Quote
tsukimoto

One thing that I've noticed in many posts, not only yours, is that posters apologize for being "negative" -- ie, criticizing SGI. When I was in the Soka Gakkai, leaders made it sound like that was one of the worst things you could do, criticizing or complaining about SGI. You were "negative," and you were bound to have terrible karma as a result.
The message couldn't have been clearer -- you don't have the right to criticize or question SGI.

tsukimoto, i agree that some of my fear of being negative stems from the fear of being critical, but my point in trying to be more positive and constructive comes from my recent issues with severe depression. i agree, anger can get one moving in the right direction, and can be a powerful catalyst for important things to happen in one's life, but im trying my best to come from a happier place, for my own sanity. for example, the idea of freedom, of wanting to do good things with your life other than running around to meetings or sitting around feeling guilty, those are positive things i want for myself. so when i finally leave, i want to be in a good place when i do - a strong, content place. dont get me wrong, im pissed that this is what my life has become, when i absolutely planned for it to go in another direction this past year, and i am grateful for my anger because it led me here to this forum (which has helped me immensely) but there's nothing i can do right now other than plan for my next move. so i apologize if i cast anyone's honest feelings of anger or criticizing as being "negative", i was really only speaking for myself. by all means, for anyone else who is where i am right now, or considering leaving, be honest and speak out- thats why this forum is such a saving grace! since finding it, ive slowly began opening my mouth where previously i would have glued it shut. i hope it only gets better from here on out.

Overcoming hardships plays a mjor role in buddhism. How can one explain the process of overcoming hardships if one doesn't discuss the hardships. SGI is the antithesis of Lotus Sutra Buddhism and the teachings of Nichiren. If Nichiren were in the SGI he would be vilified for being negative and for expressing his feelings:

‘My body is worn out and my spirit suffers from the daily debates, monthly persecutions, and two exiles. That is why for the last seven or eight years illnesses of aging have assailed me yearly, though none has led to a crisis’ (WND-2, 949).”

“The northern part is Mount Minobu, the southern, Mount Takatori, the western, Mount Shichimen, and the eastern, Mount Tenshi. They are like boards set up on all four sides. Around the outside of this area are four rivers. The Fuji River runs north to south and the Haya River runs west to east behind this area. In front is the Hakiri River, which runs west to east, and its tributary, which has a waterfall and is called the Minobu River. You might suppose that Eagle Peak had been moved from central India and set down here, or that Mount T’ien-t’ai had been brought from China.

In the midst of these four mountains and four rivers is a flat area no broader than the palm of one’s hand, and here I have built a little hut to shield me from the rain. I have peeled bark off trees to make my four walls, and wear a robe made of the hides of deer that died a natural death. In spring I break off ferns to nourish my body, and in autumn I gather fruit to keep myself alive. But since the eleventh month of last year the snow has been piling up, and now, into the first month of the new year, it goes on snowing. My hut is seven feet in height, but the snow outside is piled up to a depth of ten feet. I am surrounded by four walls of ice, and icicles hang down from the eaves like a necklace of jewels adorning my place of religious practice, while inside my hut snow is heaped up in place of rice.

Even in ordinary times people seldom come here, and now, with the snow so deep and the roads blocked, I have no visitors at all. So at the moment I am atoning for the karma that destines me to fall into the eight cold hells, and, far from attaining Buddhahood in this present life, I am like the cold-suffering bird. I no longer shave my head, so I look like a quail, and my robe gets so stiff with ice that it resembles the icy wings of the mandarin duck.

To such a place, where friends from former times never come to visit, where I have been abandoned even by my own disciples, you have sent these vessels, which I heap with snow, imagining it to be rice, and from which I drink water, thinking it to be gruel. Please let your thoughts dwell on the effects of your kindness. There is much more I would like to say.”

FOR SURE – SGI copout is and has always been that you are the problem (we SGI are always perfect asks our MASTER IKEDA if you doubt us) – you need to chant more and connect to mentor IKEDA – when I asked a pointed questions to a Sr. Leader about SGI pushing IKEDA as everyone’s MENTOR in practice and in LIFE – and that this was not my position and the teachings that I had grown up with! THE Leader said that I needed to look inward and chant abundant daimoku and to look to mentor IKEDA! This just blew my mind and has given to a lot of distrust with leaders in the SGI because they are supporting IKEDA agenda and not Buddhist practices! Now I am very skeptical of all types of religious practices. Like it’s all about mind control and manipulation of the members! With EGO’s like 300 honorary degrees – wonder how much of member’s donations it may have took to buy all of those degrees? WHEN WILL THE MADNESS END!!!!!!!!!!

