Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
Shavoy
()
Date: January 11, 2013 06:26AM
Quote
TaitenAndProud
Welcome to all board newcomers! Congratulations on opening your eyes and getting out of the cult that is SGI.
Thank you! Never been happier!
Crazy pot smokers, abusive behavior, so-called "fortune babies", I won't restate it all here, but at various points in the thread I have described my experience with all of these things as an unfortunate "Youth!" member of what was in the 1970's, NSA.
When I joined in 1987, it was still "NSA". The other stuff was still going on. The overall feel was very militaristic.
The one fortune baby I personally knew of (I babysat the poor child) was born to a father that beat the mother so badly she had to leave the state to get away from him. Eventually the man was convicted of attempted murder, I think. Both mother and father were devoted members, and the father had a leadership position. I know that higher level leaders knew about the abuse because the mother told me she went for "guidance" numerous times. Yet, this man was allowed to retain his position. Why would untrained and unqualified people even attempt to give anybody "guidance" about such a serious situation? What's worse than the missing training is the missing compassion. This woman had two children from a prior marriage and I was afraid for all of them.
That's so sad. When I was still practicing where I started, in Minneapolis, there was this young girl, and her mom was a District Leader and her divorced husband was still in the organization as a leader at some level. Then I learned that he'd been convicted and imprisoned for *raping* that young girl, when she was just 11 or 12! The mom said to me that they'd been co-District Leaders at that time, and she'd wondered why he started staying home from District meetings. To rape her daughter, that's why!
When I practiced in North Carolina, this rather scary couple moved into my District, from New York or somewhere. The wife was clearly the dominant personality, abrasive and outspoken. The husband typically just sat there like a doughy mass. I tried to like them, but she scared me. She used to tell us about what "strict guidance" she'd been giving him - all my leadership training had emphasized that wives must *NEVER* give guidance to their husbands, but I said nothing. The only reason I can defend such a policy is that it is wrong to raise one person in the couple above the other. But anyhow, he'd apparently had enough, and he threatened her with a gun. She jumped in her car and took off. He got into his car and took off right behind her - ramming her car with his. They were playing the 911 tape on the news. She was chanting the whole time, in between the screaming. The police joined up; she pulled into the parking lot of a 7-11 and waited while the police took off after her husband. He doubled back to the parking lot and shot her dead.
Those two incidents enabled me to overcome my delusion that Nichiren Buddhism was so "correct" that it would reliably motivate people to become better. I was so deluded! :P
It wasn't until I was out that I learned, from this board, that SGI and Ikea both have billions of dollars in assets. Billions! Yet members are hounded to provide free labor and cash contributions too. This is what makes SGI's blasphemous likening of Ikea to Gandhi and Martin Luther King even more hypocritical and sickening. Gandhi and King never aspired to acquire wealth, and both endured considerable suffering during their respective campaigns for freedom. What has Ikea ever sacrificed? Why SGI members cannot understand this boggles the mind.
Agreed. It's just gross. One interesting detail I learned about the Buddha's teachings, when I started reading outside the SGI's approved reading list, is that there is a sort of "planned obsolescence" incorporated in the Buddha's teachings. Attachment causes suffering - that's one of the 4 Noble Truths. Notice that it's not "BAD attachment" - ALL attachment, whether good or bad, virtuous or evil, causes suffering. It doesn't matter how we categorize it, in other words - our job is to rid ourselves of attachments in order to rid ourselves of suffering.
Clinging to a religion or belief system is just another form of attachment. In the course of ridding ourselves of attachment, we must let go of our religious beliefs at some point and proceed unencumbered. All by ourselves. The point of the Buddha's teachings is to help us learn how to think and how to perceive and understand reality, so that we can then become free to live within it. To say that people must "chant until the last moment of your life" shows a deep misunderstanding of the principle of attachment within Buddhism. In the end, in order to become enlightened, the Buddhist must leave Buddhism behind. It's a revolutionary thought and one completely at odds with all the religions that seek to profit off everybody they can sucker in.[/quote
There are a lot of sad tales of leaders seemingly fighting soo hard for Kosen-Rufu and the Mentor, and their private lives are filled with tragedy and delusion that never appears to get addressed properly. What sobering examples you relayed here, TaitenAndProud. What sobering examples.
It's so much about chasing The Carrot of Absolute Happiness.
SGI uses the money to buy Mr. Ikeda over 300+ honorary doctorates. 300+! Does that not ring an "huh???" from members? If some did look into it without accepting at face value, they'd see that most of these universities are obscure and probably were very happy to accept the donation.
