What do lifelong salaried cult leaders tell their children one day when they are all grown up and become wise enough to ask their parent(s), "what have you done with your whole life, being a cult leader?" Or do the children never reach that point and simply become brainwashed admirers of their parents positions (possibly aspiring to the same), continuing the tradition themselves by enslaving their future children and grandchildren to the same con-job scam. Talk about "sad."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2012 02:30PM by Hitch.

Hello Forum Members,

I have been following this thread and felt the need to let you know that Sensei is a great person who knows each of your hearts and cries out when you stab at his precious organization with your harsh words. Working for peace, the Sucker Gakeye.................


Interesting how brainwashed members of this organization always have the same bullet point sheet that they use to espouse their cult head.


I have studied this forum for some time and I was at one time a SGI member. Aspects of the philosophy that they hijacked is very interesting and yet it's odd that an organization could be teaching something that goes directly against every action that the organization itself takes. The witches spell or evil eye scare tactic about leaving is horrid and definitely used to brow beat people from leaving.



What I found was odd manipulation, pressuring for money using simple yet effective tactics. Perhaps Zaimu, or the month of May contribution fund was indeed once a year but I think it's changing now as it has been every month since, with the money table out front so that everyone can see who is contributing and who isn't. Nothing private about the affair. Also, the born again, plant the money seed experiences are so cheap that you'd have to hate your life to sit through that crap. The "dear leader'" (got that from here) worship is ridiculous. Reading the same books over and over again, with the same meth head rhetoric, which is pathetic considering that the message is always to work hard for the cult and yet no one actually seems to be activating to the message. Just a tired loop of people who are too scared to leave and feel the price of worshipping a stranger is sufficient versus being home alone. Well, the SGI through the practice has the sneaky way of invading every aspect of your life as most people dump their entire being before the gohonzon. Very clever.


Also, the ethnocentric japanophile type worship. Many of the Western Members talk like English is their second language, their arm and hand gestures, the karate chop motion and saying "hai", it's really fucking wierd. Or western members up on stage singing in japanese with no translation provided.


I think that anyone who is freethinking and creative and wanders upon the SUcKeRGI ends up running away. The only people who seem to stick are the one's that must be sufffering from some personality disorder, though I understand some people on this forum participated in the SGI for many years so there is most likely complex social dynamics that can keep a person within it's walls. Let's be clear though, there are some that are highly neurotic and I have seen people talking to themselves, crying while chanting, or just spending their life at the community center.

I apologize for typing so much, but a first post contains a deluge of pent up experience. I could go on and on and will do so as a means to contribute to this forum and warn people. Not everyone will come into the SGI with critical faculties turned on and that is the danger. It looks harmless and inviting (sometimes).

Oh, and chanting , from my experience is unhealthy if done too much. Normally, if one has a problem, you fix it.

In the SGI,if you have a problem, you go to the gohonzon, or the middle man , the practice, SGI to then solve it. SGI gets a share of your success by virtue of including itself in your life through the practice. You then reward the SGI with money for your "success". It's dangerous and dissolves one's ablity to think and act on one's own, to think independently. It's something holding your hand 24/7.

I'll stop now....

Upgrayed wrote:I think that anyone who is freethinking and creative and wanders upon the SUcKeRGI ends up running away. The only people who seem to stick are the one's that must be sufffering from some personality disorder, though I understand some people on this forum participated in the SGI for many years so there is most likely complex social dynamics that can keep a person within it's walls.

Not exactly.

It isnt personalisty disorder.

SGI does heavy recruitment.

..I got pissed off and threw the phone at the wall, breaking it. Oops. This resulted in my having to borrow a phone set from the neighbor down the hall, who only loaned it on condition that I attend a "world peace" meeting with her.

The next night I was at a meeting in a house in Cambridge. "You should really join, the Gohonzon can do amazing things for you!" "It healed my cancer!" "Chanting saved my marriage!" and so on and so forth.

I joined. $20 fee to "rent" a Gohonzon for life. $35 for a butsudan (a box to hang the Gohonzon in). $75 for an altar set of candlesticks, incense burner, water cup, small plate, bowl shaped bell and small vase - all plastic. This was in 1985. I was earning about $200 a week at the time, after taxes....

read the rest here.

[forum.culteducation.com]


You're lured to recruitment set ups. And NOT TOLD IN ADVANCE. Thats being lied to. Calling it personality disorder puts the blame on the victims.

