Ohman? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thank you tmason and lily rose
> Rick was/is a monster driven by his ego. I know
> that first hand. He had his eye on all the young
> girls from early in his life.

Interesting--I had zero interaction with him, which I'm thankful for. BTW, does anyone know whether the L.A. ministries report to him? I've heard that from a knowledgeable insider (I was going to use 'credible source', but considering how that term has been tarnished in the current political climate, I purposely avoided it)--that it is so.

So true, pubxguy.
I think I was actually in a church during a time period where people seemed to compete with one another for title of 'least religious.' Exciting times (sarcasm).


pbxguy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Invisible wrote: "God freed Jesus from the
> religious ideas that
> hindered a man..."
>
> I am reminded that the TLW (The Walk) uses the
> word "religion" in noun and adjective form as a
> pejorative. I had forgotten about that. There's
> nothing wrong with being religious if that is what
> brings you happiness and peace of mind. The word
> is merely a descriptor of one's spiritual practice
> when their aim is to more deeply connect with
> their deity of choice. TLW's use of the word has
> the principle effect of creating an air of
> condescension toward those pitiful, unenlightened
> philistines who are unfortunate enough to have
> missed the true revelation. (though one could
> easily argue they are the lucky ones).

FC

Google Upper Cone Springs, NV

That will bring you to the area and then you can see some old slabs and a pile of debris that was the water tower. You can still make out a concrete watering tank.

Ohman? Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And tmason,
> You said morbid curiosity. I have to disagree, I
> just enjoy seeing who has come over from the
> "dark side". ;)


No big deal O man but I believe it was Lily that used the term Morbid Curiosity.
I am sorry to hear about the difficulty you have had with RH.
His reign of terror started mostly after I left but from the sounds of it things havent changed much with respect to the children and their treatment.

I’ve got it. Thank you.

The geo-coding (URI) for the concrete remnants are: 36.914555, -114.661556. Typing in these coordinates in the Google Satellite Search Box puts the ‘red balloon’ right on the concrete remnants.

Have to concur ---- doesn’t look like a million dollars was invested.

Invisible Wrote:

"Probably most of the people who went to the services in the late 1980's (when they married and committed their lives to Marilyn--my insert) have forgotten how they came about believing that they should give up their free wills to allow the ministry to take their lives."
_______________________________________________________________________________

Very insightful. I suspect this is what happened when parents willing gave over their daughters to Pastor RH. They most likely thought that is what they were suppose to do and didn't see it as abdicating their free will or possibly bringing pain to their daughters. However, I think most parents on the outside who are not part of a cult and have their free will intact would probably not give their daughters to Pastor RH (given his track record). I think it more likely the fathers would try to punch his lights out.

I recall an unmarried pregnant young woman who came to the Valley from another church. She wanted to keep the baby and was heart broken that JRS said she had to give it up for adoption which she did I think to a couple in the church. Although this young pregnant woman hadn't married Marilyn, she perhaps unknowingly had given up her free will and the free will of her unborn child to JRS.

Oman you may be right about it not being morbid curiosity.

Thanks Tmason for the map details. Next time this road warrior is out and about I might check it out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2017 08:05AM by lily rose.

I have a few reasons for posting here. One being that people who are considering joining TLWF be appraised of what they are getting into and not just one person can do this and this forum offers many voices and perspectives on that.

I was looking at the TLWF Maui website in which they depict themselves as a benign close knit family etc. etc. If you are looking for a more spiritual life and you join TLWF leaving the world behind you don't think it's about giving your free will to the leadership because they don't disclose that until later. You think of it as being guided by the leadership and empowered to become a prophet or manifested son of God and you gradually surrender your free will to them to mature you into sonship. The leadership in doing whatever it takes to mature you will make every decision for you. You will feel protected and cared for and the obedience and hierarchical structure of TLWF will begin to take precedence over conscience. Soon demands will increase and the desire to comply with the leadership's thinking evolves into the leadership demanding and justifying total control over your life. At the same time acceptance by the fellowship is uplifting. Gradually the leadership's iron fist will be felt if not by you then by another family and you may flinch but you want to believe and maintain the fantasy of the infallibility of the leadership and the safety and security they provide. Buyer beware! If you are thinking of joining TLWF do your homework, research every secret doctrine they don't disclose in writing or on their webpage. The leadership may not be charismatic but they are persuasive.

Pbxguy & Changed Again,

I understand what each of you are referring to and are talking about by the word "religious."

How I was using and what I meant in using the word " religious" idea's ,
What you are talking about ( by addressing the word "religious" ) - is something completely different than I was referring to.
-----------------------
I used - "religious ideas" to describe some of the ideas that the TLW leaders had and - have had - the members living by those ideas - certain ideas that were taught as Doctrine but in reality they are no more than the "Doctrines and precepts of men."

In Mark Chapter 7 - Jesus addressed - a problem which I believe is akin to the problem the TLW church has had.

Jesus addressed the religious leaders who had authority over how the people had to spiritually live their life. There were certain, "Traditions," that had been passed down from generation to generation - that the Ministry was requiring the people to adhere to and to live by , which made their hearts far away from God and their worship of God to be in vain. Jesus said they held fast to their Traditions - "Teaching as Doctrine the precepts of men."

