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Hitch
As alluded to by Nichijew, behind closed doors the top leadership pines for various degrees of Dear Leader relics. When I was in, so-called third degree / class relics were common. Salaried and top non-salaried "leaders" would often go ga-ga over items / gifts directly from Sensei (something signed, a handwritten message, or something stamped with his emblem, etc.). I've also seen Ikeda calligraphy, stamped emblem furoshiki being given to selected people (I even got a couple during my time in the YMD.).

The gakkai cult org. has since gone on steroids and graduated to second degree / class relics . . . . (again, see below) .

Yes, you've reminded me that I was told one of them was a "gift from sensei". I thought, "as if, but whatever". Same as any other little trinket like pencils, pens, booklets, cards, etc. Unless you give it to me personally and say whatever, I don't make the connection. Especially if they are thousands of miles away and I have never met them.

What is this degree stuff? I know of the exams and some people didn't react too kindly. I didn't see the big deal. Honestly, it's just a rote memorization test. Soon after, it's useless and forgotten. I don't know if they are still doing them since people seem to have an issue with it and it was taken out of practice for a while I guess. I still have a left over feeling that my every action and word was being analyzed and it ended up being all for nothing. Ha!

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sleepy skunk
Yes, you've reminded me that I was told one of them was a "gift from sensei". I thought, "as if, but whatever". Same as any other little trinket like pencils, pens, booklets, cards, etc. Unless you give it to me personally and say whatever, I don't make the connection. Especially if they are thousands of miles away and I have never met them.

I've always felt the same. Whenever they said, "this is from Sensei", I always had to suppress the urge to roll my eyes and desire to say, "Yeah RIGHT!"

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sleepy skunk
What is this degree stuff? I know of the exams and some people didn't react too kindly. I didn't see the big deal. Honestly, it's just a rote memorization test. Soon after, it's useless and forgotten. I don't know if they are still doing them since people seem to have an issue with it and it was taken out of practice for a while I guess. I still have a left over feeling that my every action and word was being analyzed and it ended up being all for nothing. Ha!

I was just joking on the relics discussion.

See here, [catholiceducation.org] -

QUOTE:

"There are three classes of sacred relics. The first-class is a part of the saint’s body. (It is this type which is placed in an altar stone.) The second-class is a piece of the saint’s clothing or something used by the saint, while the third-class is an object which has been touched to a first-class relic."

They do, however, really do this kind of stuff with Dear Leader items now. It's always in hardcore circles, which by definition includes salaried leaders.

****

I remembered the study exams, too, though. I absolutely hated them, with a passion, along with the study meetings. Meaningless, easy tests that any chimp with a pencil could take. I forgot how high I got, but I think it was pretty high up, before I dropped out of the cult org.. There was always pressure to take the tests and climb higher in the "study department." I always thought of it as a kind of mandatory, self-inflicted brainwashing, so the cult org. could officially keep track of, record and monitor how far along you get. I think it was also used as a yardstick to be promoted along and into different levels of leadership positions, too. I was forced to take them by the cult org., because I never had any desire for their certificates or leadership positions.


- Hitch



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/27/2013 02:20PM by Hitch.

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They do, however, really do this kind of stuff with Dear Leader items now. It's always in hardcore circles, which by definition includes salaried leaders.

This bit about 'relics' is fascinating.

Are they for private sale to or among hardcore members?

Used as marks of distinction in place of paying salaries?

Here is a difference between Roman Catholic relics as described above, and SGI 'relics'.

When relic veneration was at its height (early middle ages to about the mid to high middle ages), the days when relics were encased in gold and gems, and relics were tied to political power and legitimacy, an authenticated relic had value throughout the Roman Catholic world.

And because it was part of the social belief norm, there was no need to conceal one's veneration for relics. Indeed, large pilgrimage journeys took place. (The one to Saint James of Compostella was the most important, but one among many).