The Anticult wrote:



[forum.culteducation.com] still is going on.
Using "parties" as a way to lure new people to a SGI meeting.
And using this sexual lure, is a classic cult technique.
In SGI the pressure to recruit, drives people to use any technique that works to get bodies in the door.
Of course, most people at the bottom of SGI do all of this mindlessly without thinking.



Quote:
Freeheartandmind
In Chicago, the extracurricular activities were definitely more fun than the official NSA activities. Partying was a way to recruit people, who thought we were fun to be around. This was another reason it was hard to leave, your social life would disappear too.


[forum.culteducation.com]

SGI is truly evil to do this to vulnerable people.
Its evil.
When you are a multibillionaire like Ikeda and you order your underlings to exploit, manipulate and rob sick, broke, and vulnerable and desperate people, then you know you are EVIL, in the sense of being psychologically sick.

SGI targets these desperate people, and then shows them how to do a direct bank transfer of their emergency funds from their bank online to the SGI account.
Why?
Because unlike a credit card, there can be no chargebacks when you have remorse the next day.
THE MONEY IS GONE FOREVER TO SGI.

Its not like a contract with a 48 hour coolling off period.
Its not like a 30 day money-back guarantee for a product.

NO REFUNDS from SGI.

If SGI were not evil, then they might say..."give us your money and if your miserable life/karma has not improved in 30 days, you get a full refund".
Or why not a 1 year refund Karma guarantee?
If you give SGI your last $1000 of your emergency fund (and go hungry or get evicted from your home) and your life is still crap in 1 year, you get a full unconditional refund, plus interest of course.

Of course that is sarcasm.

SGI is a gross financial swindle, in the guise of a religion.
SGI swindles these vulnerable/desperate people out of their LAST DOLLARS, just like the crooked preacher on the radio/TV scamming elderly people.
SGI is the same thing, and much worse, as they are far bigger.

SGI is a massive financial swindle, in the guise of a fake religion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/17/2012 08:41AM by The Anticult.


and from The Anticult

[forum.culteducation.com]

Those SGI head-hunting stories are horrifying.
That is worse than Scientology.
Going to these people's houses, peering through windows, banging on all the doors, harrassing them.
That is worse than the Jehovah's Witnesses, who will go away when you tell them.

Anyone who has the faintest hope that SGI is not a "cult"... you have to look at things like taking a group of SGI people to a former SGI person's house, banging on the doors, peering through windows, and then trying to get the person back into the cult.
that is group intimidation, that is bullying, that is using psychological group peer-pressure to try and manipulate people and force them back to where they don't want to go.

For what?
So Ikeda-SGI gets more unpaid workers, so SGI can stockpile more BILLIONS of dollars in financial investments and real estate holdings in tax-shelters?

Fair enough Corboy. Not wanting to enter this forum with the wrong foot.


You do seem to be giving me a lecture, which is fine, so please continue to do so if you see something that should be corrected for the sake of this thread's health.

You make some very good points and perhaps you are right.

Because I used a set of reasons to leave this cult, some of that residue remains and therefore this logic slipped into my post.

If I offended anyone, please accept my apologies and I will be more aware in the future.

What I want, more than anything is to expose this organization for what it is.

Welcome Upgrayed. That's a great first post and one that I'd like to add some of my own thoughts to.

Quote
Upgrayed
Interesting how brainwashed members of this organization always have the same bullet point sheet that they use to espouse their cult head.

Agreed. I've heard it all. There isn't anything that they can say that I haven't already had thrown at me in the past. As a matter of fact, based on their stereotypical automaton patterns, I can usually quickly judge the base intelligence level of the "member" (or "leader) as they are actually doing it.

Quote
Upgrayed
I have studied this forum for some time and I was at one time a SGI member. Aspects of the philosophy that they hijacked is very interesting and yet it's odd that an organization could be teaching something that goes directly against every action that the organization itself takes. The witches spell or evil eye scare tactic about leaving is horrid and definitely used to brow beat people from leaving.

On that note, gauging the intelligence level of the manipulators, the "witches spell or evil eye" tactics are the refuge of those who have run out of all legitimate (logical) arguments, have been exposed by critical thinking and have run out of cards to pull out of their pathetic cult playbook. It reminds me of the cowering con-man who has been forced into a corner and is desperately lashing out in the only manner he/she has as their disposal.