It seems that there is a lot of dialog that is bottled up in sgi members
with no way to express their true feelings and thoughts anywhere within the sgi itself..


The organization is made up of people, and should be molded by the voices of those people....as a democracy....

sgi has seemed to morph into a personality cult with Mr. Ikeda as the central figure..

..they used to emphasize the central figure concept, but I think they have now established a different theme, mentor-disciple, which has overtaken everyone.....

The organization seems to revolve around the printed text publications, more than living speech among members...


Without healthy, open communication, the organization will atrophy
and decline....

The dialog concept is emphasized in the external sense re: the org, but not internally....

You can talk to a senior in faith about it...I imagine....

Anyway, I wrote an extremely long post but the computer didn't file it....


I suggest daimoku as a good tool to sort out the flaws of the org....

the org is supposed to support the continuance of one's practice, which everyone can assume is not an easy practice.

The flaws of the organization are there partly because people
are flawed.....

That doesn't excuse irresponsible leadership, of course...

The problem is that people have become passive sometimes,
afraid to speak out for the good of the org.... and by extension themselves....


Nichiren realized the contradictory schools of thought, and made himself a real pain in the ass to those schools...

Makiguchi realized the flaws and problems of Japanese education and made an effort to work those problems out...

Toda was completely with that idea in his support of Makiguchi.

When Ikeda came along, Japan was like a beaten up prize fighter, down for the count....

He did a lot to revive the org, and hence Japan's circumstances, so you have to take the long view about those accomplishments, and acknowledge them...

I don't find the publications offensive....I always find them encouraging...
but they are printed text, as opposed to living speech and dialog...


maybe you have to see them as a tool of the practice, which can follow its own course

....that is to say, they should be read as a chronicle, not as scripture....


they exist only to encourage people...that's it....

they are like the flag in the putting green...just indicating a point of focus....like a lighthouse of sorts....
to steer clear of peril.....


they really are about returning to the basics of chanting,
more or less.....the basics are permanent....they never, ever, ever change...

..Like Churchill's quote.....'Never ever, ever give up'

.....he was refering to the bastard Nazi's and England's life and death struggle with them...

..the British were very close to being wiped out and were fighting like hell for their very existence, I would claim.....



I have many stories to relate about flaws in the sgi...
we all do....
but don't worry too much....take it back to chanting...

you will see a change in your viewpoint ....at least I always
do.......



I usually, after a bit of chanting...start breaking out in happy laughter...its the strangest thing....


Buddhism is designed for human happiness..which is why people do it initially .....

it is very hard to continue....but it can be done


many people have quit....like that gosho, "to begin is easy, to continue is....[well]... difficult''....

I have quit the org more than once, the first time I took an incredible plunge
into a hellacious zone....


....but the chanting is the
essence......

it ain't easy....everyone knows that....but it can be a helluvalot

of fun...eventually....

you have to sink your teeth into something in the real world, you know

don't just be a chant/ a holic....


find your true passion...or chant to find your true passion...

there are lots of interesting things to do, you just have to discover your 'thing'.....

that is probably the key to the whole freakin' mess...
...maybe.....

and chant for the poor org to get itself together...
it will improve with care...

Ikeda is human and he knows it.....he has flaws...but I have personally seen his astounding sincerity as well....nobody is perfect...

You can write to him, you know....he responds to folks....

you probably know a few of those stories...

just chant....is my take....

I have been through alot in life...if I may say so....

relationships have frequently been horrendous with others, members included,

but we chant to help ourselves get closer to one another...

to care about someone else....

I mean, care about someone beyond the spouse or parent or child.

and of course to improve ourselves....'cause that's all we really have, possibly.....



Sakyamuni didn't even consider himself the leader of the
Samgha, or Buddhist community....so there is a lesson to that story......

Nichiren was abandoned by most of his countrymen, not entirely though....he still had loyal followers who empathized with his extreme ordeals, I gather.....


If you doubt the practice's authenticity, you might read the
gosho "On the buddha's behavior'' which is a straight autobiography....the part with the meteor at the beach...
that is historically verifiable.....

Nichiren always mentioned his negative
karma and such, just like everyone else, including Mr. Ikeda

....but the beach meteor has got to say something to an intelligent person....that is, Buddhism has some power....


he was chanting, I imagine, when they lowered his head for instant decapitation....with a razor-sharp, samurai sword...

