Reep - I think you're right that it was 1978. Maybe it stopped the kingdom in its tracks for him to choose a life with Marilyn. It stopped a lot of fulfillment in its tracks. I think we can all attest to that.

I agree that after that JRS never seemed the same. Drinking constantly.

The Kling house was interesting as a home for John & Marilyn after they were together. John had a long work table in the "music room" by the atrium doors and he spent a lot of his time editing transcripts of the messages ("The Word") for publication. It seemed joyless to me and I was worried that he was working so hard to get as much done as he could before he died. But later I began to wonder if it was how he escaped from Marilyn and her family. Marilyn micromanaged everything she was ever involved in and every person she came in contact with. As my therapist said, "what a horrible way to live." Did he earn it? Not for me to say.

I heard from someone who was visiting John & Marilyn at the Kling house after they were married. Marilyn was in a foul mood and was screaming at John about something. John turned and said to the visitor “she’s worse than Martha”.

"Maybe it stopped the kingdom in its tracks for him to choose a life with Marilyn."

I think it is only fair to point out that 'Marilyn or no Marilyn' had nothing to do with 'the kingdom' coming or not. The '1979 hallucination' was just that--a pipe dream. Nothing any of us were or were not doing had anything to do with a fantasy becoming REALITY.

One of the many conflicted doctrines of Christianity is that 'the kingdom is coming to the earth', while JESUS himself proclaimed that 'I go to prepare a place for you (not here), so that where I will be (not here), you can be there with me also (not here)'--loose translation, I know. [The Bible scholars in the group can provide chapter & verse.]

None of us should feel a scintilla of guilt over 'failing GOD' in delaying something that is never going to happen. If the PRODIGAL PARABLE teaches us anything, our job is to return to HEAVEN, not wait for this sh*thole of a world to be 'fixed' so that it can somehow resemble the HEAVEN we chose to leave.

The 'acid trip' of Revelations had nothing to do with anything Jesus taught and should have been one of the books 'burned or buried' with some of the other books that should not have, like the GOSPEL OF THOMAS.

Many Christians will eventually come to realize that Christianity itself is a cult and bears little to no resemblance to the GOSPEL OF LOVE that JESUS promoted. All of the 'bad press' and 'fake news' that JESUS has had to endure for 2000+ years has nothing to do with the GOSPEL and everything to do with a religion that should never have been manufactured to promote it.

I hope this does not add any additional Thanksgiving indigestion. If so, please resume taking your nap.

(Thus endeth the epistle.)

P . S .


The entire GOSPEL OF LOVE can be reduced to the two 'suggestions' made my JESUS in answering the Pharisees:

L O V E G O D
L O V E the B R E T H R E N

These are individual organic applications to life that do not require the ridiculous monolith of a corrupt ideology no matter what the flavor.

(Pie & coffee for breakfast, anyone?)

KBoy - Yes, amen. My remark about the kingdom being stopped in its tracks was said as a wiseass remark.

Yes, let's face it, they (the Apostle to the Kingdom and The Apostolic Fathering Ministries) were/are all bad. They deserve each other.

P.S. Is Mercury in retrograde or something? Lol!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2019 04:16AM by Reepicheep.

TheJewel Wrote:
Posted by: TheJewel ()
Date: November 29, 2019 01:45AM
-------------------------------------------------------
> Chachakitty Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> > Had to share... so my nephew was at Shiloh
> helping
> > with getting more stuff out of the building
> prior
> > to it being torn down.
> > He said he was lifting 100# boxes of coins.
> Boxes
> > of pennies ... and other coins .. but boxes and
> > boxes of coins which were being taken to the
> bank
> > to cash in.
> > What??? Why was the fantasy kingdom Hoarding
> > coins. The boxes of pennies alone cashed out to
> > almost $100
> > That money could have been used to help pay for
> > Yasp or help people in need.
> > Did JRS hoard coins ? And if so why ?
>
> Collecting and hoarding coins was recommended by
> “survivalists” in the 70’s — 80’s. There was a lot
> of survivalist thinking among those in TLW.
> Storing guns, ammo, food and probably coins as
> well. TLW thought that the “elect” were going to
> go through the tribulation and you needed to be
> prepared.
>
> The weird crap these guys subscribed to didn’t
> only come from JRS, there was a survivalist belief
> in a coming economic collapse woven in along with
> John Bircher philosophy, etc.


WOW!

I have not been able to recall the name of some preppers guys that we ( my ex husband) had books from. My ex was more into the hoarding than I was. He did work for kingdom business and his father was a leader - I think that.

I had a not so favorable attitude about not meeting basic needs of our children vs giving to the 'cult' and saving for that "rainy day" when Babylon falls. At the time I am wondering what happened to "faith that God would provide"?

As many of you already know, a number of male leaders had alcohol and drug addictions. That had nothing to do with silver coins, but, in my case, if there was paper money it went for addiction rather than milk and cereal or new shoes for growing feet. ( I think this was common among some groups that lived out side of Shiloh.)

So off balance.


My ex hoarded silvers coins. Instead of allowing me to buy maternity clothes he donated his silver coin stash to Shiloh. I'm not sure if that went in to JRS treasure box or if certain women kept it for themselves. ( My mom had overheard E & J talking about what they were going to spend those $100 of face value coins from My ex.

My ex and his leader father had a very "selfish" mindset IMO or holier than thou arrogant entitled elite. I provided the greater % of household income for much of my married life as a "help meet" and submissive wife or Jezebel... Yet. I was not allowed to spend on the necessities I thought my children and I needed.

Sacrifice for the 'kingdom". Work for little wages in a kingdom business - donate on that of that. If you had a wife that could work- donate her income and spend the rest on booze, drugs or porn - but hoard the silver for the 'kingdom that would not come' for the little people.)