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
leeduffield
()
Date: January 11, 2013 06:40AM
Quote
ShavoyQuote
TaitenAndProud
Welcome to all board newcomers! Congratulations on opening your eyes and getting out of the cult that is SGI.
Thank you! Never been happier!
Crazy pot smokers, abusive behavior, so-called "fortune babies", I won't restate it all here, but at various points in the thread I have described my experience with all of these things as an unfortunate "Youth!" member of what was in the 1970's, NSA.
When I joined in 1987, it was still "NSA". The other stuff was still going on. The overall feel was very militaristic.
The one fortune baby I personally knew of (I babysat the poor child) was born to a father that beat the mother so badly she had to leave the state to get away from him. Eventually the man was convicted of attempted murder, I think. Both mother and father were devoted members, and the father had a leadership position. I know that higher level leaders knew about the abuse because the mother told me she went for "guidance" numerous times. Yet, this man was allowed to retain his position. Why would untrained and unqualified people even attempt to give anybody "guidance" about such a serious situation? What's worse than the missing training is the missing compassion. This woman had two children from a prior marriage and I was afraid for all of them.
That's so sad. When I was still practicing where I started, in Minneapolis, there was this young girl, and her mom was a District Leader and her divorced husband was still in the organization as a leader at some level. Then I learned that he'd been convicted and imprisoned for *raping* that young girl, when she was just 11 or 12! The mom said to me that they'd been co-District Leaders at that time, and she'd wondered why he started staying home from District meetings. To rape her daughter, that's why!
When I practiced in North Carolina, this rather scary couple moved into my District, from New York or somewhere. The wife was clearly the dominant personality, abrasive and outspoken. The husband typically just sat there like a doughy mass. I tried to like them, but she scared me. She used to tell us about what "strict guidance" she'd been giving him - all my leadership training had emphasized that wives must *NEVER* give guidance to their husbands, but I said nothing. The only reason I can defend such a policy is that it is wrong to raise one person in the couple above the other. But anyhow, he'd apparently had enough, and he threatened her with a gun. She jumped in her car and took off. He got into his car and took off right behind her - ramming her car with his. They were playing the 911 tape on the news. She was chanting the whole time, in between the screaming. The police joined up; she pulled into the parking lot of a 7-11 and waited while the police took off after her husband. He doubled back to the parking lot and shot her dead.
Those two incidents enabled me to overcome my delusion that Nichiren Buddhism was so "correct" that it would reliably motivate people to become better. I was so deluded! :P
It wasn't until I was out that I learned, from this board, that SGI and Ikea both have billions of dollars in assets. Billions! Yet members are hounded to provide free labor and cash contributions too. This is what makes SGI's blasphemous likening of Ikea to Gandhi and Martin Luther King even more hypocritical and sickening. Gandhi and King never aspired to acquire wealth, and both endured considerable suffering during their respective campaigns for freedom. What has Ikea ever sacrificed? Why SGI members cannot understand this boggles the mind.
Agreed. It's just gross. One interesting detail I learned about the Buddha's teachings, when I started reading outside the SGI's approved reading list, is that there is a sort of "planned obsolescence" incorporated in the Buddha's teachings. Attachment causes suffering - that's one of the 4 Noble Truths. Notice that it's not "BAD attachment" - ALL attachment, whether good or bad, virtuous or evil, causes suffering. It doesn't matter how we categorize it, in other words - our job is to rid ourselves of attachments in order to rid ourselves of suffering.
Clinging to a religion or belief system is just another form of attachment. In the course of ridding ourselves of attachment, we must let go of our religious beliefs at some point and proceed unencumbered. All by ourselves. The point of the Buddha's teachings is to help us learn how to think and how to perceive and understand reality, so that we can then become free to live within it. To say that people must "chant until the last moment of your life" shows a deep misunderstanding of the principle of attachment within Buddhism. In the end, in order to become enlightened, the Buddhist must leave Buddhism behind. It's a revolutionary thought and one completely at odds with all the religions that seek to profit off everybody they can sucker in.[/quote
There are a lot of sad tales of leaders seemingly fighting soo hard for Kosen-Rufu and the Mentor, and their private lives are filled with tragedy and delusion that never appears to get addressed properly. What sobering examples you relayed here, TaitenAndProud. What sobering examples.
It's so much about chasing The Carrot of Absolute Happiness.
SGI uses the money to buy Mr. Ikeda over 300+ honorary doctorates. 300+! Does that not ring an "huh???" from members? If some did look into it without accepting at face value, they'd see that most of these universities are obscure and probably were very happy to accept the donation.
A chapter leader told me he wanted to organise a tozo to chant for Ikeda to get the Nobel Peace Prize.Is there a category for outstanding contributions to fundraising or religious network marketing?
