Re: Soka Gakkai \-- SGI, fusing your Identity with Godman Ikeda
Posted by: The Anticult ()
Date: February 27, 2012 04:14AM

How the heck can you "understand Sensei's heart"?? Be his "arms and legs"? "Chant to be Sensei's disciple", "Chant to fulfill Sensei's expectations of you"....

Cleary those are techniques taken from the sense of becoming "One" with the object of worship or God, in this case the fake Godman Ikeda.

But what most people don't know, that is also a technique from hypnosis, where a persons Identity is "fused" with a certain concept.
Basically, a human mind can believe anything, including believing the person has become One with Ikeda, and is Ikeda's appendage. (sorry for the image).

In persuasion engineering, people are encourage to FUSE their core Identity with the leader of the cult, as a follower. Its very powerful stuff. And clearly Ikeda knows all about it, as he is pushing the Master/Slave dynamic.

Luckily, this mental brainwashing can be reversed, by using the techniques like judo.
Byron Katie uses the exact same technique as Ikeda in this area.
The cult leader has fused themselves deep into the psyche of the follower, and they need to be kicked out of the mind.

IDEAS on how to KICK-OUT byron katie from your Mind-Soul-Life forever

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Shavoy ()
Date: February 27, 2012 05:20AM

@The in a way, too, this fusion, this One with Ikeda, means in essence that followers will lose their individual identities, and become mini-Ikedas? Is this also a end result desired by the Masters?

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: bobze39 ()
Date: February 27, 2012 06:49AM

@bobze39, your experience is triumphant, indeed! So did the defamation hinge on the fact that your advisor was gay solely, were there other things they tried to dig up in vain to get to you? All those emails alone--yikes. So ridiculous.

Shavoy, I'd like to share with you a bit what I learned from Defamation 101 class, which I took in USC and later in life (figuratively speaking).
It doesn't really matter what you say about the person. The point is to keep attention of people on the person. So when you send blanket e-mails to the person's coworkers, it really doesn't matter what you say as soon as email contains the person's name and photo. There is only one message "WATCH OUT FOR THIS PERSON". It's really enough. Read the excerpt from Tsukimoto's post on page 308:

Yes, this is quite different than the memo sent out to the public, that Simplify posted. The language of the whole Kitano memo is very militaristic. The SGI leadership regarded the SGI/Nichiren Shoshu split as a war, and they consider it justifiable, even good, to do the following:

1. Perform surveillance on people who have joined, or who have expressed interest in, Nichiren Shoshu.
2. Phone people's homes, and listen for background noise.
3. Keep written lists of SGI members/former members who have joined, or expressed interest in Nichiren Shoshu.
4. Monitor priests' activities; confront and harass priests.
5. Members are to seek out information on Nichiren Shoshu priests and lay members, and report this information to their leaders.
6. Members are to pretend an interest in, and friendship for, Nichiren Shoshu members, with the goal of persuading these members to return to SGI.
7. Distribute priests' pictures and information about their whereabouts as if the priests are suspected criminals.
Look at the instruction No.7. Did you notice that the instruction doesn't specify what to say about priests? Because it's enough to attract people's attention to them, to ask people to "watch out" for them. That's the real art of defamation! When people watch out for someone, they already look at this person with prejudice. They start misinterpreting his words, and they are afraid of him, so they start distancing themselves from this person. That's it! The goal is achieved. Because the real goal of defamation is to isolate someone socially. Then it will be difficult for this person to get a job, to maintain income, to survive.

Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2012 06:51AM by bobze39.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Nichijew ()
Date: February 27, 2012 06:50AM

@The in a way, too, this fusion, this One with Ikeda, means in essence that followers will lose their individual identities, and become mini-Ikedas? Is this also a end result desired by the Masters?

Who or what one devotes oneself to determines one's identity. Since SGI members devote themselves to Ikeda, a greedy liar, they become greedy liars. Another example is a crack or crank addict who devotes themselves to smoking crack or crank. Such a one ends up dead, diseased, or in jail. The devotees of Manson ended up in jail. The devotees of Ikeda invariably end up disillusioned, unhappy, and with many regrets [for their greed and lies]. On the other hand, those who devote themselves to helping others, mastering an instrument, or following a wise and compassionate man or woman, for example, attain varying degrees of fulfillment and benefit to society.