By contrast, the SGI 'relics' would have some value only within SGI, and appears to be kept a secret and only shared among hard core members and those deemed worthy to be allowed to know about this and other insiders knowledge.

So this relic veneration in SGI does not give connection to a larger social world, not the way the old Catholic relic veneration and pilgrimages did and still do.

(PS There are discussions on a quite different but guru led group in America and led by an American born guru. There, the serious devotees drink water used to wash the feet of the guru. Toenail clippings from the guru, too. That is something one would keep quite secret from a disbelieving larger society.

To dare entertain doubts would force people to recall what they did and this is humiliating. )

[www.google.com]

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Chris Butler JAGAD GURU SIDDHASWARUPANANDA ... - YouTube
of her husband Chris Butler nail clippings . ... THAT THEY WILL GET GREAT SPIRITUAL ...
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And...again it would be interesting to find out if Ikeda's hardcore disciples pay for relics and how much.

And if his wash water and nail clippings are used in any special way, or disposed of in the the manner normal and ordinary in Japanese society.

Its considered an honor for devotees to do this with Butler's nail clippings.

As the British health adverts put it, "Fibre is your friend".

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corboy
This bit about 'relics' is fascinating.

Are they for private sale to or among hardcore members?

Used as marks of distinction in place of paying salaries?

Not many people know about this aspect of the $GI Cult. Many also won't or don't want to believe it. I've never seen or heard of any of Ikeda-associated items for sale amongst members, but they are definitely touted as status (or shall I say "fortune") symbols amongst hardcore member / leader circles. I can't speak as to the salary issues, but I do know that salaried leaders are expected to (re)contribute portions of their own salaries BACK TO the Cult Org. during formal zaimu campaigns.

As a random side note, I will also say that if you take any salaried leader, and I don't care how "normal" they may appear, or how in control of their demeanor they may usually be, . . . . . if you place them within physical proximity of The Dear Leader Ikeda, especially right in front of him, you will see them either sweat bullets, go ga-ga, or even break down and cry (or all of the above).

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corboy
By contrast, the SGI 'relics' would have some value only within SGI, and appears to be kept a secret and only shared among hard core members and those deemed worthy to be allowed to know about this and other insiders knowledge.

So this relic veneration in SGI does not give connection to a larger social world, not the way the old Catholic relic veneration and pilgrimages did and still do.

(PS There are discussions on a quite different but guru led group in America and led by an American born guru. There, the serious devotees drink water used to wash the feet of the guru. Toenail clippings from the guru, too. That is something one would keep quite secret from a disbelieving larger society.

To dare entertain doubts would force people to recall what they did and this is humiliating. )

It is definitely not discussed openly, only with those who "understand" the world of "faith" in Sensei / the "Mentor-Disciple" (Master-Slave) relationship, "with their whole heart."

Keeping it within hardcore, behind closed door, circles, is indeed an implicit admission, by those doing it, that it is extreme, unusual and bizarre.

The first time, as a kid, when I witnessed pioneer (Japanese) members going ga-ga over Ikeda's handwritten message and hanko (official seal stamp), I thought, . . . . "whoa, how weird." As I've mentioned above, salaried leaders will also cry like a baby if they are singled out and given a personal message directed squarely at them, from Ikeda, acknowledging their Cousin Rufus efforts.

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corboy
And...again it would be interesting to find out if Ikeda's hardcore disciples pay for relics and how much.

I heard rumors of Ikeda acting as if certain items of his are special and I also know that he (or his office) sometimes gives out gakkai related items with his initials ("D.I.") inscribed on them. Again, they impart a special significance to receiving party and other members within the gakkai cult org..

A recent issue of The $GI Graphic (a large, full-color, Ikeda fan-club type publication), had photos of Japanese Women's Division members going ga-ga over being able to sit in the same spot / same seat as Ikeda did at a Gakkai Cult Org. building (it even showed the original picture, featuring Ikeda in the same spot and highlighted it in the description). Incidentally, this also occurred at a venue displaying Ikeda-Cousin-Rufus artifacts. So, the Gakkai Cult Org. is also becoming more and more open in their outward display of such behavior.

