If they are going to follow what Nichiren taught call it Nichirism. Who was Nichiren to say what really is Buddhism? Who was he to say that other forms of Buddhism are inferior? He is to Buddhism what David Koresh and Jim Jones are to Catholicism- a self serving, bastardization, half truth. And a half truth is a full lie. Back to the ex girl friend. When I told her that her reasons for leaving me were religious prejudice, She got very excited and asked to explain herself. She said she was brought up this way, that that is what SGI taught her. In doing my research I have found this to be true- SGI teaches prejudice. Yet they claim to be for world peace. Sounds kind of like the Nazis. I asked her if she was brought up in Hitler youth would it be alright to hate Jews. She had no response.
Now is what I wrote attachment? I don't think so. I think I am stating how things really are, not wishing they are different. If you think I am wrong please post a reply.
Metta to ALL,
Theravada Guy

I am just going to share a little bit more as to why I chose to leave SGI. I can recall about two years ago, I was dating a member who was emotionally and verbally abusive. To make a long story short he dumped me in a way that was extremely cruel, almost to the point that I am sure that he is a sociopath. I remember telling one of the members and the only support that I got was: Kiesha this is buddhism working in it's way for you. You must chant for his happiness. A long time ago a woman was at a meeting and there was a guy who was sitting across from her she felt a connection to him so, she introduced herself to him and asked if he would like to come over and chant with her. The man ended up raping her. [This member later ended up telling me that it was meant for this to happen because she chose this life in a past life]. I was shocked and appalled but yes I did stay. I stayed because I was in tremendous pain and really depended on these people. This was about two years ago. I never really was quite the same after that and in the back of my mind somewhere knew that I would end up leaving, I just did not know when until the day after yesterday. A few of the young women struggled as a result of being in relationships and were basically told the same thing. That they should chant for someone else's happiness who had treated them so badly. I swear to God it was like being in a soap opera that I could not get out of, but I sincerely wanted to be enlightened. I tried my hardest. I will say this, the only thing that the chanting has done has, subdued my anxiety and made me feel better. Has it made me feel happy? I don't know and don't think so. It's ok though, because I believe that happiness is a concept that is sometimes abstract and very concrete. I get happy if I hear a song from my past, see a smiling baby, etc. etc. It's kind of sad to me that a quote such as Nam Myo Ho Renge Kyo is used for ulterior motives instead of what it should be used for and that is to make people feel at ease or happiness if they choose to. Nam Myo Ho Renge Kyo is a good thing, at least I believe, but other people have taken it and have chosen to turn it in to something else. Once again thanks for everyone's support who've responded to my messages. This is somewhat of a difficult time for me but I know that I can be happy in this lifetime without the SGI.

Being manipulated and abused by other psychotic "members", or even worse, so-called "leaders", is something that I've seen happen to others from my time growing up in the $oka Gakkai U.S.A. cult org.. It was always twisted back onto the victim as somehow being a mystic or karmic destiny, to encounter such an episode or individual within the cult org. / this lifetime, etc.. In essence, an "opportunity" for the victim to expand their "life condition", face their "karma" head-on, chant for the "abuser" to become a better person, as well as themselves in the process, and change their "heavy" or "thick" karma.

Some really sick, dysfunctional, self-serving and warped psychology going on.

It wasn't a common occurrence, but I saw a few cases. I saw and knew enough from experience to recognize these types of psycho "members" and keep my distance. In fact, I was pursued by a few dysfunctional gakkai cult member ladies over the years from my time in. In one case, the girl was just really, extremely, mentally fragile (truly messed up in head and should be seeing a psychiatrist regularly) and in the other two cases extremely controlling, manipulative (sorry for the bluntness) aggressive, nut-jobs. In ALL cases, I instinctively knew to stay away, keep at arms length and walk in the opposite direction.

There is definitely a subset of whacked out members who are walking time-bombs, just waiting to go off on others. Of course, you can potentially find this anywhere in life, but the ones that I saw and encountered in the cult org., at least to me, seemed to be downright extreme and dangerously toxically volatile.

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