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Hitch
I have a general question that I would like to throw out there to see if any you former members can relate:
Did you ever notice how hardcore gakkai members (I've seen it in both Japan and The U.S.) would treat fellow member encounters entirely differently than they would your average non-member out the street, in the real world? They would put on these fake Disneyland-like smiles you see with the greeters and guides at The Magical Kingdom, with fellow members. Yet if you were ever with them in a non-gakkai setting, the fangs would sometimes deploy and they would literally bite people and could be incredibly rude to non-members, way out of proportion to how any "normal" person would react to everyday situations. Some real life Jekyll & Hyde stuff.
Just some more of those little clues that started to help pry open the skeptical thinking box in my brain that eventually saved me from this cult.
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Hitch
I have a general question that I would like to throw out there to see if any you former members can relate:
Did you ever notice how hardcore gakkai members (I've seen it in both Japan and The U.S.) would treat fellow member encounters entirely differently than they would your average non-member out the street, in the real world? They would put on these fake Disneyland-like smiles you see with the greeters and guides at The Magical Kingdom, with fellow members. Yet if you were ever with them in a non-gakkai setting, the fangs would sometimes deploy and they would literally bite people and could be incredibly rude to non-members, way out of proportion to how any "normal" person would react to everyday situations. Some real life Jekyll & Hyde stuff.
Just some more of those little clues that started to help pry open the skeptical thinking box in my brain that eventually saved me from this cult.
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rattyboy
I was watching The movie "The Wave" which is about a classroom experiment in totalitarianism. Also known as "The Welle German" on Youtube. The students are separated from their naturally formed friendships by being made to sit in assigned seats and for the sake of unity wear white shirts. You can see this 30 minutes into the movie. The teacher also leads them into marching in in unity and gives them an enemy to march against. (The anarchy class downstairs). The transformation in the faces looks so familiar. The teacher states that there are "no poor students just poor grades. You're in my class, you're good". Replace with "No bad people, just bad karma, you're in SGI, you're good." Even as he has them smiling and marching in unity he offers them an opportunity to consider that this is different but quickly takes control by the end of the sentence (completes the yes-set?) He says: " I know its unorthodox but why not try something new?" Start this movie just before the half hour mark where the classroom experiment begins if you don't want to watch it from the beginning.
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tsukimotoQuote
backnforth
Since we are talking about the craziness of recruitment i.e. shakabuku campaigns, I'll share an experience I had in the 1980's. It was street shakubuku time one evening at the kaikon and I was fairly new and not really on-board with the whole shakubuku thing, afterall I was brought up to 'not talk to strangers'. The Japanese woman in charge was the Chapter or Headquarters leader and had the tough pioneer spirit. She was giving out orders and fully expecting everyone to only say "Hai!". I was in the back of the room and the leader was pairing up people to go out to find strangers to introduce to buddhism. My thoughts were that I might go if I was with my sponsor, let's call her Amanda. But when the leader told me I would be paired up with someone else, I said No, but I would go with Amanda. We began going back and forth which led to a full blown argument where she accused me of causing disunity and she literally pushed me out of the room, telling me to "Leave!"
I was devastated and shocked. A few people came to my aid and we went into the Gohonzon room to chant. I was quite upset and crying and they were compassionate. Looking back on that incident I realize that they never said they thought the leader was wrong in her actions, but they DID point out the Oneness of Life and Environment concept and that I needed to raise my life condition to get rid of the negative experiences. I can't say I disagree with that, but there is always the external reality of the situation to consider and she WAS wrong.
Once, we put some people in the car and took them straight to the temple and they received Gohonzon.
Once my sponsor and a youth leader were together doing street shakubuku and a man pulled knife on them.
I could never get onboard with street shakabuku either. I always sneaked out when it came time to go out and do it. I agreed to do a lot of ridiculous things for SGI, but somehow, I just couldn't street shakabuku! Leaders lectured me about my "lack of courage," and "lack of compassion for others' lives." I did feel guilty -- but not guilty enough to do street shakabuku.
Some other people have also posted in this thread about abusive leaders. One woman (Sushigrrl?) wrote about her experiences in Young Women's Division, having to do activities in the hot sun, not allowed breaks for water -- and then the leader yelling at her in front of everyone because she fainted.
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Rothaus
@tsukimoto and backnforth
Well we often heard of SGI-'leaders' loosing their heads in this forum. One reason might be that they put themselves under pressure to reach certain 'goals' and some of these goals might depend on the co-operation of others. Another reason might be though that some are plain and simple psychos. Sorry to use that word, but now after some time has gone by since my departure and common sense kicking back in - thats what would go through my head today. The 'best' thing is – people like that seem to go undetected in SGI and are even put into a position to give people 'guidance'. Today I find it hard to understand why I accepted some peoples advice in SGI (in all fairness their also have been some extraordinary characters I had meaningful conversations with).
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Street shakubuku was insanity. There was even one incident where a member was robbed at gunpoint doing such activities; ironically, they ultimately came to view it as a "benefit" that they were not hurt and used it to strengthen their faith and practice.
Not sure what to say that kind of thinking, other than what I've already said - it's insanity.
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rattyboyQuote
Hitch
I have a general question that I would like to throw out there to see if any you former members can relate:
Did you ever notice how hardcore gakkai members (I've seen it in both Japan and The U.S.) would treat fellow member encounters entirely differently than they would your average non-member out the street, in the real world? They would put on these fake Disneyland-like smiles you see with the greeters and guides at The Magical Kingdom, with fellow members. Yet if you were ever with them in a non-gakkai setting, the fangs would sometimes deploy and they would literally bite people and could be incredibly rude to non-members, way out of proportion to how any "normal" person would react to everyday situations. Some real life Jekyll & Hyde stuff.
Just some more of those little clues that started to help pry open the skeptical thinking box in my brain that eventually saved me from this cult.
I'd like to put Hitch's question out there again. What little time I spent in public with people from the SGi I saw significant separation from society. Any other views on the SGI individual in relation to the non-members?
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ScoobyDooby
As someone who is married to a long time practioner but who doesn't practice himself, I am often treated indifferently by many of the division and area leaders.
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ScoobyDooby
There is one in particular who has in the past treated me with outright disdain (tried to shakabuko me on several occasions). To be honest, I have had little problems with regular members though I find their Ikeda worship and loyalty to the organization beyond belief.
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Shavoy
Hitch, you are right on again with your explanation of the leader's behavior with ScoobyDooby. The whole purpose of shakabuku is to help others become happy/change poison into medicine/double and triple the shakabuku-ers' fortune and benefits. That's what we were told, right?
Double and triple the benefits....that's a huge dangling carrot right there. Because leaders are on the hamster wheel to chase that fortune-- those pesky obstacles, i.e. people who just aren't buying it, can definitely cause cases of the crankies. Which, of course, derails their efforts even more. If someone does not buy into SGI, being treated as if they are poor and deluded ain't gonna make a change of heart.