I sure the hell would have been chanting, if it were my head on the chopping block...

Don't fret about the org too much....in fact....you are the org,
you could say....raise some G/D hell with some senior....they can suck it up...I am sure....


feedback is the only way they have to navigate the blind vessel of believers, I gather....

How else could they do it?

I guess you have to chant for the health of the org..

..Mr. Ikeda seems to be winding down....at least he just skipped the last big monthly meeting in Japan.....

He realizes his best work is probably behind him....
so he probably wants to hand the peace movement to his underlings

....at least that's what his rhetoric implies....

He probably is getting tired....like anyone else at the helm
for decade upon decade....

peace always,

Enough said,
b....

"Rather than offering up ten thousand prayers for remedy, it would be better simply to outlaw this one evil." -- On Establishing the Correct Teaching for the Peace of the Land. You are not welcome Brantcloyd to offer up your pathetic praise of the SGI. We know the real deal.

Mark

brantcloyd:

Methinks you are about to be skewered. I think you are in the wrong place to post your "overcome your own negativity and change the org from within" message. This forum is really geared for those who are trying to break from the organization and support each other with the emotional difficulty that can bring. There may be some with hidden agendas but most are very nice, good people dealing with real issues from an organization that has proved unhealthy to them. It is truly insensitive to come here and lecture or "give guidance" based on a shallow gakkai party line. My guess is you are one of the soka spirit folks, trying to gently, and belieiving to sensitively, nudge people back to the org. You should go back to your clandestine monitoring, it is more suited. And if you want to home visit me, please read the following book passage: you may come to see me after I've left.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maj. Major Major Major: Sergeant, from now on, I don't want anyone to come in and see me while I'm in my office. Is that clear?
First Sgt. Towser: Yes, sir? What do I say to people who want to come in and see you while you're gone?
Maj. Major Major Major: Tell them I'm in and ask them to wait.
First Sgt. Towser: For how long?
Maj. Major Major Major: Until I've left.
First Sgt. Towser: And then what do I do with them?
Maj. Major Major Major: I don't care.
First Sgt. Towser: May I send people in to see you after you've left?
Maj. Major Major Major: Yes.
First Sgt. Towser: You won't be here then, will you?
Maj. Major Major Major: No.
First Sgt. Towser: I see, sir. Will that be all?
Maj. Major Major Major: Also, Sergeant, I don't want you coming in while I'm in my office asking me if there's anything you can do for me. Is that clear?
First Sgt. Towser: Yes, sir. When should I come in your office and ask if there's anything I can do for you?
Maj. Major Major Major: When I'm not there.
First Sgt. Towser: What do I do then?
Maj. Major Major Major: Whatever has to be done.
First Sgt. Towser: Yes, sir.

@ brantcloyd

sorry but what you say is b.s. in my books. keep on chanting ... stay in the org ...

this org is guilty of manipulating people, holding people back to seek help when facing mental problems, mind control, proselytizing, personality cult, raking money, etc. etc

who wnats to be part of such an org?????? if you rae the org then you are all the above.

Quote
Rothaus
@ brantcloyd

sorry but what you say is b.s. in my books. keep on chanting ... stay in the org ...

this org is guilty of manipulating people, holding people back to seek help when facing mental problems, mind control, proselytizing, personality cult, raking money, etc. etc

who wnats to be part of such an org?????? if you rae the org then you are all the above.

WOW Rothaus! Great post.

Mark



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/04/2010 08:55AM by Nichijew.

You ARE welcome Brantcloyd, because many of us wore those rose-clouded glasses, some longer than others.
Wake up dude.
Where the SGI is now is beyond wrong, beyond hope too, I'm afraid. It's not just going to blow over. And they will continue to smash those that disagree or try to disrupt their "unity". They are setting up to permanently idolized Daisaku Ikeda. They don't even care about the teachings of Nichiren - I am convinced more of this each day, but the leaders surrounding him and running the show will fail. I don't know what the SGI will become but it will morph and/or die out (at least in the USA).

I am one that does not believe that Ikeda probably ever wanted to be in this position - that's another argument. But he should have stopped the smaller stuff long ago and seen where it would lead, so maybe I'm way wrong, but it is the optimist in me.

Diaglogue folks - - it's what makes peace happen, starting with you and me.

Oh, and I forgot to say I totally agree: daimoku, daimoku daimoku is totally the way to deal with this mess, whether you're in it, out of it, have friends in it, hate it, miss it or whatever. That's the beauty - we never lose our own power!