Quote
Morgaine
Hi all,

How is it possible that in the space of only a few years, the SGI went from having no money to taking in $40 million in 1960??? That seems very strange to me. just a few years earlier they were broke. I wonder if they got money from other sources than just the pubs?? Does anybody know???

In the late '80s while I was on the way to do a shift at the Union Square community center in NYC, the member who was driving pointed out a building across the street that had been the previous place of worship. He said SGI/NSA still owned the property because the Gohonzon had been there. Any place that had been a former center was still owned by the organization, he claimed. The rent from that investment alone would provide some income, if this is true.

Quote
Anongirl
Wow, its so great to see all of you folk here, I dont feel so alone. I was a member for 6 years but havent practised now for over a year. Being in SGi did really help me for a while, it helped me to stay focused and positive but much of the time I was chanting and my inner self was staying the same. I never understood why members would give me a photo of a japanese man Id never met or why we had "Three cheers for sensei" at some courses. One of the leaflets at one of the courses was entitled "Following our master into a new era" and i couldnt help but think "hek a minute ago he was just a mentor!". I was also given terrible advice about my health towards the end of my membership by a ranting member. I dont want to go into details. I remember thinking these people are lunatics. Its been hard breaking away but Im glad ive managed it. I never felt connected to sensei and it infuriated me why I was told i had to feel connected to attain enlightenment. I suppose i thought if I just chanted one more time, helped out as soka/liliac ,attended one more course/meeting my mental illness would disappear. Im now getting proper help and therapy and cant believe some of the things i was told or some of the things I did. Peace to everyone x

Hi Anongirl, welcome to the forum.

Sometimes when new people come to the forum your first few posts are a bit delayed in getting put up. It looks like by the time yours did get put up the thread had gone on to the next page, so no one saw your messages.
Hopefully it won't happen again!

It sounds like your doing exactly the right thing getting professional help. Six years is a long time, and SGI's subtle manipulation can really take hold especially if you have personal issues you're tring to solve by practicing with SGI.
Once you do decide that SGI is not helping you it is difficult, on one hand you have leaders saying 'chanting and doing activities will solve all of your problems!' and on the other they say 'leaving SGI will bring you bad karma and you will definitely unhappy.' Kudos to you for seeing through their manipulation.
I know what you mean about your early experiences with SGI. When I first started practicing I had terribly low self confidence, focus and self belief. After about 6 months of SGI I thought, 'hey, I do feel more confident and focused, SGI is really helping!'.
And to an extent it was, it introduced to me to Nichiren buddhism (which I had probably learned more about in 6 months than the other members in my area had in 5 years) and it also got me out of a 'rut' as I was keeping busy with activities and my private buddhist study.
The problem is SGI says that they are the only organisation in the world which can help people become happy. I would've gotten pretty much the same results by joining any other buddhist/religious/self help organisation. (Obviously without learning in Nichiren philosophy in particular.)
So I was happy in my early days of SGI, I think a lot of people are... but then all the hidden stuff starts to surface.

Anyway, congratulations on getting free! This forum's here anytime you want to rant, vent, or just talk to other ex-members. :)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2010 01:55AM by DavidM.

Quote
Blue Lady
this is the what I rec'd in my email yesterday. The big kahuna is visiting to beat us over our heads

The benefit that accrues from making contributions is clearly spelled out in the Gosho. If we were to contribute to kosen-rufu just as the Gosho teaches and then failed to receive actual proof, then Buddhism would be false. The Gohonzon has tremendous power. I'm sure you are all well aware of that through your own experiences in faith until now. Confident of the good fortune we are attaining, let us continue to advance joyfully, harmoniously and in high spirits toward our next goal, bracing ourselves for the struggle ahead" (NHR, Vol. 10, pg. 171-72)

Its been a while since I've read any of this guff.
Ikeda wasted a lot of ink writing all that, he could have just said:

Be fearful. You need SGI.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2010 01:59AM by DavidM.

Quote
DavidM

I know what you mean about your early experiences with SGI. When I first started practicing I had terribly low self confidence, focus and self belief. After about 6 months of SGI I thought, 'hey, I do feel more confident and focused, SGI is really helping!'.

The problem is SGI says that they are the only organisation in the world which can help people become happy. I would've gotten pretty much the same results by joining any other buddhist/religious/self help organisation. (Obviously without learning in Nichiren philosophy in particular.)
So I was happy in my early days of SGI, I think a lot of people are... but then all the hidden stuff starts to surface.

Hey, DavidM, thanks for finding Anongirl. I too missed that post. Welcome, Anongirl!

About early experiences in SGI: I, too had low self confidence, and it took less than 6 months for my confidence to increase and for me to feel better. As I look back over the time I spent with SGI, however, I realize that there are ups and downs in life, and I know that my confidence would have grown if I had been just on my own. Now without SGI I feel that I can do much more than I could when I was with them. I look different and and am more focused and energetic. That's one thing I really notice--the increase in energy! SGI made me tired!