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corboy
And if his wash water and nail clippings are used in any special way, or disposed of in the the manner normal and ordinary in Japanese society.

Its considered an honor for devotees to do this with Butler's nail clippings.

As the British health adverts put it, "Fibre is your friend".

HAHA!

You bring up some excellent points, Corboy, and I think you may be on to something.


- Hitch

PS - In the old N$A Cult Org. (Nichiren Shoshu of America), leaders or special members were also honored with special mandala scrolls (gohonzons) personally inscribed with their names in Japanese, by the priesthood. These items are now, of course, just as magically cursed as they used to be "blessed" in times past. How quickly, and easily, things change.

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And because it was part of the social belief norm, there was no need to conceal one's veneration for relics. Indeed, large pilgrimage journeys took place. (The one to Saint James of Compostella was the most important, but one among many).

By contrast, the SGI 'relics' would have some value only within SGI, and appears to be kept a secret and only shared among hard core members and those deemed worthy to be allowed to know about this and other insiders knowledge.

So this relic veneration in SGI does not give connection to a larger social world, not the way the old Catholic relic veneration and pilgrimages did and still do.

(PS There are discussions on a quite different but guru led group in America and led by an American born guru. There, the serious devotees drink water used to wash the feet of the guru. Toenail clippings from the guru, too. That is something one would keep quite secret from a disbelieving larger society.

This was only because the Catholic Church controlled so much power within society and exerted so much influence that the countries where it reigned supreme came to be known as "Christendom." Those who did not wish to be a part of the Catholic system were imprisoned, tortured, even killed. THIS was the price that Catholic clergy eagerly accepted in exchange for their own rank and power. Back then, the Pope dictated law. The Catholic Church's power has significantly waned since its high in medieval times, and the clergy are none too happy about it. They will never be able to get that power back.

Ikeda wishes he could wield the power of a pope, but in order for that to be the case, the religion that idolizes him would need to become as widespread within society as the Catholic Church was, back when people were forced to belong to the Catholic Church under pain of death. This will never be; we are now too enlightened, referring to The Enlightenment, where the concept of basic and fundamental human rights first entered the human consciousness after the Catholic Church had enforced a strict monarchic-type system where only the leaders had power and rights, which, BTW, is the only system Jesus was apparently aware of. Ikeda would *love* to have a strict monarchic-type feudal system, with himself at the top, of course. Sorry, sucker. It's several hundred years too late for that sort of goal. In feudal societies, clergy enjoyed status equal to nobility; that's why Nichiren sought to have his religion installed as the only permitted one - it would have made him the equivalent of a king.

So back to the relics - you DO realize that people *kissed* mummified remains and bones, right? In fact, it was not unheard of for people to BITE OFF PIECES and take them home with them to their own churches, where they would then advertise their possession of this relic! During this same time frame, the corpses of executed criminals were torn apart and converted into all sorts of medicinal wares - from potions people would drink or rub on their skin, to amulets they would wear for protection, to pretty much anything you can imagine. A German medicinal catalog carried "mummia" up into the 1900s - that was some part of an Egyptian mummy. These were likewise ground up and consumed as medicinal ingredients:

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The eating of Christ's body, the devotion of the host and the cult of relics provided the background for so-called medicinal cannibalism, the eating of small pieces of mummies, powdered skulls, bone marrow and so forth, practices of European cannibalism that have only recently drawn the attention of scholars (Gordon-Gruber 1993; Himmelman 1997). Up to the mid-19th century, corpses of executed men and women were dismembered, torn to pieces, dried or mixed with other ingredients and sold as medicine. Shreds of human skin were worn as amulets, and in pharmacies the so-called 'Armsünderfett’ ('poor sinners' fat') from executed bodies could be bought to heal rheumatism and skin diseases (Brauneck 1978:71). Heike Behrend, Resurrecting Cannibals: The Catholic Church, Witch-Hunts, & the Production of Pagans in Western Uganda, 2011, CPI Group (UK) Ltd., Croydon, CRO 4YY, p. 49

