puddington Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> KBoy’s right. The coming days will be brighter.
> Yay!!!
>
> TMason, you bring up a good point. Seeing a mental
> health professional is very helpful. I did this
> as well. But I think you have to be selective
> about who you go see. Most psycologists are
> unfamiliar with cults and don’t know much about
> helping a cult victim. Ask around. The good ones
> are out there. You just have to find them. This
> forum is a tremendous help as well. We’re all
> kind of counciling each other.


I agree we do have to be picky with counselors we chose. They all have their own expertise. Finding one with cult experience is worth looking for.
For me to just be able to say it out loud or type it ( in my case typ-o) to some one who actually gets it with calling gas lighting me is so therapeutic.

I have gotten a lot of ah-ha's just from writing some thing out now that I have been free of the distraction of violent aggressive verbiage. So, yes, I see this as some of the best counseling I have ever gotten. Thanks you every one for your kind patience with me.

kBOY Wrote:
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> NOW is the time for full disclosure:
>
> 1) WHO will be overseeing the implementation of
> all the actions to be taken listed previously?
>
> 2) We need a comprehensive list of members under
> the TLW leadeship umbrella who are being
> officially REMOVED from all responsibilities and
> duties, including APCO, pastors, elders, etc.
> CHURCH by CHURCH.
>
> 3) We also want all the financials released for a
> full accounting.

Hey k boy
it's now January. Due the all the efforts of you all I have really begun to reunite with people who were always valuable to me. So thank you everyone on that progress.

Has there be any progress on following the money?
I am calling around to try to find a class action lawyer that handles this kind of thing.
Wondering if anyone has found an appropriate firm yet? Once we find someone to take the case how do we collect the people who may have access to some kind of documents to reveal how much in family funds were given to build Shiloh?

I would think that deed transfers and change of corporate names for Shiloh would be in the Washington, Iowa county court house. i called today but due to snow short staff for people who maybe could help. Rather than going there i will try to see if I can search documents on line with out having to pay fee.

I will guess I need spellings if I were to figure out how to get years of documents. Asking for ideas and names that may have been used that I would not be aware of after I left.
Anyone?

Onion Wrote:
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>
> This is my understanding of the origination of the
> tape ministry. Naomi Klein actually started it
> but when she fell out of favor (i.e. was exposed
> for having an affair with JRS and as part of the
> intercessors of fame led prayers for Martha
> Stevens' death and also the death of her husband,
> Howard) then Marilyn was instrumental in having it
> moved to her control at Bix House. It is possible
> that Naomi was still involved after the taperoom
> started at Blix but when I moved into the house in
> Feb. 1972 she had shipped out to the Bay Area and
> Marilyn and Bessie were in charge.

My 2 cents.

I don't know about Blix in CA but the Gardners way back in the 50's sat on the front row of Christian Tab with a reel to reel to record everything including ministry. Then they typed it all up. The recording weren't sold, yet.

But, did you know that at one time all the typed ministry in Wash was kept in a file? Certain people could go back in and read what "prophesied". Back then the atmosphere of a getting hands laid on for prophesy which was a bit different before the "walk" later on - Scary and I was too young to read 1984 then.
Oh wait, you all may have known jrs recorded everything later on. Who knew they kept files on people?

Sometimes before the locks got changed in Wash ( I was not there- but my source was credible) my source told me she was going to the office on a week day. Among the revealing naughties she over heard was the daughter and mother reading people's ministries out loud just for fun, I guess, and laughing and poking fun at those people. . I did not realize about the files until I was married and had children.

Writing that did not have the impact now that I had in mind. I don't think we had the HIPPA law back then like it is now. Wow!Think of the possibilities to blackmail or do a con job if someone wanted to.

And to think leadership tries to claim that listening to abuse confessions or claims is like priest in confession scared? (my words) Another example of how the rules change on a whim in this corporate cult.

Cloudwatcher Wrote:
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I have done a lot of
> work on uncovering things I will be forwarding to
> Mary. I have also studied many of the scriptures
> that were twisted around our heads and deciphered
> true meaning from the viewpoint of historical
> Christianity.
>

I love it when someone writes about scripture twisting! Thank you so much.
i know that so many have figured that out- but reading it or hearing it out loud is so refreshing!

