Hi - new poster here!

I have known about this forum for years, but never looked it up until the other day. Once I started reading I couldn't stop - even after my husband told me to (talk about not submitting my spirit!). I binge read the entire thing, all 500+ pages...

There is too much to say, and I wish I had logged on earlier so I could comment on threads in real time. I hope to keep up with the convo from now on and post again.

I was raised in the Walk and it was my entire life until about 8-9 years ago when I moved out of an all-girls communal home and never really looked back. I am a millennial (or part of the Joshua Generation in Walktalk-ese), but my parents joined the LW in the 70's in Indianapolis and moved to San Diego in '87. It seems like most of the posters here are my parents' age and many of you might know/remember them. They are still part of the LW but starting to wake up. Just recently my dad apologized to me for enlisting our entire family into something we didn't choose. He's on the right track!

Reading this forum has been really helpful for me to contextualize where I "come from." As someone who didn't choose to be part of the Walk, but was born into it, I've been burdened with the constant question "WHY ME?!" This forum has helped explain how my parents were reeled in and what kept them committed for so may years. Because my parents are not close with their families, TLW has filled the void of extended family - members of the Walk feel like my grandparents, aunts, uncles & cousins (I think G+M had some words about "Spiritual DNA"?). Digging through this forum has been as exciting and heartbreaking as reading about your extended family on ancestry.com or getting results from 23 and Me. Definitely some "oh, that's why I'm that way" moments...

I wanted to thank some of the long-time dedicated posters like lily rose, kboy, and changed again. Your posts have been enlightening and hilarious. I doubt many of the other forums on the RR website are as witty as this one.

If there are any original Josh Gen kids, YASPers or students who graduated from a kingdom "school" on here, I'd love to talk. Please post or feel free to PM me.

Also, if there is anyone reading this who is still a member of TLW, I want you to know that there is a big amazing world outside of the Walk. There is happiness and freedom to be found.

Much love xx

Welcome girls-turn-it-off (GTIO)
Thanks for posting. Feel free to join in the conversation.

GTIO. Welcome to the RR forum. I love your screen name. And wow, I remember that slut-shameing message that Marilyn brought to the YASPers. So messed up.

puddington Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GTIO. Welcome to the RR forum. I love your screen
> name. And wow, I remember that slut-shameing
> message that Marilyn brought to the YASPers. So
> messed up.

Yes. Between that are her crusade to kill the "male spirit" in the early 90's...it's been a helluva psychopathic roller coaster ride :)

"Husbands, submit yourselves to your wives, as unto the lamp.
Girls, turn it off."
Ephesians 5:22-23
(note: I may have butchered this scripture. Bear in mind that it has been over 20 years since I opened a Bible)

puddington Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> GTIO. Welcome to the RR forum. I love your screen
> name. And wow, I remember that slut-shameing
> message that Marilyn brought to the YASPers. So
> messed up.

Thanks for the welcome puddington & changedagain. I'm so glad you like my screen name! Haha I was afraid no one would get it. You must really have Marylin's heart ;)

Anyone notice Gary is in the Holy Land rn? Should we send him a blessing ball?

What a splendid idea! Perhaps we should also bind and loose the entire journey!?

After last years trip (happened around the same time frame) SEVERAL services were devoted to presentations of Israel from the folks who had gone on the trip. Several shabbats featured the recitation of ceremonial prayers in Hebrew and traditional songs were also played.

The whole fascination with Israel is not merely because it's where Jesus came from, but because of Genesis 12:3. "I will bless those that bless you, and he who dishonors you I will curse.."

Maybe when asked, a congregant of TLWF may not respond with this. I wager that the interest in Israel is not because of its strong roots of faith and peoples general interest, but because of fear. They want to be buddies with Israel so they are not cursed. This isn't a native thought, but something that has been preached over the pulpit in classic cloak-and-dagger TLWF manner. This is the same concept TLWF members constantly face. "If I am not friends with pastors, I will not be blessed. Even worse, I will be cursed."

I further contend that people's motivation to go on these trips is to have time with Gary and the other pastors in small group. Gary and the other pastors and celebrities to the congregants, and the poor congregants just want to be known and loved back and remembered.

Last year, after attending one of these services, I was asked by my pastor my thoughts on the service. I wanted to be honest. "It was a really long presentation and I lost interest pretty quickly, to be honest." His response was "You fucking millennials have such short attention spans." So then I went back to MOWING HIS LAWN.

Personally, I don't know why I wanted to be around the pastors (AKA cool people). They aren't cool, and the hangouts aren't very fun. I think I liked it because being invited came in the form of being noticed and being loved. If you're not invited, how else are you supposed to feel those things? If you're invited to another person's house in the church, you don't really care about it. Its not cool. Whats the point of being there? Maybe if you had gotten invited over to the pastor's house, you would be able to detect your status among the other people who were invited. Its all a status game.

TheycalledmeJonah Wrote:

> Last year, after attending one of these services,
> I was asked by my pastor my thoughts on the
> service. I wanted to be honest. "It was a really
> long presentation and I lost interest pretty
> quickly, to be honest." His response was "You
> fucking millennials have such short attention
> spans." So then I went back to MOWING HIS LAWN.

