Here's an edited/updated copy of what was sent to Jason Sayer's email address. Since he deleted his facebook account and refused to account for Nathan Knarreborg's questions there. It sickens me that they'll keep on going there like they aren't a part of the very same problem that Shalom has brought to light.


Will R. Anonymous
Sat, Nov 3, 2:03 PM (2 days ago)
to jaysayer

Jason,

I know this whole last week has likely been devastating to you. Please don’t take my statements as cold or unaware of the full consequences of what has finally come out into the open. Some of us went through this devastation decades ago, internally, with no one beside us and no one to commiserate. While to you these new developments in your organization probably feel like salt on an open wound, to myself and many others, the salt has long since rinsed away and the wound become only another scar. So, I can hardly say I feel too sorry for you, what you're going through now is much easier than many have had it.

While your statement does seem well thought out and heartfelt, don't you believe that your current position of leadership (continuing now since childhood) precludes you from continuing to lead these people in the future? Can you honestly expect anyone to believe that, now, just because you're sorry, you don't still hold a position of power that is a direct lineage from JRS’s original culture that you so adequately describe as “poisoned from the beginning”? Your parent’s direct connection with JRS - with that poison - is what put you in your current leadership position. It’s why your family was spared from the separation, the alienation, the shunning, and abuse. It’s why you’ve been able to enjoy your family while so many others have had theirs torn apart. What you've been given by this organization, your leadership, the integrity of your family unit, your very livelihood, is contaminated. It's polluted not only by your association with John & Chris Sayer but by your own actions and those of your wife.

You can't say that just because you're getting professional help that people don't see you as their leader, that people won’t continue to put you on a pedestal. You can't help that, and you can’t fix it. It's ingrained in their psyches and, as you said yourself, it’s been poisoned. Your charisma, like your father’s and like JRS’s before him will have these broken people, again, hanging on your word, again, following your lead, again, following the words that have failed them so many times before. Any position of leadership you will ever hold with these same people will be tainted by the idolatry that has been so prevalent in this cult. You can see it in the comments below your apology, several are already standing guard at your pedestal as if god has already started filling the void of the one they've just toppled. Your lack of response to Nathan Knarreborg's questions says quite a bit about the letter you've already written. Make some visible show of regret, distance yourself from the mess, tell your sheep that'll be better the next time... But, ultimately, you're standing your ground and keeping your power. It's unconscionable, not just because of your position and your pedigree, but because you've been complicit in action. You know what you and your parents have done to cover up these same kinds of abuses. You know the gag orders that you both tried to place on the telling of the truth. You know who was set out when they didn't obey and you know that it was only par for the course. Plenty of people know why you all ran from Santa Barbara. #itwasntme #wedidntknow #bullshit. You know, you're just as involved and just as culpable, as any of those who've stepped down already.

If you truly do believe the things you wrote in your statement, you will step down as well. You will not continue with that crown on your head that has been passed down by JRS, you will make your way on your own without the power to control people or to manipulate the circumstances. Not only will you have to admit that you’ve been corrupted by this power (it seems you do know this), you’ll have to admit that your power and position are falsely appointed and leave these people with the professional help and those tools to heal. You'll have to admit that, as a perpetrator, you don't belong in a position of influence even in such a tattered state.

But I have a gut feeling (otherwise I wouldn't be writing) that you are still so arrogant and deluded as to believe that these people NEED direction from you... or your mother, or your father, or your wife. I won't ask for your trust, but believe me when I say from experience that they don't. They are much better off without it.

I would never want the congregants to force you out or to ostracize you… Because I would never want them to do what your parents or G&M or so many of the other leaders, who tore families apart for their own power, have done. These things were done for their own power and well-being, not those around them. If you stay in your current or any congregation who have known you, it will only be for your own well-being because your name, your face, your position along with those of your wife and parents are irreconcilably infected with that original power structure. That's why you have to do it of your own accord - to make your own way.

The only honorable thing to do in your position, Jason, is to take your family and go where no one knows you. Build a new life, learn what it’s like to find a job when no one knows your name, learn what it’s like to make new friends after you’ve had your foundation ripped from under you. EARN your own trust and respect without having it given to you by false gods and hero-worship. Learn what it has actually been like for so many families. Only you'd still never quite understand what they have been through, would you? Without this organization splitting your family apart with lies and coercing them not to speak to one another, walking away with your family in-tact is a precious gift.

Think about it. Do you believe that you deserve any more than what the most devastated family got out of this organization? You don't.

But what you don't deserve is to have your family torn from you with lies and manipulation. Not even your family deserves that.

So Jason, if you could really and truly walk away, you could earn my respect and my forgiveness. But, until you can, J&A is just another G&M, and the Mike Baker family just a new set of Walkoes.

You have to, as you say, “root it out”…

You, my (once) friend, are the root.

Go Onion, Go!

Blowout Standing ovation! This should be mandatory reading for every person in a leadership position in every church that was ever affiliated.

FOLLOW THE MONEY!

It isn't likely reparations will ever come. Too bad too, I have family who were wiped out by their "double tithes" and who are destitute today -- now that their church suddenly has no more use for them.

I'll settle for sentences. And I don't mean the punctuated kind either.

Does the U.S. have an extradition agreement with Brazil?

Yep I agree 100 percent. Sadly the people on the inside think that Lisa is representing them when she is just covering Gary's ass because that is what she is paid to do.

ON the FB thread, it is said that this is Dawn--Hargrave's daughter. Anyone know?

[www.sandiegoreader.com]

It seems to me that the lawsuits for victims of what we have heard is a shoe-in.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/06/2018 08:20AM by Cloudwatcher.

Cloudwatcher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ON the FB thread, it is said that this is
> Dawn--Hargrave's daughter. Anyone know?
>
> [www.sandiegoreader.com]
>
> It seems to me that the lawsuits for victims of
> what we have heard is a shoe-in.

Yes, that is her.

How ironic is it that:

Gary Hargrave . . . (will be sued?)
Dawn (Hargrave) . . . did sue
Dorian Hargrove . . . wrote READER article

I remember folding boxes for cassettes at school and at home to accommodate for all the new tapes. And working in tape dupe. Ugh

There will be an extra charge $ to get that last sermon on CD. Plus shipping. No refunds

I so believe that,

Lisa has stated on many occasions that she “was excluded form every meeting with leadership.”

Lisa also states that,

“When I asked I was not given an answer.” “And when I said to Becky/Steve and the rest of leadership that I wanted to be included they just ignored me.”

OMG it sounds like Lisa is throwing the leadership under the bus. It is her most well-known m.o. But it's kind of hilarious that her only complaint is based on not being included in the perverted in crowd.


Thank you Anon for sharing your letter to Jason. I spent a lot of the day shaking my head about the people who are crying about losing their church or losing everything. What the hell do they think we ALL went thru when our eyes were opened to the truth, or when we were cruelly shown the door?

I have empathy for many people that I love because I know this is very painful. But it is necessary! And is the answer that they will thank God for soon.