At the time I left TLWF (1999), Directors of a local corporation could be removed by Apco for any or no reason. If there was a conflict between the Officers of the corporation, the Apostolic Fathering Ministry had the final say. Unless something has changed, I don’t see how a local church could break away from TLWF without permission. It was my understanding that it was set up this way because of what had happened in Washington, IA. What was not anticipated was the Apostolic
Fathering Ministry being the one taking everything and there not being anything you could do about it.

If a facility were to be sold, the money would have to go to another church within the fellowship (e.g. Hargrave Family Ministries) and could not go to anyone personally. Directors were not to use their position for personal profit - it had to be beneficial to the organization. The only exception I can recall was the use of members to remodel the Director's personal residence and then the increased property value would be channeled back to the organization upon sale of the property – or something like that. It’s a bit fuzzy now.

Sounds like more manipulation to me.

Drbuckunghamdc - I'm sorry for causing you any hurt and not being more conscientious of how this would affect you. The rumors are certainly rampant, and attempting to sort fact from fiction before the next big deception attempt by the LWF leadership is difficult. Wishing you the best!

Is that THE Dr. John Buckingham? If so, you make a mean pancake. I enjoyed going over to your house for brunch.

Drbuckunghamdc:


I totally agree. I assume you are referencing your own family saga, which I am sure has been a lot to bear over the decades. If you are able to set the record straight on these matters, then all the gossip can come to a halt.

Since we all grew up in an atmosphere of secrecy, where scandals of all sorts were swept under the rug, gossip was as close as anyone got to the truth, since the truth was always withheld.

Please shed some light on the issue so it can go on the record. Since we were all told we were 'John's sons', it is a part of our family history.

Drbuckunghamdc:


P.S.

The abusive and retaliatory nature of the leadership has made it necessary for many to employ pseudonyms in order to mitigate any further damage to themselves or other loved ones.

I was just thinking back on how God has used the broken roads to bless me – many were my own mistakes. In this season of life, I’m so thankful for everything He has done. I know this period may seem like a crash and burn for many who have been involved in TLWF. But God is able to take from the ashes and rebuild relationships, first with Himself, and then with those who we have walked with for years and deeply loved, but thought we would never see again. I know the story is not over because He is such a good, good Father. Here’s a couple of Caleb and Kelsey songs that have been running through my mind the last few days:

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

kBOY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> The abusive and retaliatory nature of the
> leadership has made it necessary for many to
> employ pseudonyms in order to mitigate any further
> damage to themselves or other loved ones.

People who follow this forum regularly can probably easily guess the identity of the at least some of the long time posters. I knew right away which contributor is Larry Bono, and it didn't take long for me to identify Mike Jones, the rapper.
Who?

p.s. This person has only posted once, but I'm confident I also know the identify of SpecialCounselRobBurt. Don't bother messaging me. I'm not revealing anything.

Re: Larry Bobo's post,

If you examine cults and cult leaders, you'll often times notice that cult leaders have a tendency to co-mingle their personal and organizational funds. In other words ... they're not all that careful and concerned about the law and the IRS when it comes to them using church property and money for personal gain.

I suspect that TLWF is the same when it comes to this. In fact family stories suggest that Marilyn was constantly self-dealing when it came to TLWF funds and property. I was told that you all were paying and paying for her life of luxury and ability to do as she pleased.

So ... this is could be an avenue for you, the former members of TLWF, take down Gary, Rick and anyone else who has been self-dealing, abusing, etc. members.

And by the way, dare Gary to sue anyone of you or a group of you. Remember in these kinds of civil suits you get to depose them, you get their records, you get their and the organization's tax returns and access to their financial records and bank statements. You get their emails. Etc.

One more thing since the CLW started in LA, there has to be one or more ex-members with substantial financial resources to hire a good law firm.