Being honest was apparently a mistake. It triggered a fucking bad spirit in the pastor. Next time just tell him what he wants to hear ;)

girls_turn_it_off welcome and thanks for the nod. I think your screen name made a lot of us smile. I appreciated hearing that your dad had the maturity to apologize for getting you all involved.

changedagain Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------
Bear in mind it has been 20 years since I have opened a Bible.

WOW.


TheycalledmeJonah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
I further contend that people's motivation to go
on these trips is to have time with Gary and the
other pastors in small group.

I hear Gary's Israel trips also offer a pub crawl in Tel Aviv.

TheycalledmeJonah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What a splendid idea! Perhaps we should also bind
> and loose the entire journey!?
>
> After last years trip (happened around the same
> time frame) SEVERAL services were devoted to
> presentations of Israel from the folks who had
> gone on the trip. Several shabbats featured the
> recitation of ceremonial prayers in Hebrew and
> traditional songs were also played.
>
> The whole fascination with Israel is not merely
> because it's where Jesus came from, but because of
> Genesis 12:3. "I will bless those that bless you,
> and he who dishonors you I will curse.."
>
> Maybe when asked, a congregant of TLWF may not
> respond with this. I wager that the interest in
> Israel is not because of its strong roots of faith
> and peoples general interest, but because of fear.
> They want to be buddies with Israel so they are
> not cursed. This isn't a native thought, but
> something that has been preached over the pulpit
> in classic cloak-and-dagger TLWF manner. This is
> the same concept TLWF members constantly face. "If
> I am not friends with pastors, I will not be
> blessed. Even worse, I will be cursed."
>
> I further contend that people's motivation to go
> on these trips is to have time with Gary and the
> other pastors in small group. Gary and the other
> pastors and celebrities to the congregants, and
> the poor congregants just want to be known and
> loved back and remembered.
>
> Last year, after attending one of these services,
> I was asked by my pastor my thoughts on the
> service. I wanted to be honest. "It was a really
> long presentation and I lost interest pretty
> quickly, to be honest." His response was "You
> fucking millennials have such short attention
> spans." So then I went back to MOWING HIS LAWN.
>
> Personally, I don't know why I wanted to be around
> the pastors (AKA cool people). They aren't cool,
> and the hangouts aren't very fun. I think I liked
> it because being invited came in the form of being
> noticed and being loved. If you're not invited,
> how else are you supposed to feel those things? If
> you're invited to another person's house in the
> church, you don't really care about it. Its not
> cool. Whats the point of being there? Maybe if you
> had gotten invited over to the pastor's house, you
> would be able to detect your status among the
> other people who were invited. Its all a status
> game.


TheycalledmeJonah you highlighted something that is such a classic TLW tactic: make the little people feel validated only by doing (unpaid) work for the powerful. There were so many times that I cleaned houses, made breakfast/lunch/dinner, washed cars, went shopping for, babysat for, transcribed messages, mowed lawns, made copies, etc. JUST because it would allow me to "create an atmosphere" for whoever my DR was at the time. So many in the Walk are so starved for attention that they will do whatever they are asked to just for a moment in the sun with their "Christ in the Flesh" flavor of the week.

Gary and all of Shiloh U are totally taking advantage of people who want to feel close to the leadership. They are essentially selling the opportunity to feel like you have a connection to Gary or are somehow closer to the vessel of the word.

...But of course if you were to bring it up to someone you would be accused of having "position thinking." Unfortunately it sounds like this has always been a trend in TLW going way back to the days of riding around in the van with JRS or being invited to a backroom meeting.

p.s. At the risk of getting political (I remember Bruce Larson praying against "bleeding heart liberals" over the pulpit once) I wonder what Gary thinks about Netanyahu's current financial scandal. Maybe if Netanyahu took some notes from TLW he wouldn't be in so much trouble.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/22/2018 02:57AM by girls_turn_it_off.

A couple of books that have been very helpful to me in my recovery from TLWF are “Boundaries” and “The One-Life Solution”, both by Dr. Henry Cloud. I spent years reading every cult book I could get my hands on, trying to understand if TLWF was really a cult or not. In hindsight, the indicators were so obvious that it was shocking to discover how deeply the mind control had gone for me to lose all sense of reality. Once we establish the fact that we really were in a cult, the long road to recovery begins.

Losing all sense of boundaries is so toxic to our personal identity. You don’t know where you end and another person begins. The goal of becoming a zero with the rim rubbed out is a classic example of living with no boundaries and placing ourselves in a position where we can be easily controlled by another. We become smaller than we really are, and the leader becomes larger than they really are. We lose all sense of what we should be saying yes or no to. The “oneness” experienced in TLWF leaves the one who has left the group in a position where they want nothing to do with the Body of Christ – just the opposite of what should happen. We are left with the feeling that there is no way in hell I’m going to let that ever happen to me again – and rightfully so.

However, once you re-establish boundaries, it gives you the freedom to relate to others in a healthy way. I love connecting with the various parts of the Body, but they are certainly not God to me. They are people just like me. The lordship of Jesus Christ that was so beat into us in TLWF was simply used as a means to control us. Our personal relationship with Him actually has boundaries as far as others are concerned. It's what comes out of that relationship that becomes "that which every joint supplies". Think about how destructive a marriage relationship would become if others were invited into it. Yet, even the boundaries of that relationship were broken down by the leadership in TLWF. Instead of families being strengthened, they were torn apart.