This kind of thinking - is what I was referring to as being - " religious ideas of men " when that idea is not of God but rather when it is ( a man's idea that has been established as doctrine by which men believe they must live by. )

What we were talking about on the forum - was how the members of TLW were led to believe that they should give their lives to the ministry - so as to obey the ministry in "all things" pertaining to them and their lives.

I previously noted how Jesus stated, ( No man takes My life. I lay it down and I take it up. This Commandment I received from My Father.)

Back in the late 1980's - The TLW ministry influenced the people using the Love and devotion the members had for the Lord and they used certain Scriptures to get the members to give the ministry the control over their lives. They were living their lives to serve and to do the will of the ministry. Their lives were taken from them because the ministry influenced them to give them their life . What the ministry had them vow and commit them selves to -( was to be unconditionally obedient to the ministry ) that commitment - did not allow the members to take up their lives or to take back their lives. (But Jesus Himself was given authority by God His Father thru the commandment He received from the Father - to exercise His free will.

Jesus made known that He allowed no man to take His life. He laid it down and He took it up. And I believe He was able to do this because God gave Him a commandment to live His life like this.

In Mark 7
Jesus pointed out using ( one ) example - He was saying to the ministry - how they were nicely setting aside the Commandment of God ( Honor Your father and mother ) and in order for a son to keep the commitment he ( a son) had made to God - the ministry was not "permitting" the son to do any thing for his father or mother - thus invalidating the Word Of God.

When Jesus says to the ministry - (you no longer "permit" a son) - this shows the ministries relationship to the people was that of having authority over the spiritual life of the worshipper.

Jesus also said, (You do many such things as this.) So the people were being required by the ministry to live under and by the doctrines and precepts of men ( in such as this ) in other areas which were directly affecting their relationship with God and with one another.

Now you know that in many cases the members of TLW were not being "permitted" by the ministry to associate any longer with their own parent or parents, and the members obeyed the ministry in order to keep the commitment they had made to God - to unconditionally obey the ministry. The members were led to believe that by unconditionally obeying the ministry they were giving themselves to a deeper and purer devotion to God - in their serving of God.

The ministry and the members of TLW were setting aside the Commandment of God (To Honor Your Father and Mother ) also thus invalidating the Word of God to themselves. But in reality by doing this - they were submitting to giving their lives to serving a Doctrine and Precept of men. In this their hearts become far from God and their worship of God is in vain.

Before the members of TLW church were led to give the ministry control of their lives - the TLW leaders were not being related to as the absolute spiritual authority over the members lives. ( Unconditional Obedience) to the ministry became a "Doctrine" of the TLW Church but it can also be seen as being the precepts of men by what Jesus was saying and addressing in Mark Chapter 7.

If the ministry of TLW gives their "permission" to their members and now allows the members to make decisions for their own selves today - they still will not be free from this mind set. Because that freedom came from and comes from God, thru what Jesus Christ accomplished for us in dying for us , by laying down His own life - He died to set us free . So we might come to know God, to love and to freely worship God.

lily rose Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have a few reasons for posting here. One being
> that people who are considering joining TLWF be
> appraised of what they are getting into and not
> just one person can do this and this forum offers
> many voices and perspectives on that.
>
> I was looking at the TLWF Maui website in which
> they depict themselves as a benign close knit
> family etc. etc. If you are looking for a more
> spiritual life and you join TLWF leaving the world
> behind you don't think it's about giving your free
> will to the leadership because they don't disclose
> that until later. You think of it as being guided
> by the leadership and empowered to become a
> prophet or manifested son of God and you gradually
> surrender your free will to them to mature you
> into sonship. The leadership in doing whatever it
> takes to mature you will make every decision for
> you. You will feel protected and cared for and
> the obedience and hierarchical structure of TLWF
> will begin to take precedence over conscience.
> Soon demands will increase and the desire to
> comply with the leadership's thinking evolves into
> the leadership demanding and justifying total
> control over your life. At the same time
> acceptance by the fellowship is uplifting.
> Gradually the leadership's iron fist will be felt
> if not by you then by another family and you may
> flinch but you want to believe and maintain the
> fantasy of the infallibility of the leadership and
> the safety and security they provide. Buyer
> beware! If you are thinking of joining TLWF do
> your homework, research every secret doctrine they
> don't disclose in writing or on their webpage. The
> leadership may not be charismatic but they are
> persuasive.

Lily,

You described the descent into the abyss very well to the point I wanted to shudder at the reality of it. It is true--all of it. That is how brainwashing works. The stuff that makes you feel the most secure or safe is the deadliest--that is when you allow your mind to be taken fully and the red flags do not register. They are there all along--year after year--but you swat them away like flies--it's automatic. You are done until you come out into the light-- but those years are gone and it is disorienting and somewhat frightening--like "the Outer Limits" frightening.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2017 04:16PM by Cloudwatcher.

Lily Rose,

I thought your post was excellent in describing an aspect of how the dynamics of the relationships within the TLW church evolved - over time.

In the context of your message - you noted the desire a person may have - to have a more spiritual life. Perhaps the things we write about will be of help to bring about the means for other people to be able to make wise and informed decisions about how they involve themselves in any place where people gather together to worship God.