How many of us have lied for Ikeda and the Soka Gakkai? How many of us overextended ourselves to reveal actual proof, only to have suffered some loss [financial, psychological, or spiritual]? I feel sorry for SGI members and the non-salaried leaders and I wish to protect others from suffering the same fate. For this reason I never fail to speak out about the Soka Gakkai. I have been doing so for the better part of 17 years. The cult education forum is of invaluable utility for this end. Again, many thanks to Rick Ross, the moderators, to anti-cult, and my fellow posters.


Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: holly_golightly ()
Date: February 27, 2012 07:33AM


Whoa, holly....what you went through was nuts! How the heck can you "understand Sensei's heart"?? Be his "arms and legs"? "Chant to be Sensei's disciple", "Chant to fulfill Sensei's expectations of you"....Jeesh. All this for a man whom the majority have/will never have a one-on-one encounter with, let alone conversation, or personal "guidance".

If you're Herbie Hancock, or Wayne Shorter, or Orlando Bloom, well, different story, always.

Looking back, holly, what did you really think of "The Human/New Human Revolution", anyway? Why more members/leaders didn't pick up on the mass ego running through the pages, I dunno.

Yes, it was crazy :) But as I was surrounded by many people who all thought it was perfectly normal (or who acted like they did) and it all become very ordinary because we talked about and used those phrases all the time. I know the 'arms and legs' thing sounds bizarre. The way it was explained to me was that as Sensei couldn't be at our activity centre, we would have to be there as representatives of Sensei for the members. But as Anticult says, there was definiately a bit of 'fusing with the identity of the leader' going on there. In fact the whole 2 year activity's specific aim (or how it was sold to me) was to solidify my master/disciple relationship with Sensei, so there was no escape!

And yes, those Human/New Human Revolution books................ Well when I first read the New Human Revolution I thought it was the most boring book I'd ever read, and like a painful austerity to get through. I also thought that the Shinichi character was incredibly boastful and false. However, when I became a leader there was a big drive on understanding these books with our 'heart' (there's that word again). I was advised to look beyond the superficial and to try and understand the intent behind Sensei's words. I gave it a go on the understanding that I hadn't understood them properly before.

So I tried my best to get through all the volumes of the human revolution first. I remember there was a big campaign based around Volume 10 of the Human Revolution. It seemed to last for months and it was all based on a couple of pages (about victory and nothing being impossible). I desperately tried to get something out of the fact that I had to keep reading the same pages again and again. I chanted loads to try and 'understand with my heart' etc. Anyway, I thought that we finally had the Human Revolution volume 10 done and dusted but when I moved areas I was told that there was a new campaign starting with ......................... Volume 10 of the Human Revolution!!!

As I read my way through these volumes, I wondered why all the amazing things being described weren't actually happening where I was practising. I think I had got my way to the New Human Revolution when I came on here and found out that Ikeda didn't actually write them anyway! I felt a bit of a fool trying to 'understand his heart with his words' when they were actually written by someone else. But it did me a favour finding that out because it was the first thing that made me realise how deluded I had become. A bit like Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz when she looks behind the curtain and sees a disappointing man (did I read that here?). Sometimes shattered illusions can be the best wake up call.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: February 27, 2012 08:17AM

I'm sure these have been posted before (but I repost them in order to make a point regarding the above discussion) -

1. Part 1 (All Japanese) []
2. Part 2 (All Japanese) []

3. Selected excerpts (English subtitles) []

Is this the behavior of a human being that anyone in their right mind would choose to follow (operative words here are "right mind"). Is this how a wise, compassionate "master" (I use the term "master", because that was how it was always drilled into the members before the more pc term, "mentor", took over) treats sincere "disciples" who have devoted their lives in service to his goals (e.g., Mr. "Williams"). Anyone with two eyes can see for themselves that there is some rubbing of salt into wounds and public humiliation going on here with regards to Mr. "Williams." Although they can see, they cannot comprehend, because faith is willful blindness.