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Bishop Hugh of Lincoln outraged the citizens of Fecamp (France), followers of Mary Magdalene, by chewing
on the relic of her arm bone, and saying that if he could touch the body of Christ in Mass, then he could
certainly chew the bones of a saint (Caroline Walker Bynum, “The Female Body and Religious Practice
in the Later Middle Ages” in Fragments of a History of the Human Body, eds. Michael Feher with
Ramona Naddaff and Nadia Tazi (New York: Zone Books, Part One, 1989)

Bishop Hugh was attempting to take a piece of this monastery's Magdalene arm bone back to his own church, but he didn't get anywhere with his dagger and resorted to finally chewing off a finger. The monks were not pleased O_O

The "connection to a wider social world" was only managed by the Church forcing everyone to join. Now, the Catholic cult of relics is regarded as ridiculous superstition and even an ignorant mindset stuck in the Middle Ages. Now, the pilgrimages to relic sites do *NOT* provide a connection to a larger social world; rather, such activities isolate people within society and cause them to be regarded with pity and derision. The veneration of Ikeda relics will fare no better - it will cause those who participate to be regarded as laughingstocks.

Because I think this is a *fascinating* topic:

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By the 16th century, cannibalism was not just part of the mental furniture of Europeans; it was a common part of everyday medicine from Spain to England.

Initially, little bits of pulverized mummies imported from Egypt were used in prescriptions against disease, but the practice soon expanded to include the flesh, skin, bone, blood, fat and urine of local cadavers, such as recently executed criminals and bodies dug up illegally from graveyards, says University of Durham's Richard Sugg, who published a book in 2011 called Mummies, Cannibals and Vampires: The History of Corpse Medicine from the Renaissance to the Victorians.

Medicinal cannibalism reached a feverish pitch around 1680, Sugg says. But the practice can be traced back to the Greek doctor Galen, who recommended human blood as part of some remedies in the 2nd century A.D., and it continued all the way into the 20th century. In 1910, a German pharmaceutical catalog was still selling mummy, says Louise Noble, who also wrote a book on the topic called Medicinal Cannibalism in Early Modern English Literature and Culture.

While Europeans ate "mummy" to cure their physical ailments, the same culture sent missionaries and colonists to the New World to cure New World indigenous people of their purported barbaric cannibalism, some of which was entirely fabricated as a rationale for conquest, Bowdler says. "It's certainly possible that Europeans were consuming more human flesh at the time than people in the New World," Sugg says.

"It's a big paradox," Noble adds. The term cannibal was being used to describe someone inferior while the "civilized in Europe were also eating bits of the human body," she says. [www.sott.net]

If you wish to see an example of how relic worship is now the subject of ridicule, see the circus surrounding the "Holy Foreskin". It has been in the news recently, to the great amusement of many of us. It was supposedly left behind after Jesus’s circumcision (in a dozen duplicates). [www.forbes.com]

The fact that John the Baptist's skull is exhibited entire in at least half a dozen places, including one skull that is supposedly from when he was a young boy, with pieces on display elsewhere, is enough to cause any sensible person to be repelled by the ignorance and superstition. When a doctrine is invented that a relic's authenticity is demonstrated by its magical ability to replicate itself, you know you've got a huge scam on your hands.

Thank you for your indulgence :)

What Hitch describes in salaried leaders is very interesting.

A split between public persona (normal citizen demeanor) vs devotee, thrill-to-the-guru persona.

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"...I will also say that if you take any salaried leader, and I don't care how "normal" they may appear, or how in control of their demeanor they may usually be, . . . . . if you place them within physical proximity of The Dear Leader Ikeda, especially right in front of him, you will see them either sweat bullets, go ga-ga, or even break down and cry (or all of the above).