When I was kid i was a bible geek I guess. Thanks the lord. I memorized and read books and chapters over and over. Not a brag - It never set well with me to hear bullshit from the pulpit. Getting rebuked for questioning after so long I gave up - after all I was not an authority- grateful for that now as well. My nose is clean.

changedagain Wrote:
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> Interesting. No doubt John was a drinker.
> However, I don't think his drinking occurred
> during the church services (unlike one of my
> pastors). I suppose if he drank alone, and didn't
> involve any members of the church, that would be
> O.K.--

Sorry I'm late. If I am understanding this post I have to jump in.
In Anaheim on Saturdays i often came late because I had worked all night. I can still see the vision in my head of jrs being assisted out of the vehicle drunk as a skunk who claimed it did not stink.
At first I asked someone. The Standard reply was that he was under so much heavy battle.
But at the pulpit he could get so squire-ly with his kingdom proverbs.
I can't say if he passed the bottle around on the drive there or not.

I do that a some guys on numerous occasions were laughing about finishing up the communion wine so it wasn't''t wasted.

I also know that we gave rides to some of the same guys to services up north. They had to stop and get something in a brown bag. Booze was common at church among guys my husband knew well.

I said something to my father-in-law and his new wife about JRS drunk when he was getting out the car at Anaheim- but I was blown off. I was not my father-in-law's favorite person. He was privy to the back room. I not sure if my father-in-law was simply oblivious or in denial.

I'm still disturbed by the repeated scene I witnessed and have to question my sanity with so much denial that the issue was that jrs was under attack.

One leader told me he got his own best revelations when he was drunk and or high. What do you do with a statement like that?

lily rose Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Reepicheep Wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------
> >
After reading
> kbyrne's post about how all the personal ministry
> was typed up, shared, and probably archived for
> years, I wondered how or if it impacted members'
> lives years later when G&M conducted their purges.
>
> Reepicheep said, "Nobody ever outgrew the need to
> ask for confirmation." Yes, very creepy indeed.

Sorry, again I am a year late. I've been doing a lot of heavy reading. We survivors now have a new private page. Earlier tonight on that page I posted something about the "prophesies" in the Washington church were all typed up and on file since the Gardners taped on reel to reel I think. A few years ago we threw out very old prophesies - so I am pretty sure on this.

Some time before the locks were changed on the doors in Wash my credible source was going to the office in the church. A daughter and mother were reading people ministry files and laughing about them. I knew that I could get old prophecies but it never clicked in my brain before my source told me how she eavesdropped for some time. it was creepy to hear this. I have may have left already before I was told this.
Think of the possibilities: black mail pops into my head.
Was this the case in every "church" or not that files were kept? I have no idea.

puddington Wrote:
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> Mental health professionals will tell you there is
> an inner self that is deep and private. A normal
> person keeps this place secret and private. It is
> very unhealthy to expose this place to another
> human.
>
> But the Living Word demands that you open it up
> and give it all. You are expected to tell your
> “designated relationship” everything. Including
> these secret places. This is very harmful IMO.
>
>

WOW! Thank you for that. The 'boundaries" issue just clicked in my head. WOW!. Been working on that in therapy over the years. I understood the concept but I could not ever seem to fully apply it. I knew that I had "gullible" and "vulnerable written across my forehead for every social path that came my way to read-I knew I had a old record with deep scratched groves. WOW! Now it personally makes sense. Thank you.

MY GENERATIONAL 2 CENTS:

* * * * *

The FIRST generation were those 'elder' members who joined in the 50s-60s.

The SECOND generation were those in their 20s who enlisted in the 70s.

The THIRD generation were those in their 20s in the 80s.

The FOURTH generation were the offspring of the SECOND generation.

kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MY GENERATIONAL 2 CENTS:
>
> * * * * *
>
> The FIRST generation were those 'elder'
> members who joined in the 50s-60s.
>
> The SECOND generation were those in their
> 20s who enlisted in the 70s.
>
> The THIRD generation were those in their
> 20s in the 80s.
>
> The FOURTH generation were the offspring of
> the SECOND generation.


Such fascinating stuff when we try to pin it all down!

So, if my parents were in their 30's when they came in, during the 70's, making them 2nd, and I was in my 20's in the 80's, making me 3rd, doesn't it also make me 4th because my parents are 2nd? *headspins*

Isn't that sort of like the country song "I'm My Own Grandpa"? Just sayin'. ;)
[g.co]