Sonique said, "I'm growing in confidence, so I'm doing something that I think is working for me." I too felt exactly that way. Until I left. Then I realized how much SGI was negatively affecting my confidence. It was pulling me down.

This morning I was going through a box of stuff in my garage and I came across a small picture album that was full of photos that I had taken while in New York at the NSA convention. Not sure what year it was, but it was when many people were in New York to celebrate the 200th birthday of the Statue of Liberty. NSA had shows at Madison Square Garden. I did not go to do any work "behind the scenes". I was just there to be in the audience. So I had tons of free time. With some other members who also were just there to fill up the audience, I ran around NYC the whole weekend and did the sightseeing/tourist thing. Of course, we showed up at Madison Square Garden at the assigned time, but that seemed like a minor part of the trip. I sure had fun that weekend! That's how a convention should be instead of how SGI/NSA activities sometimes (often) are!

Quote
Morgaine
Hi all,

How is it possible that in the space of only a few years, the SGI went from having no money to taking in $40 million in 1960??? That seems very strange to me. just a few years earlier they were broke. I wonder if they got money from other sources than just the pubs?? Does anybody know???

Morgaine, SGI is slipperier than a wet eel when it comes to finances. I very much doubt that SGI was broke, even in the 1950's. SGI leaders would like you to believe that the SGI can barely pay the electric bills at the community centers. It's not true. SGI has always been very good at separating members from their money, and in addition owns businesses and property. Consider the following:

SGI began a period of rapid growth after World War II. Josei Toda, the second president, had the goal of having 750,000 households as SGI members by his death. He died in 1959, having met this goal. Now, if each of those 750,000 households gave the yen equivalent of ten dollars a year -- that's $7, 500,000 per year -- just from donations from the Japanese members, not even counting sales of publications. And realistically, it would have to have been MUCH more than 7.5 million in donations per year. Some households might not contribute at all, but many would contribute more than ten dollars.

The Japanese Soka Gakkai initially had members bringing cash to meetings, but apparently certain leaders were taking their cut. By 1985, Soka Gakkai Japan was doing "bank transfers," or direct withdrawals from members' accounts:

[forum.culteducation.com]

This cash has been invested through Mitsubishi Bank Tokyo. (page 69 of this thread.)

SGI is also connected with many different varieties of business in Japan: (page 65 of this thread.) Apparently, SGI owns, or owned at one time, 10% of the Tokyo Disneyland Stock, as part of a large and well-balanced stock portfolio.

[forum.culteducation.com]

SGI also owns millions of dollars worth of real estate in Hawaii, California and New York City. (page 104 of this thread).

[forum.culteducation.com]

In 2005, Forbes magazine estimated that SGI had over 100 billion dollars in assets:
(page 42 of this thread)

[www.forbes.com]

[forum.culteducation.com]

And yet, when SGI-USA filed its IRS 990 form in 2007, which all organizations claiming nontaxable, nonprofit status in the U.S. must do -- it claimed to have zero revenue, zero assets! How can this possibly be? Well, SGI's Soka University has close to one billion in assets, 80 million dollars in revenue. SGI money was moved around and put into Soka U! Creative accounting, but I'm sure it's all perfectly legal! (page 42 of this thread)

[forum.culteducation.com]

[nccsdataweb.urban.org] 
1. Name & EIN Soka Gakkai International USA (952265667) 
2. Street 606 Wilshire Blvd 
3. Location Santa Monica, CA 90401 
4. County Los Angeles County, CA 
5. Ruling date 
( Approximate year when founded.*) 1968 
6. IRS type 501(c)(3) - Public charity: Religious, educational, charitable, scientific, and literary organizations... 
7. Legal basis for public charity or private foundation status (FNDNCD) 10 - Church 
8. NTEE Q99 - International, Foreign Affairs & National Security N.E.C. 
9. Most recently completed fiscal year (TAXPER) 12/2007 
10.

Total revenue $0 
11.

Total assets $0 
_____________________________ 





The motherload is Soka University of America (953909672) 


Close to 1 BILLION in assets. 



$80 million in revenue.[/b] 



Notice below, that Soka Gakkai International puts their money into Soka U. 
And since Soka Gakkai International has $0 assets, then it appears that ALL of the SGI-USA money goes into the Soka U (aka investment real estate holding company!)(wink wink)

So -- what are we to believe about SGI and money? 1.) SGI has a a lot of money, and 2) The Soka Gakkai is incredibly devious and sneaky about where the money actually is and how it has been used throughout the years, and that's not going to change.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2010 05:16AM by tsukimoto.