The seperation is final now-I have deleted all gosho from my Kindle and all the books went in today's refuse collection. One more Art of Living (SGI-UK's monthly propaganda rag simply subtitled " A Buddhist Magazine" )still to come,that will go straight in the bin unread. One of my neighbours is an inactive member, I will do my best to shakubuku her out as well.
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
Hitch
()
Date: January 11, 2013 08:33AM
Quote
TaitenAndProud
She was, of course, implying that, if I bought "heretical objects", they would magically cause a dark miasma to descend over my home. For all her "wisdom", she couldn't tell that I'd already bought both of them, and they were sitting right upstairs, waiting to be hung!
Generally speaking, many of the pioneer Japanese cult ladies are borderline illiterate war brides who never completed their basic schooling - which pretty much explains their embrace of superstition and clinging to magical rituals to feel in control.
The "chant until you agree with me" guidance is golden and sums up perfectly how gakkai "leaders" view themselves, their roles and their "relationships" with members.
Quote
TaitenAndProud
It was interesting when, two weeks later, she dropped dead. She was only in her 50s! This was, of course, a sad thing, and that should be the end of it. But I know for a fact, having spent much time in the higher echelons of SGI-USA leadership, that if it had been ME who dropped dead, the leaders would have wasted no time in wagging their heads and tongues about how this was my "karmic retribution" for disobeying my leaders' orders! It is commonplace in the SGI-USA leadership to exploit members' misfortunes this way, as a cautionary tale to inspire more submission and obedience from the membership. But to suggest that SHE was struck dead for presenting her own opinion as official Buddhist doctrine - that would be in terribly poor taste, wouldn't it? So why are the members not accorded the same respect the leaders are?
They always spin it the way they need it. If you are a good brainwashed gakkai cultie, then you cut your karma and accomplished your mission in this life - the next will be better for you. If you were not a good blindly following cult member, then it's all your fault and your "karma" will follow you / your family forever, until you embrace The Dear Leader's words faithfully - "too bad, so sad, you should have practiced harder."
It's all so transparently manipulative. I don't know how people fall for it, but they do and they live their lives in fear. A fear that is exploited by the cult org..
Quote
TaitenAndProud
I heard that, at one meeting, one member had said, "Well, what if she had a museum of Japanese art and artefacts, and wanted to display these examples of original calligraphy as works of art? That would be okay, wouldn't it?" The leader replied archly, "She doesn't HAVE a museum, does she?"
Very typical gakkai cult "leader" arrogance. The driving force behind this disrespectful and fallacious response, of course, is the leader's uncomfortableness with being challenged by a thinking member. Thinking members are bad enough, but the worst kind are those that think AND challenge you in an actual gakkai cult meeting setting. On a related note, causing the "central figure" at a gakkai meeting to lose face will get you shut down and ejected very quickly (you also won't be welcome back to future meetings for a long time).
Quote
TaitenAndProud
While we all would, of course, like to see every injury heal 100% and the injured person be restored to full original operating condition, this simply isn't realistic. With all those people chanting for him to be "different" from how he was, what sort of message did he receive about whether it's okay to be partially paralyzed? I'm sure he didn't miss that all these people were taking time out of their busy schedules to sit there and chant for him to be changed - something he had absolutely *no control over*. And right there in his own living room. Over the months, the attendance dwindled - I don't know at what point these daimoku tosos were no longer on the schedule.
His lack of improvement, despite the heartfelt magic chant of so many, was causing cognitive dissonance amongst some of the attendees. Gakkai members are often looking for pet projects (really down and out members) to focus on - I think it makes some of them happy and gives them a purpose in life. That said, they can also quickly lose interest and disappear, much like a child suddenly discards a favorite toy after having enough and tiring of it. It's very sad indeed, and I've also seen it many times. These same members move around to different targets, victim to victim, somehow forgetting that these are *real* people in the process and not objects, ESPECIALLY when they cannot really help them. It's like they just move right along to another "project", in denial about what just happened.
Quote
TaitenAndProud
When I practiced in North Carolina, this rather scary couple moved into my District, from New York or somewhere. The wife was clearly the dominant personality, abrasive and outspoken. The husband typically just sat there like a doughy mass. I tried to like them, but she scared me. She used to tell us about what "strict guidance" she'd been giving him - all my leadership training had emphasized that wives must *NEVER* give guidance to their husbands, but I said nothing.