I probably do not need to explain that. I feel like I should repent for being harshly blunt and even bitter.

FYI last year I went with a friend to the coin shop. A silver dollar that was no in mind condition had a $17 value on the day I was in that coin shop.

Therefore I hope the silver went to a silver coin dealer rather than only in the coin machine.

Welcome to the forum Northerngate.

I have enjoyed reading your posts. You have added enhanced the puzzle picture with more pieces. Your questions are valid. So, I will had my typ-o input here and there to the already excellent answers.

Every one, have you noticed how it feels like a brand new chapter in the saga of the Fall of the Walk?

Northerngate Wrote:

Date: November 28, 2019 09:46PM
-------------------------------------------------------
> Duly noted Reepicheep. Interesting how it plays
> out. I’ve noticed that my children are having
> extreme trouble that is different from my
> struggles. I was trying to physically escape. I’ve
> been in fight or flight mode for a very long time.
> This affected my children but again their struggle
> is different.


My heart grieves for the children stuck in The church of the Living Word Fellowship under Hargraves.

Personally, I got out about 35 years ago with my children. They still have long term wounds. However, with the explosion of truth, I see some kind of of peace as an option vs confusion of this or that happened in our family dynamics . ( Our lives were chaos because of the influence of the Church of the Living Word / Lying Word.)

Here is my take for what it is worth.

The damage done to lives, especially the children, is variable depending on numerous factors.

[*] what years that connected to The Walk
[*] What location and under whose leadership they joined
[*] What years they participated and their age during those years
[*] Why they decided to join the group- parents or child or spouse
[*] where their income source came from
[*] Did they live at Shiloh for how long?
[*] Who they married or who they were related to

[*] Did you have a strong Bible basic background before the Walk or not?

Each of us came into this cult with our own stuff. Every human being has their own strengths and weakness. Every family has areas of dysfunctional-ism. Each of us or family had some kind of need that we wanted met when the decision was made to visit the group and then stay for ever how long. We have to own that is WAS the choice of the adult to decided to check it out and not walk away after the first visit for what reason..

What ever the reason the first adults who ended up with families in this cult were vulnerable and fairly easy prey to be 'captured' by the group leaders.

For many of us the hardest part of leaving was the amazing bonds we had with follow captives - good people who most of us will always love and cherish as family and friends. Those people may not be the part of the cult we wanted to escape from.

We all had to escaped from the toxic leadership of the Hargraves family Ministries and its minions. The JRS era, where the fraud began is a very different story


Does that make sense to the rest of the forum members? Can you think of any other variables?

IMO, I think that the old time/ core families have an extremely different perspective than those who maybe came in the group in the '80's.

IMO I think the core group that I came from was fed a very different 'song and dance' than other groups, to say the least.( I'm a Washington, Iowa girl from the 1950's) I know the early lies to build Shiloh were not fulfilled as promised. But, some how, what was fed to the core people buffered out all the crap as " It's assault of the enemy. We are being lied about." Correct me if I am dead wrong.

Basically the lies were different in what ever group you were sent to, or left at.
Can any one word that better or correct my opinion from my perspective? I really don;t think we will have simply one exact generic answer for each person in each setting.

But, for many who gave up everything to follow 'Christ in the Flesh" there was no place to turn back to. There was no place run to if you wanted to leave. You have no connections; no resume other than 'doormat' who lost 2 to 10 in making decisions for your self and 'paranoia of Babylon". You had no money and no friends outside. You may have burnt too many bridged because you were told to.

If you left you were put through Hell.

Were people possibly "held against there will?"

Excellent question. See my bullet points above.

I think that there were no visible bars; no visible guns to the head; No visible chains - yet, people were compliant to the will of a few heartless/ narcissistic dictators in the name of "Christ in the Flesh".

The slavery and imprisonment were psychologically binding.

Quote
Onion
Onion wrote on November 29, 2019 09:51AM "I agree that after that JRS never seemed the same. Drinking constantly.
The Kling house was interesting as a home for John & Marilyn after they were together. John had a long work table in the "music room" by the atrium doors and he spent a lot of his time editing transcripts of the messages ("The Word") for publication. It seemed joyless to me and I was worried that he was working so hard to get as much done as he could before he died. But later I began to wonder if it was how he escaped from Marilyn and her family. Marilyn micromanaged everything she was ever involved in and every person she came in contact with. As my therapist said, "what a horrible way to live." Did he earn it? Not for me to say.

"

It is a mental relief for me to read your words about Marilyn micromanaging. When I was a teen and first met Marilyn "micromanage " was not in my vocabulary. Well, that nicely describes why I never liked the woman. JRS looked like whipped pup to me when he was with M when I was around them. In the mid/late '60's I had to keep those thoughts to myself. I'm not aware that anyone else from that era has made a point of the "micromanaging". I called it "bossy.".

Onion, I know you spent countless hours around the 2. I had years prior to witness John and Martha and the their daughters together.

Onion, I want to tell you how much I appreciate knowing that you spoke to Mary Christine about how Martha was treated. That was very kind of you and I think the right thing to do. I only wish more people would be able to say "i'm sorry" to the daughters of JRS. It is no piece of cake being a PK ( preachers's kid) in the first place. And no matter how old a child is the fact that dad is messing around and mom an dad are divorcing is difficult. then top it off with the rest...????

All I can ask is, "What would Jesus have done?" Certainly not what happened - I think that is bears witness to the lack of "Christ in the Flesh Love of Marilyn and Gary who worn the 'King's New clothes' Mantle.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2019 12:04PM by NancyB.

I meant to type "Not in Mint Condition" instead of
"... to the coin shop. A silver dollar that was no in mind condition had a $17 value..."