Lone Wolf - I'm also having a hard time knowing what to think about Shiloh University. I've now heard of/from several TLWF people who said they actually got to know God (in what I'm hoping and presuming was an authentic salvation experience through Jesus Christ) *because* of their studies at Shiloh U.

Over the past several years I've spoken with folks who are in the know and in leadership there, and everyone has confirmed that there is very little (practically no) TLWF influence in the curriculum. Started out with a bit more, but that was quickly weeded out, apparently.

So - from what I can tell - it seems that the teaching is solid, and because of that students (including TLWF people) actually get exposure to Biblical and basic Christian truths, which is good. But, I'm like you - skeptical as all get out. Even if the teaching is good and they are an entity unto themselves, I don't think I'd ever recommend that anyone go to a school started by/out of a cult.

Maybe there is a way they can save the good and rebrand or something, but I can't imagine them surviving as is, especially since I think the vast majority of their students have been from TLWF - another example of closed-loop "services" that are supposedly created for the benefit of the world but really only kept viable by the finances and volunteer time of congregants.

This is a very good point.

Remember the saying that the Devil can cite Scripture to serve his own purposes?

Consider what happens when we go to a seminary or university.

We are sharing our lives with fellow students, and in the most intimate ways - meals, prayer, bathrooms, running into each other in town, parties.

We develop trust in each other.

If enough of our fellow students belong to the same CULT, and we share our seminary lives with them, we will love them, trust them and by extension, trust the church they belong to - in this case, The Walk.

Why take this risk when there are plenty of universities and seminaries that have not been compromised in this manner?

"Closed-loop services." So apropos, JJJ. Seemingly everything done in TLWF has that unwelcome feature.

corboy Wrote:

> If enough of our fellow students belong to the
> same CULT, and we share our seminary lives with
> them, we will love them, trust them and by
> extension, trust the church they belong to - in
> this case, The Walk.
>
> Why take this risk when there are plenty of
> universities and seminaries that have not been
> compromised in this manner?

True

That said, the students at Shiloh University, operating in good faith, don't deserve unnecessary hurt. I hope this works out to minimize harm to their finances, job prospects etc.

Regarding SU, those who have already invested thousands of dollars attending, or more likely, studying online, may find that their credits are not transferrable. Beware when a group tries to monopolize every aspect of your life. It's so much harder to extricate yourself from all the snares and entanglements.

Yes and anyone talking to an attorney working for TLWF should ask very clearly who their client is, who their obligation is to, and what they want to know.

When I was heavily involved in lawyering and litigation, etc., when someone was suing for an injury, the defense would always demand an "independent medical examination" of the complaining party. The Plaintiffs' Bar in Los Angeles (a zillion of the toughest litigators in California) demanded that defense counsel be required to start referring to it as a "defense medical exam" because calling it "independent" was OBVIOUSLY misleading. Whoever pays for the expert is going to benefit from the expert opinion. Lawyers represent clients and it doesn't matter who is paying their bill UNLESS the lawyer is acting on behalf of the client paying their bill.

I have heard that Lisa Runquist is being sent around to churches to help them plan their corporate transition.

OH

MY

GOD

Important questions the churches should be asking:

1. WHO is sending her?

2. Who does she represent? And how does she plan to get around the conflict of interest presented by her prior representation of Gary and/or Rick versus her current representation of churches that may want to break away from the fellowship?

3. Is she licensed to advise clients in Oregon, Colorado, wherever. And if not, what is her purpose in arriving in those locations to purportedly give legal guidance?

AND MOST IMPORTANT: GET IT IN WRITING (re: conflict and who she represents and if she's licensed) AND THEN GET A SECOND OPINION from an another attorney on any advice she gives.

This whole idea is extremely shaky when an attorney is even willing to participate in something like this when the conflict already exists or will so CLEARLY exist at some point in the future.


I am a personal witness to her stabbing people in the back or in her assistance of a client in falsifying records for an IRS audit. Any questions?

This just in... (not really but I like saying that).

I have heard that some of those who are standing firm and trying to be the "True Remnant" are saying very flippantly that they just don't believe all the lies.

Uh.... So that means they are not believing any of us who put our lives on the line for this organization for anywhere from 5 to 50 years who are now telling the stories of what happened to us, what we saw, what we can prove? Since Gary openly apologized about the abuses perpetrated by Rick, then what was the apology for? He didn't handle things right? So I would like to hear him describe what his new enlightenment tells him is the way he SHOULD HAVE handled things. Hmmm?

It makes me deeply, in a snarl down in my core, angry that people who have told their very personal and humiliating stories of abuse and anguish are called liars.

And I have another question for these people who now stand "true" by ignoring everything that is being said. When JRS passed out the documents pertaining to his goal to have a huge library at each of the churches and included on that list were the many volumes he has concerning the occult, he said it was important to know how Satan operates so he read about the occult for that purpose.

So I challenge the current leadership of TLWF and any of the churches that want to stay "true" to Gary, Rick, JRS, whoever, to at least read all of the information that is available through this forum, through the Facebook TLWF Survivors Stories, and in the astounding response to Shalom's public FB post from October and then decide. If everyone who has spoken out is just Satan, well hell, then at least you'll know what we have to say about the thing you are so driven to protect.

Pick a lane folks. Be loving or be name-calling and say that we are all liars and Satan. You can't have it both ways. I believe there are MANY very good folks that I love very much who may not want to rock their foundations by leaving TLWF and that is their choice. Everyone is free to make their own choices now.

But if you want to stay, PLEASE make a completely informed decision. If you read everything that has been said about the various problems in TLWF starting from the beginning, and you still want to carry forward based on JRS teaching and TLWF principles, then I for one will back you in that informed decision.

But please - let's all agree no matter where we stand in the current shift that is going on, that at least we will stop lying to others and ourselves and we will OWN our decisions. As long as everyone agrees on that one goal then there is no reason for nastiness or dispute between any of us.

One caveat: If anyone intends to continue to protect and hide sexual abusers and pedophiles then that's a different topic all of its own. No one should be tolerant of that idea or any hint of it.

And yeah, I'm pissed tonight. I don't like trickery. I don't like people who have been harmed to be called liars.

Also - and let me be clear - I am very careful not to call people out or name wrongdoings unless I can prove what I'm saying. Be confident of that.

Probably one of the hardest pills for all of us to swallow will simply be accepting the fact that TLW is going to have it's own version of 'holocaust deniers'. There will always be those who never fully recover from their 'substance addiction.'

Be that as it may, there should be no reason to stop shedding LIGHT on darkness previously protected. Don't forget--what has been whispered in the shadows is now being shouted from rooftops.

Shedding even more light: Wasn't there a 'word fad' for a while that we had to be 'tracking' w/J & M? And what-the-hay with the 'sleeping prophecies'?