It must take a lot of energy to keep that aspect of oneself hidden when going about life in non-SGI society.

Others who are in thrall to gurus may have this same issue. This is from yet another guru led group. But maybe it applies to SGI hard core members (?)


Mark Miller, in a letter originally published in Marin County Register back in the 1980s and later on the Lightmind forum wrote this about a guru named Adi Da/aka Da Free John.

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Mark Miller wrote,)

'The community is at root [a society devoted to glorification and myth-making in relation to DFJ, who is truly the ultimate example of "Narcissus", the mythical figure DFJ uses to describe those who are unenlightened. This supreme Narcissist requires the constant adoration of not only himself, but also of everything associated with him -- his properties and possessions (including the "holy sites"), and the "murtis" (pictures) of him, etc.

These inanimate objects serve as extensions of his huge ego, and the construction of them and/or worship of them serve to usurp huge amounts of devotees time and money.

''... Once people leave the group, there is no guarantee they will stop the "esoteric practice" Da Free John (DFJ) mythologization. That is just one reason why some people you've met who leave the group still believe in all kinds of nonsense about DFJ.

"It can be difficult to see all of the ways in which habitual mythologization is operative and to understand the full range and scope of its influence. Waking up can take time. Many can't seem to develop much insight into their delusions and commitment to myth-making about DFJ, beyond identifying the crudest and most obviously "cultic" level of it.
This is why some of the group's beliefs and assumptions are retained indefinitely by many people, even long after they leave. '

So, Miller suggested that it wasnt merely Da Free John himself, it was also an addict to a process of mythologizing. And unless people who left Da Free John could find a way to also examine their mythologizing processes, they might be at risk of sliding into a simliar relationship with another guru (that is to say, another sweaty human being who needs a change of underwear like anyone else yet encourages others to put him or her on a pedestal)

Let us also not forget the infamous Nichiren Daishonin (mystical) tooth, the "onikuge." Nichiren Shoshu has its own bizarre relics, too. It's human nature.

When I first heard about it, I think as a teenager, the first thing I did was ask some hardcore pioneer Japanese members about it. They were shocked I knew about it (this was way before the internet and I learned about it from a local university library that I was digging around in, in the process of informing myself, beyond the usual gakkai propaganda materials the cult org. proffered) and seemed reluctant to discuss it (by that time, I was also becoming increasingly skeptical of the gakkai cult org., too, so that might have had something to do with it, too . . . HAHA!)

I can't stress it enough, you gotta inform and educate yourself. It's the only defense against nonsense.


- Hitch

Believe it or not, I went back to the SGI. I missed chanting with others and it is really the only thing around here. There are no temples in this area. Since I have come back, I have been rather outspoken. I do not regret having left. I do not regret coming back. Does it still irritate the crap out of me sometimes? Yes. Yes, some people are zealots. There are zealots in any religion. I decided to use my SGI experiences to become stronger and better able to speak up for myself and others. It has gone well, but I have to be strong. As for the mentor disciple stuff, I am also outspoken about that as well. Then there is the Soka Spirit thing. I actually told a "leader" that the sign we had up about the priesthood was very negative and that as Buddhists we should be wishing them well and concentrating on our own issues. She had clearly heard it before. The next time I was at the center, the sign was gone and I have not seen it since. I think many of the problems with the SGI stem from the Post-War Japanese influence. What works in their society, does not work in ours. It needs to be Americanized. Americans are very individualistic. We are finally discussing this at meetings. Yahoo. I can definitely see how people have been damaged by this organization, and I do not regret leaving. I am back now though speaking my mind on a regular basis. If someone want to kick me out for speaking my mind, I won't be crushed. That has not (yet) happened, though. I am not sure that it will. I have hope that the organization will continue to mature even if it is not at the pace I would like to see. I, though, have to learn to deal with people I do not agree with. This is a great training ground for me as I am becoming an attorney. Once you stop acting like a sheep you will stop being treated like one.