Every pioneer member that I've ever known, disobeyed that guidance, big time. They browbeat their husbands until they begrudgingly practiced and never missed an opportunity to threaten them with mystical damnation if they were an "obstacle" to their practice and membership to The Dear Leader Fan Club. Many of the husbands would tolerate it, up to a point, at which they would bump mutual stubborn heads and hilarity would sometimes ensue.
- Hitch
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
The Anticult
()
Date: January 11, 2013 02:35PM
That proves how crooked SGI-USA is financially. Any "non-profit" org that refuses to publish openly its AUDITED financial statements, does not deserve $1 in donations from anyone. Not a cent.
And of course, any closed-room financial papers would be some SGI-USA disinformation, vague pie-graphs and things like that. That sounds like a Scientology scam, to show you fake-docs in a room.
But it would be interesting to go into the room, and take high-res photo's of whatever SGI-USA is offering. For sure, its just going to be some vague pie-graphs.
SGI-USA is a private financial corporation, controlled by the Ikeda family.
The SGI billions are the Ikeda's families money, they control it, every dollar of it.
SGI-USA has to publish their IRS audited financial statements.
And they never will, ever.
As there is so much money in real estate, land, and investments, they need to keep it all secret, hiding behind the cloak of "religion".
And of course, any closed-room financial papers would be some SGI-USA disinformation, vague pie-graphs and things like that. That sounds like a Scientology scam, to show you fake-docs in a room.
But it would be interesting to go into the room, and take high-res photo's of whatever SGI-USA is offering. For sure, its just going to be some vague pie-graphs.
SGI-USA is a private financial corporation, controlled by the Ikeda family.
The SGI billions are the Ikeda's families money, they control it, every dollar of it.
SGI-USA has to publish their IRS audited financial statements.
And they never will, ever.
As there is so much money in real estate, land, and investments, they need to keep it all secret, hiding behind the cloak of "religion".
Quote
TaitenAndProud
There are actually reports of SGI and Mitsubishi misdeeds, as well as reports that SGI's main financing bank is The Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi. Of course, the problem is SGI keeps all of their finances secret, so only Ikeda and his family know where the money is, and where it went.
As I live in the San Diego area, I'm quite close to the LA HQ. One time, I called them, asking for a copy of the SGI-USA's financial statements. You know, transparency and whatnot. The young man I spoke with said that, if I drove up there, I would be allowed to *look* at them without touching them or making copies. I could go into a room and *look* at them.
Nice, huh??
The whole financial angle smells real bad.
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
Nichijew
()
Date: January 11, 2013 08:25PM
Many good posts. I had already left the SGI for about 6 months or a year in 1996 but I had not left all my SGI baggage. My very sincere wife [who is alive today because we left the SGI] bought a beautiful statue of Shakyamuni Buddha in Chinatown. She was so proud of her find. The moment I saw it, I freaked. I told my wife in no uncertain terms that she would have to throw out the statue as we couldn't have it in the house. I told her to give me the statue and I would dispose of it. She immediately grabbed the statue and carried it around like a baby for half a day. A few days later I learned that many Nichiren sects have statues of Shakyamuni Buddha either enshrined with the Gohonzon or by themselves. It has been inside my altar since then. Subsequently I learned that Nichiren carried around a statue of Shakyamuni Buddha for nearly 20 years until his death which he even enshrined and prayed to when he was in exile. Also, Nichiren himself taught in his second most important treatise that attachments are bad, even attachments to the Perfect Teaching of the Lotus Sutra. The SGI mentor and leaders only get away with their BS teachings because the low life conditioned and unlearned members take their arrogance, conceit, and false confidence, for sincerity and wisdom.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/11/2013 08:34PM by Nichijew.
Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/11/2013 08:34PM by Nichijew.
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
TaitenAndProud
()
Date: January 12, 2013 01:51AM
Nichijew, why is it that you say that your wife is alive today BECAUSE you left the SGI?
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
Hitch
()
Date: January 12, 2013 05:54AM
A university student group promotes the cult org. at a student fair (UCSB).
[www.youtube.com]
The feely-good vibe of this clip conceals much of what is actually going on. It is not a "buddhist" group and the planting of the "Sun Lotus" flower seed gimmick is, in reality, planting the seed of a cult group. Rather than getting people to parrot the magic chant (NMRK), it would be more appropriate to get them to learn the following songs Forever Sensei, I Seek Sensei, Who Is This Man, or The Dear Leader Fan Dance.
The most telling part is at the 0:26 min. mark where the gakkai cultie promoter member is explaining the cult philosophy stating ...
*"It allows us to OWN our own victory and our own successes."
Most people just stop thinking and say to themselves, "boy that sounds nice and makes sense." Or "what nice people" "I want a free flower plant", "Nam Myoho Renge Kyo, Nam Myoho Renge Kyo!!" "This is FUN!"