Quote
Upgrayed
What I found was odd manipulation, pressuring for money using simple yet effective tactics. Perhaps Zaimu, or the month of May contribution fund was indeed once a year but I think it's changing now as it has been every month since, with the money table out front so that everyone can see who is contributing and who isn't. Nothing private about the affair. Also, the born again, plant the money seed experiences are so cheap that you'd have to hate your life to sit through that crap. The "dear leader'" (got that from here) worship is ridiculous. Reading the same books over and over again, with the same meth head rhetoric, which is pathetic considering that the message is always to work hard for the cult and yet no one actually seems to be activating to the message. Just a tired loop of people who are too scared to leave and feel the price of worshipping a stranger is sufficient versus being home alone. Well, the SGI through the practice has the sneaky way of invading every aspect of your life as most people dump their entire being before the gohonzon. Very clever.

In the U.S.A, it seemed as if official contribution time slowly evolved from a few times a year, to every few months, then every couple of months and eventually every month. I personally very rarely gave ($$ - and when I did, it was only pocket change) and had no problem whatsoever about walking past those tables with the fake smiling (usually Japanese) member-leaders; the looks on their faces when I did so, was sometimes priceless.

As I grew up (because I literally grew up in the cult), the meetings slowly became less and less intellectually stimulating for me. It was the same shallow stuff, over and over and over again - with the same (sorry, this is going to sound harsh, but it is true) stupid people, who never changed and never grew. Sometimes, I felt like I was in a never ending version of romper room [www.youtube.com] with a bunch of preschoolers (the magic mirror had the dear leader smiling back at you and the "senior leader" was like the host facilitator).

Quote
Upgrayed
Also, the ethnocentric japanophile type worship. Many of the Western Members talk like English is their second language, their arm and hand gestures, the karate chop motion and saying "hai", it's really fucking wierd. Or western members up on stage singing in japanese with no translation provided.

HAHA! It's a form of psychological identification and I actually witnessed new members descend into non-native speakers and wanna-be asians, over time, right before my very eyes (not to mention the occasional asian or japan-o-phile leering ymd - I've even seen a salaried leader like this - running around with their tongue hanging out salivating always looking for a girlfriend).

I agree, it was bizarre (and I'm sorry again if this offends anyone) and hilarious to see.

With regard to people singing in Japanese, hell even some of the people singing it sometimes don't even know what they are singing in the first place. It's just more of the cult automaton behavior on display, no thinking required (or desired).

Quote
Upgrayed
I think that anyone who is freethinking and creative and wanders upon the SUcKeRGI ends up running away. The only people who seem to stick are the one's that must be sufffering from some personality disorder, though I understand some people on this forum participated in the SGI for many years so there is most likely complex social dynamics that can keep a person within it's walls. Let's be clear though, there are some that are highly neurotic and I have seen people talking to themselves, crying while chanting, or just spending their life at the community center.

I know for a fact that a few of the salaried gakkai "leaders" are indeed walking textbook examples of DSM personality disorders. With regard to members in general, I've seen the exact same thing. I've even seen people talking to the gohonzon and sleeping in front of it while taking a break - in order to remain close - from a marathon chanting session). Have also seen the gakkai cult mini-equivalents to speaking in tongues and possession by the "holy spirit." IMO, it's pretty much a common theme that you see in any religion with whacked out zealots. Some are indeed out of their minds.

Quote
Upgrayed
I apologize for typing so much, but a first post contains a deluge of pent up experience. I could go on and on and will do so as a means to contribute to this forum and warn people. Not everyone will come into the SGI with critical faculties turned on and that is the danger. It looks harmless and inviting (sometimes).

Critical faculties are the only thing that will save anyone from this cult.

Quote
Upgrayed
Oh, and chanting , from my experience is unhealthy if done too much. Normally, if one has a problem, you fix it.

In the SGI,if you have a problem, you go to the gohonzon, or the middle man , the practice, SGI to then solve it. SGI gets a share of your success by virtue of including itself in your life through the practice. You then reward the SGI with money for your "success". It's dangerous and dissolves one's ablity to think and act on one's own, to think independently. It's something holding your hand 24/7.

It's wishful, primitive magical thinking ritual, with the gakkai cult leadership manipulating and molding your worldview into something that they can control you with. All success is because of them and all failures are because of you. And while you are struggling, give us your time and $$, we'll give you our so-called "support", a psychological crutch, and the illusion of a sense of community of like-minded "members" who can show you the way, have walked before you, or are on the same path as you. It's a slow rerouting of your neurons, repackaging and regressing your mind back into an infantile form of dependence on your surrogate father (the dear leader) and your adopted brothers, sisters and "wise" elders (members and "leaders", respectively). What a crock.