Like I told you I am a WD chapter leader and we do the Gosho Study each month. Which at best is becoming more and more problematic it doing it with a straight face? So this month Gosho has some passages that we must discuss and convey to the membership. ……
Here is one
So on page 65 of Living Buddhism it says.
One day, as I waged this solitary struggle, Mr. Today said to me with a bright glint in his eyes: “Daisaku, Buddhism is about winning. Let’s fight like men, giving it our all as long as we live. Life is eternally. Evidence of our dedicated efforts will definitely appear in some form in his lifetime.”
Now I understand that it is exactly as he said. The words of this great teacher of kosen-rufu are free of error. The causes for the tremendous actual proof manifested as the present global spread of kosen-rufu can be found in my selfless struggles as a youth to develop our movement.
This is above appears in the May – June 2010 Living Buddhism.


Not only is President Ikeda the sole legitimate successor of the oneness of Mentor and Disciple, but President Toda is free of error!!!!!!!! I don’t know but this sounds similar to something High Priest Nikken said as well.
I did not know that Human worldly beings who , eat, sleep ,have sex, cuss and smoke , drink are free of error. Somebody should have told us when we walked through the door that removing the priest from our midst would then automatically transfer the role of the high priest – call the opening of the eyes –transfer document to the head of SGI.
The Pope in Rome would be a better role model – no one seems to care what he says or does. I heard the red slippers the Pope wears costs $3000

Its seems Presdent Ikeda is just a Buddhist author , not a disciple of Nichiren nor a mentor to millions but just an author. Well the cat is out of the bag. Ya’ll

[en.wikipedia.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2010 05:39AM by Blue Lady.

@ Blue Lady

Grin :-) have you noticed one thing in your message? You started of giving a gosho quote and ended up citing an Ikeda/Toda incident.
Maybe it happend without noticing it, at any rate it seems that anything these days Ikeda said is given the same importance than the words of Nichiren and teachings of Shakyamuni. But reading this Ikeda quote just shows me the content is the same as I left five yeras ago - makes me yawn actually.
But one thing Blue Lady ... being critical of SGI and still keeping a straight face in your position as a leader ... wow that must be difficult my respect for that honestly.
But I agree with you as it reflects what I said a few messages back ... the heads of SGI can be regarded as a SGI-priesthood and its true - I remember in the 90s one of the biggest issues was the impeccability of Nikken - it seems someone in SGI wants to talke over that role because the consequence of Toda being without error would result in an impeccability of Ikeda too or not?

Here's some more current content topping the "soka spirit" page of the SGI-USA website: (http://www.sokaspirit.org/):
"The purpose of Buddhism is not to produce dupes who blindly follow their leader. it is to produce people of wisdom who can judge right from wrong on their own in the clear mirror of Buddhism". (SGI President Ikeda, My Dear Friends in America P. 103) And there is an explanation after that.

Incidentally, I have re-enshrined my Gohonzon, after putting it away in the middle of April, but have felt some anxiety as to where that leaves me.
I was feeling fine not chanting and developing friendships and experiencing quality problem solving in the non-SGI world.

In regards to SGI claiming it is the only organization which can help people become happy, from David M a few messages back, this 'Buddhism' also defines what 'happiness' is and can use that to 'guide' you through your troubles. Well, maybe what happiness isn't, depending on the situation.
This topic of 'what is happiness' is a common interest in presenting Buddhism to Westerners. In SGI it seems you won't know this feeling until you've chanted(enough) and you ought to involve yourself in activities(enough), buy both publications and have enough other Ikeda books. Enough!

There are many things that SGI is duplicitous about .W hen you tote out a picture of the High Priest drinking and having fun as all high priest should --with Geisha gals - send him to Seattle to hang out with prostitutes. How is that in any way different from Mr. Williams and National YWD chief Ms Inowashi having sex in a Chicago hotel? My mother use to comment on that very fact that why did the YWD chief travel alone with Mr. Williams and not his wife or an YMD leader. She knew then something was not right.
Mr. Williams don’t get me wrong I have heard rumors of stuff about him but I truly like him. He visited me in my home after his punishment from Pres Ikeda… Yes, I heard the whole thing when he came to the Chicago and let some YWD like cake icing off of his fingers? – which took my YMD shakubuku way , way off.
I am still waiting for the book that was to expose him for all the evil things he did for 30 years. I had heard that Pres Ikeda in one of the monthly meetings a few years back ranted and rave about him. But did not Mr Williams bring to the SGI table all those wonderful diehard youth. Did he not do with what the Head Master want? Which by the way SGI kept him in the position and paid him---so is Mr Williams any different than the High Priest. How do I not know that maybe Mr Williams was going to expose or ddid expose the underpinnings of the head office in Japan . We missed some much of the drama that New York and Los Angles were having. They had all kinds of falling outs and people leaving and splitting and hanging out with the Shoshunikai(?) we missed all the fun hear.