*It is meaningless nonsense and is a good example as to how cult members are reconditioned and brainwashed to attribute everything good that happens in their life to their devotion to the cult org. / Dear Leader and everything bad that happens to lack of faith or proper devotion to the cult org..
It's an insidious mind trap, hiding behind all the smiles and the warm and cozy cultie love-bombing. "Cults In Our Midst", indeed.
- Hitch
[www.youtube.com]
The feely-good vibe of this clip conceals much of what is actually going on. It is not a "buddhist" group and the planting of the "Sun Lotus" flower seed gimmick is, in reality, planting the seed of a cult group. Rather than getting people to parrot the magic chant (NMRK), it would be more appropriate to get them to learn the following songs Forever Sensei, I Seek Sensei, Who Is This Man, or The Dear Leader Fan Dance.
The most telling part is at the 0:26 min. mark where the gakkai cultie promoter member is explaining the cult philosophy stating ...
*"It allows us to OWN our own victory and our own successes."
Most people just stop thinking and say to themselves, "boy that sounds nice and makes sense." Or "what nice people" "I want a free flower plant", "Nam Myoho Renge Kyo, Nam Myoho Renge Kyo!!" "This is FUN!"
*It is meaningless nonsense and is a good example as to how cult members are reconditioned and brainwashed to attribute everything good that happens in their life to their devotion to the cult org. / Dear Leader and everything bad that happens to lack of faith or proper devotion to the cult org..
It's an insidious mind trap, hiding behind all the smiles and the warm and cozy cultie love-bombing. "Cults In Our Midst", indeed.
- Hitch
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
Hitch
()
Date: January 12, 2013 07:32AM
Be careful what you feed (offer) your paper scroll (gohonzon) [www.youtube.com].
"Bad food" = "bad cause & bad effect"
Here's a sampling (pun intended):
No animal byproducts.
No salted potato chips (Never!).
"To offer chocolate up to the gohonzon is a bad cause."
Pistachio nuts, especially the red coated ones, is a bad cause
Dried fruit coated with sugar is a bad cause
Shredded wheat coated with sugar, is a bad cause
****
Well now, that just takes the cake and sometimes, this stuff is just too much. (All pun intended.)
- Hitch
"Bad food" = "bad cause & bad effect"
Here's a sampling (pun intended):
No animal byproducts.
No salted potato chips (Never!).
"To offer chocolate up to the gohonzon is a bad cause."
Pistachio nuts, especially the red coated ones, is a bad cause
Dried fruit coated with sugar is a bad cause
Shredded wheat coated with sugar, is a bad cause
****
Well now, that just takes the cake and sometimes, this stuff is just too much. (All pun intended.)
- Hitch
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
leeduffield
()
Date: January 12, 2013 07:45AM
Quote
Hitch
Be careful what you feed (offer) your paper scroll (gohonzon) [www.youtube.com].
"Bad food" = "bad cause & bad effect"
Here's a sampling (pun intended):
No animal byproducts.
No salted potato chips (Never!).
"To offer chocolate up to the gohonzon is a bad cause."
Pistachio nuts, especially the red coated ones, is a bad cause
Dried fruit coated with sugar is a bad cause
Shredded wheat coated with sugar, is a bad cause
****
Well now, that just takes the cake and sometimes, this stuff is just too much. (All pun intended.)
- Hitch
What about un-sugared Shredded Wheat?Or other cereals?
Don't forget your incense must be flat and you should be looking up to the paper deity.With each passing day it gets more absurd.Like any of it makes a difference.For anyone still inside but wavering,one thing:
If you aspire to enlightenment religion will get in the way.Binding oneself to superstitious ritualism is a sure sign of delusion and attachment and hence not true Dharma.
Re: Soka Gakkai International -- SGI
Posted by:
TaitenAndProud
()
Date: January 12, 2013 08:51AM
you should be looking up to the paper deity.
Oh, yes, absolutely! If you are looking *down* at the magic scroll, you won't be able to elevate your life condition!
And if you want to see your income go *UP*, hang your altar *HIGHER*!!
I remember this poor woman who lived in the projects. She obviously took this nonsense seriously - her little butsudan was hung right up at the ceiling!
And she didn't get any wealthier.
Oh, yes, absolutely! If you are looking *down* at the magic scroll, you won't be able to elevate your life condition!
And if you want to see your income go *UP*, hang your altar *HIGHER*!!
I remember this poor woman who lived in the projects. She obviously took this nonsense seriously - her little butsudan was hung right up at the ceiling!
And she didn't get any wealthier.
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