@Tsukimoto - another great post, thanks. You don't post often but when you do, it's always a doozie.

@Jeenia, @Missy66 - Welcome to the ark. It's good to see that there are still members who can think for themselves. Ex chicago south-sider and north sider here.

Regarding the nobel prize for Ikea, maybe he can get the Bernie Maddoff special mention for swindling people out of their money?

As far as the members living in near poverty for SGI's sake, I guess for Karma to really work you need some people to sacrifice so much that the universe itself rejects the injustice. Could be we'll see Ikea's next incarnation as a leech or a jackal. Remember though, the organization is the shadow of the leader so if we here are all that have stood up and walked away from it, then perhaps there is divine retribution to go all around.

Reading that the WT subscription is now $50, what is inside that rag that is worth that? I sometimes thought they just changed the titles on the articles and recycled that garbage over and over. I'd look for inconsistencies that would suggest the articles were rehashes, but the SGI-blather was so vague that it was hard to even do that. I remember when they changed the format of the Seikyo Times the first time (sorry, that dates me :) ) I hoped there would be some good stuff from american members but no chance, cannot have people not parroting the party line.

Until the members themselves realize that there isn't going to be a hope for change over the next ten years they will just keep on marching to the SGI tune. As Ikea gets more decrepit those around him will compensate more and more and try to make things look like "it's all going okay, move along, nothing to see here, move along". Remember when Castro had some health issues? That Venezuelan dictator that Ikea is so palsy walsy with, same thing. Things get locked down so the big dogs can carve out their piece of the pie without interference.

I am SO GLAD I broke away years ago. Right now it's like a bad soap opera from my perspective.

Wakatta1

SGI uses very powerful and refined techniques of persuasion and brainwashing on vulnerable people.
They can train followers to think a corporation like SGI worth tens of billions, or maybe more, is broke.

With that level of brainwashing, you could train someone to not be able to see the moon in the sky.

These are powerful techniques that Ikeda and his western experts at SGI-USA are using.
Ikeda is old school, his techniques are quite crude, and don't work as well in the west, so SGI-USA had a few persuaders at SGI-USA head-office develop that.

The SGI members have been trained to shut-off their mind, and when there is problems, to chant chant chant. We have all seen it.
Something in their life starts going wrong, and they panic, then just want to go and chant it all away.
They lose the ability to use critical thinking.

So they believe that SGI is broke, when it has billions in cash in banks around the world.
They believe SGI is good Buddhism, when in fact, its really the opposite to Buddhism.

The bottom line, is that these sects can train humans to believe ANYTHING.
They can train them to believe there is a UFO at the center of the earth in a golden city.

So that is the tough part. The SGI folks are deeply indoctrinated, and the repetition makes it very hard to break out of it.
It becomes a closed-loop system, just the way Ikeda wanted it.

Locked into SGI for life.

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wakatta1
@Tsukimoto - another great post, thanks. You don't post often but when you do, it's always a doozie.

@Jeenia, @Missy66 - Welcome to the ark. It's good to see that there are still members who can think for themselves. Ex chicago south-sider and north sider here.

Regarding the nobel prize for Ikea, maybe he can get the Bernie Maddoff special mention for swindling people out of their money?

As far as the members living in near poverty for SGI's sake, I guess for Karma to really work you need some people to sacrifice so much that the universe itself rejects the injustice. Could be we'll see Ikea's next incarnation as a leech or a jackal. Remember though, the organization is the shadow of the leader so if we here are all that have stood up and walked away from it, then perhaps there is divine retribution to go all around.

Reading that the WT subscription is now $50, what is inside that rag that is worth that? I sometimes thought they just changed the titles on the articles and recycled that garbage over and over. I'd look for inconsistencies that would suggest the articles were rehashes, but the SGI-blather was so vague that it was hard to even do that. I remember when they changed the format of the Seikyo Times the first time (sorry, that dates me :) ) I hoped there would be some good stuff from american members but no chance, cannot have people not parroting the party line.

Until the members themselves realize that there isn't going to be a hope for change over the next ten years they will just keep on marching to the SGI tune. As Ikea gets more decrepit those around him will compensate more and more and try to make things look like "it's all going okay, move along, nothing to see here, move along". Remember when Castro had some health issues? That Venezuelan dictator that Ikea is so palsy walsy with, same thing. Things get locked down so the big dogs can carve out their piece of the pie without interference.

I am SO GLAD I broke away years ago. Right now it's like a bad soap opera from my perspective.

Wakatta1

Wakatta1, the WT has basically turned into an Ikeda Worship Platform. Even in the experiences, it's very rare that someone can relate one without bringing it back to accepting Sensei as Mentor in Life. I remember the Seikyo Times, too and the older WT and that was not the case. Pictures of Sensei abound. As if we'll forget what the Mentor looks like....

Like what The Anticult wrote, too, it is a systematic, constant message for the ego of one man to be adored by millions. But I'm still trying to understand for myself what has been written here recently, about how SGI-USA really doesn't care if people reject the M/D angle upon investigation and turn off/not join. So they really don't care about the expansive goal of Kosen-rufu, having more millions bow down to the Ikeda Man?

Ikeda has his core followers, and yes those people they want to lock into SGI for life.
And their babies too.

And like any sect, SGI knows most people do not want to be SGI, so they just ignore them.
Like when Scientology recruits on the street in front of their store, do they want to get everyone to come into the Scientology shop? No, only one in a thousand who pass by falls for the scam. But that is enough.

And the masses of SGI-USA in other countries, the people who work for free for years, and give thousands of dollars. Sure, when they burn out and start complaining, Ikeda wants them to get kicked out. Kick out the traitors. Cut off the cancerous finger before the cancer spreads, that kind of thing.