A common ploy to get new recruits in the door to a gakkai cult meeting can be found here, [articles.latimes.com]. I have seen many variations on this theme, where the target is manipulated to feel a sense of obligation toward the (unknown to them) "member" for some benign act of human decency that they received. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I remember one in particular where a "member" returned a lost wallet (intact, with all the cash inside), but not before slipping a NMRK (magic chant) card into it and extracting a commitment from its owner to attend a meeting in the future as repayment for the deed (in lieu of cash or a simple "thank you").

This kind of stuff was typical hardcore gakkai cultie behavior. (On that note, check out this [forum.culteducation.com]: "Don't feel that there is any sinster about the practice, however, I don't really like the way that members are recruited. Being someone's best friend just to get them to join SGI is, in my opinion, pretty insincere.") Many don't even see anything wrong with this kind of behavior, it's almost as normal to them as the nose sitting on their own face (and not given any further thought about, either).

They subtly exploit the normal boundaries of social (human) courtesy in the beginning and continue to do so more and more blatantly once you're in, and the deeper you go. Some people eventually see it and say enough is enough, others don't (or can't) and are hooked, enslaved, and continuously manipulated and used.

Hey Guy,
Don't know why its so hard to use this format. cursor is not cooperating! Anyway, made the very same mistake today tht I did last month when I was compassionate because a former friend waz suffering! Today was on my fb page when I noticed a former member was in the the fire evacuation zone in Idaho & was very distressed. I hve been in a big forest fire so I simply .made a couple suggestions that she cld do. I recieved a note to ignore & delete
her former statement so I looked & she had said she had a more important mission at the moment,because a family. needed diamoku! What? Well I guess someone told her to end conversation since mine wasnt worthy!! I was helping her!! Thing is, shes cray
cray anyway! Maybe this time Ive learned u just cant b friends
for any reason. I want to tell her about how insane tbe comm
ent is but it wld fall on deaf ears!!
Its same old thing! Any Ikeda sightings yet??

Yes, it seems that within the SGI, everyone and everything is objectified. It's similar to Amway or other pyramid schemes where the core focus is
showing one's faith and determination through bringing people into the organization. But rather than making money, one is paid with attention (hand claps and being given compliments) and the opportunity to become a leader, in which one can be respected and held in high esteem, at least in theory.

Because people who join subconsciously feel the objectification, they often try to please others in the organization through showing faith and zealotry as a means to overcome that subtle objectified feeling. When individuals accomplish what is expected of them, they recieve praise and attention, allowing them the chance to humanize and become apart of the group. Of course it doesn't help that many join because they are starved for love and attention or are seeking for solutions to problems that are overwhelming them.

I noticed how people would initially be love bombed and highly regarded but once the individual joins, they are essentially left to their own devices within the organization. The members that become hardcore seem to earnestly participate as a means to continue to recieve the attention.


The fact that members seem to have very little compassion for others , perhaps it comes from being in such a fake objectified insincere environment.

This lack of compassion invariably leads to people to look more and more like brainwashed zombies. Like Hitch said, the tools are exploitation and
false interest.

I would like to say that there is a difference between new members and older members. New members still have that fresh human outlook and they embrace the humanistic ideals and bring a joyful presence. But, when you look at the members who have been in the organization for ten or more years, they are fried. They aren't attractive in their behavior at all. Honestly I did not see successful exciting fresh spirited intelligent members to
look to and say, hey there is someone who is showing the value of this practice and organizaiton. Sure, you saw phony people but the atmosphere within the organization felt as if nothing was unintentional.

I believe that the organization has clear understanding that it won't ever achieve it's lofty idealized goals but knows that there is always a sucker that is either seeking love or is stuck in life, the final being those that want to be superman and save the world. All of these examples are essentially the taking advantage of people who were in a vulnerable state.

I bet many SGI members and headquarters itself monitor this thread. Do yourself a favor and leave the SGI. The feeling once leaving the oppressive atmosphere,( which you don't actually notice till you leave) is liberating. To get out of the suffocating insular self contained boxed environment is again liberating. Perhaps you think that I am being over dramatic, but once you take distance, you can begin to see how destructive this cult is, especially on one's own mind. Very sinister stuff.

To the poster who said that the old SGI friend wouldn't converse with her due to other members, this appears to be their means to punish you for leaving the crab bucket. They are showing their great compassion and Daishonin's spirit. riiiiiight.

Welcome Upgrayed! Enjoyed your post. Please keep coming back, there really isn't much handslapping here because most of us agree that NSA/SGI is a toxic organization.

This thread is incredible self-deprogramming from SGI.
That is what is happening and has happened.
People deprogramming themselves (and others) from the SGI cult.