If this is the kind of behavior that members strive to emulate, then I say "no thanks." In my experience growing up with the organization, they do indeed regularly behave in such a manner - in fact, much worse. It is an unscrupulous organization that is superficially tolerant of even its own members/leaders and completely intolerant of any dissent. It's a cult that has hijacked religion. It uses the same tactics (credulity) to exploit members by enslaving their minds (and pocketbooks) to metaphysical dogma, primitive (fearful) thinking and superstitious-magical practices.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: February 27, 2012 09:29AM

Btw, I forgot to add that the portion re: "Williams" can be seen at the beginning of part 2. And incidentally, I know one of those clumsy wanna-be Ikeda secret service agent bodyguards that escorts him to the stage in part 1. It is quite amusing to me because I shall just say that, although he has mastered the professional football player wearing a suit look perfectly, in reality, he is in fact dumber than a box of hair.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2012 09:29AM by Hitch.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Hitch ()
Date: February 27, 2012 02:11PM

With Nelson Mandela in the news recently, it reminded me of a gakkai anecdote that I experienced and have always remembered for its revealing pettiness.

Back in the 90's Ikeda met with Mandela in Japan and hot news burning up the gakkai WD grapevine at the time was how Mandela was falling asleep during his meeting with the dear leader. It was discussed in a manner and tone implying that it was an inappropriate, severe indiscretion and rude display by an invited guest. It was shortly after Mandela won the Nobel Peace Prize, too. I chalked it all up to a bit of jealousy, since it is an open gakkai secret that Ikeda is highly covetous of the same.

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: rattyboy ()
Date: February 27, 2012 11:49PM

I have planning to respond to KR's post on the previous page. So many posts since then. Some thoughts on recent topics:
FNCC - I was watching a Youtube video titled FNCC 2011 and saw the usual window dressing, "Good for Business" tactics and courting of members. I have never been to FNCC or on Tozan back in the day, by the way. Why would you travel to Florida to sit in a windowless room and subject yourself to wall size images of the 3 presidents projected on the wall? The same images members have front and center on the altar. A courtyard has 3 umbrellas over some tables. One red. One yellow. One Blue. Mentor/ Disciple quotes over a doorway with the same picture of the young Ikeda receiving honors. Flags from many nations are in the dining commons in case you don't notice the cultural diversity in the room while you chomp on lobster tail and other SGI "food porn" as the videographer calls it. And the ultimate display of compassion is a neat basket of feminine products in the bathroom. Some of this is presented humourously in the usual way I have seen members ride that line between taking this stuff seriously and maintaining a connection with everyday life. In my own district I grew tired of hearing: "So and so from youth division just came back from FNCC." ooooh. Let them give their experience at the discussion meeting. The first details I had heard from a YMD, while on the way to a meeting, is that it was like a palace and "hot ladies" were everywhere and you get treated like a king. There's the window dressing.
Going on Tozan (back in the NSA days) - I was told by a leader that I would have a burning desire to go to Japan and be in the presence of High Sanctuary. If I didn't say it out loud I'm sure my facial reaction said something like "I don't think so".

Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by: Shavoy ()
Date: February 28, 2012 05:00AM

bobze39, thanks for bringing out how defamation works, how it's more subtle than banging someone over the head outright. That SGI did/does that, gives the creeps. So much for respecting the dignity of every human being.

@Nichijew. Your post made me think about the sincere long-time members I know, who truly believe that they have benefitted from following Ikeda. They believe he is a wise and compassionate human being giving them the blueprint on a happy life. They really believe that. And there's something about several of their demeanors which makes me believe that, for now, at least--that's the case for them. You gave another side, which I didn't think of. A big thing for me has been the idea that Ikeda will be happier than a piglet in you-know-what knowing that a mass chunk of people want to be his mini-me. What better ego-stroke?

@holly_golightly...still spinning over reading that whole Human Revolution stuff you went through. When it came up that it was more than likely ghost-written, he still had approval over the final product. So that he, as the Hero, comes across, like you said, 'incredibly boastful and false', doesn't seem to bother him one iota. Did anyone ever try to challenge the content in these sessions? 'Representatives of Sensei for the members'........

@Hitch....bodyguards? Really? I still think he'd love to be Oprah, but now I'm throwing in John, Paul, Ringo and George. Natch for the Nobel Peace Prize.

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