SGI is a massive corporation.
Does a massive corporation want their front-line workers to be with them for life?
No, they load them up with work, and when they burn out, they get new workers at a lower wage.

But higher level workers stay for a longer time.

So of course, SGI would love the entire world to bow-down to Ikeda, as he was supposed to be the King of Japan, and the Pres of Japan.
but luckily, he failed in that ambition, and had to settle for being a lowly multibillionaire.
But Ikeda is only surrounded by SGI worshipper's for the last decades, so he has been a King in his own mind.

But people who run these sects, are very practical.
Its a numbers game.
They look at the numbers and see that SGI lost, lets say 5% of their members through burn-out.
But they recruited 9%, and these newbies are keeners. So they grew.

People are just numbers on a page, and pawns in the chess game.

But you can see how those in the USA find the Ikeda worship to be so grotesque, as to be physically revolting.
The western culture does not accept that kind of thing as easily.
Like Supreme Master Ching Hai. [forum.culteducation.com]
But it seems in the east, they eat that stuff up.

That is why SGI-USA tried to tone it down years ago, and use the english word "Mentor" taking from pop-psychology management.
Mentor is Orwellian Newspeak adapted by some high-paid propagandist at SGI-USA.

but please, the real message is ultimately...


...Bow down to your Supreme Master Ikeda or you will be punished by terrible Karma!

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Shavoy

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Tibbs
I just don't understand the whole Ikeda-as-Mentor concept. Your mentor is someone you try to emulate, isn't that right? How exactly am I supposed to pattern my life like Daisaku Ikeda? Start my own muti-billion dollar religious empire? Dupe good people into giving me their money? I'm a 45 year old white woman, so transforming myself into an elderly Japanese Billionaire doesn't seem very likely. There is nothing about Ikeda or his life that I want to emulate.

I'm just waiting for him to start claiming he has attained Buddha-hood. Or has he already? I'm kind of out of the loop these days.

Hello, Tibbs....you hit the nails on the head here! Also, it seems as though the SGI now is giving no choice, you must accept PI as your personal Number One All-Time Mentor. The only one you'll ever need. Talk about authoritarism! They also talk about "knowing Sensei's heart--making Sensei's heart your own" How can we know his heart? Or anyone's for that matter? Make his heart your own? We have our own hearts!

I don't recall ever seeing that he's claimed Buddhahood. For that matter, I've never heard any other members (or leaders) say that they had reached Buddhahood, either.

You know, when I was in SGI I heard it said several times that President Ikeda was a "modern-day Buddha" or had reached enlightenment. Not sure if he himself claims to be a Buddha, but it would not surprise me. People felt that he had amazing energy and somehow had an aura about him. You were considered to be very lucky if you got to shake his hand or even be in the same room as him, because of his wonderful magical powers.

After I had just lost my job I gave a thousand dollars to the SGI in hopes of "changing my karma". The "friends" that took the check from me knew my situation, knew how little money I had to live on and did nothing to dissuade me.

And now if you have free time that isn't devoted to SGI activites you can volunteer at their thrift stores - awesome!

That sucks that people would be persuaded to give their last money that they need, to a multibillion dollar organization like SGI, with billions in the bank.

But it happens all the time.
Not just SGI.
Many bogus churches do it too...donate everything to "God" their church pastor, and get blessed.

And every LGAT seminar, you have the millionaire seminar Guru's, conning people who are broke, or massively in debt, to borrow more, and give it to the millionaire, for more courses.
(which is like wanting to change your Karma, they want to change their life).

They hype people up to remortgage their homes, to buy into something ridiculous scam, and end up losing everything. They lose their house, often their marriage.

But no need to ever beat oneself up over mistakes made in the past. It can happen to anyone.
It happens to most people in life.
So if a person got scammed for some thousands of dollars, hopefully they learned a lesson that can be used for the rest of their life. And not get scammed again.

There is one big name famous LGAT seminar leader, who knows he is scamming people of course. His entire Mastery University is a "scam". By the end of it, if you are smart, you realize you have just been scammed for 50K-100K, and bought a piece of blue sky. Its embedded in the course, what was done to you.

So hopefully those who have been scammed by SGI and other sects won't let it happen again, and just jump into another sect, which some folks do.

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Tibbs
After I had just lost my job I gave a thousand dollars to the SGI in hopes of "changing my karma". The "friends" that took the check from me knew my situation, knew how little money I had to live on and did nothing to dissuade me.

And now if you have free time that isn't devoted to SGI activites you can volunteer at their thrift stores - awesome!

Wow, Tibbs, that's too bad. I know of other stories like that. I knew a girl, many years ago, who barely could function because of severe psychiatric problems. She received a monthly check from the government to live on, which was not enough. Because of a lawsuit, she received $2,000 in a windfall. SGI happily took half of it. She was encouraged to give it to change her karma (which, BTW, she definitely did not).

SGI runs thrift stores??? OMG

So I guess the world-wide goal of Kosen-rufu is really smoke-and-mirror! I have to say, there are members over the years who have sincerely claimed mondo benefit from making the contributions. These weren't leaders. They were just "regular folk". I have also heard stories like the one quiet one shared...about people in precarious mental/physical health straits who were encouraged to donate as much as they could, to change their fortune. And it did not happen. Tibbs, did you get any windfall?

Same thing with churches, like was said. Heavy tithing encouragement with the same benefits promised. And I've heard and seen more than one example of monies coming in when they were needed most, after tithing.

Soooooo, SGI does not have the market on making contributions with the expectation of financial protection. It always sounds like they think they do, though. They do not.



@quiet one: I don't think the thrift store thing is happening, yet!