And if possible, I'd start any legal action (criminal or civil) in CA. From all that I've seen, Iowa is either too complacent or too corrupt to be of any assistance. Before I forget it, the Foreign corrupt practices act may apply to property and funds outside of the US.

So when you finally engage with them, you won't just have a battle on your hands, you'll have a war. So be ready. Initially they'll likely come at you extremely hard, pulling every dirty trick that they have. However, if you can outlast them I think you'll win because the longer it goes on, the more that will come out, the more defections you'll get, etc. And they'll collapse like the house of cards that they are.



larry bobo Wrote:

...
>
> If a facility were to be sold, the money would
> have to go to another church within the fellowship
> (e.g. Hargrave Family Ministries) and could not go
> to anyone personally. Directors were not to use
> their position for personal profit - it had to be
> beneficial to the organization. The only
> exception I can recall was the use of members to
> remodel the Director's personal residence and then
> the increased property value would be channeled
> back to the organization upon sale of the property
> – or something like that. It’s a bit fuzzy now.

I find myself wondering who some of you are... because I'm sure some, if not most of you, are at least acquaintances. But then I read posts like those from "drbuckunghamdc" who had “the guts” to presumably misspell his own name because he was in such a hurry to warn us with the veiled threats that are so common in this cult... "watch out" "you are becoming evil". Then I remember why most of us remain anonymous, I remember why I left in the first place. I don’t want you or anyone to know who I was. I’m embarrassed to say I was associated with this cult and I’m disgusted that you and I were likely in the same place at the same time breathing the same air and soaking up the same delusion.
Well, Dr Buckungham, there are some new names below, not just for you, but because there should no longer be silence, because this cult should no longer be able to shut people up with its empty promises and empty threats.
That’s not to say that many people in this cult are not kind and loving (however gullible), to varying degrees. That’s exactly why it’s also littered with sociopathic predators that will use any type of manipulation they see fit to further their agenda and to keep their power over people who will believe (anyone else will be shunned btw, convenient). I’ve seen first-hand how they alienate those who speak up, split families apart to thwart communication, bend the truth just enough so it’s hard to tell that it’s a lie. Rick Holbrook & Scott McDonald are only the ugly perverted tip of the iceberg. The perversion runs deep. While Gary & Marilyn covered up Rick abusing girls, John & Chris Sayer covered up Tony Flores abusing the boys. And don’t you doubt that John & Chris’s children won’t pick up that mantle… They’re in deep.
But when you take a step back it’s farcical. When you read actual literature (and no, the bible and JRS twaddle do not count) and talk to normal educated people…you realize how silly it really is. No one would believe that crap, right? The lexicon that Shalom uses in her letters really brings me back. The way these words are used make me remember how gullible I really was, how I bought it.
It’s like a novel “heart, ministry, shepherding, spirit, rebellion, apostolic company, mantle, anointing, the Word, prophecy, revelation”?! They use this vocabulary as Newspeak designed to be ambiguous, designed to be fantastical, designed to keep the proles from ever fully understanding the story (because, believe me they really don’t themselves, no one does). It’s designed to keep the mystery alive and give those who have the power even more control over their subjects, ultimately designed to keep money flowing into their corporations. JRS, Gary & Marilyn, Matt & Margo. These people have been living large on their flock for some time. Just look at some of their properties, it’s public information. You think they got these things from the sweat of their brow? Nope. They got it from the people that fell for the JRS fiction, the LRonHubbard-like fully immersive cosplay with real emotional and physical consequences. It’s a disgusting game that the people almost understand they’re playing. What the ones that stay don’t all understand (sometimes refuse to understand), is that it’s a zero-sum game. They don’t win until you lose… that’s how they win, someone loses, an example must be made. Someone has to be excommunicated, someone must split from their family, someone has to bend to the will of the elders, while you’re in it, they win.
“The only winning move is not to play”
I’m so glad it’s no longer a part of my life. I’m so glad my children will never meet the sociopaths. I’m so glad that their castle is crumbling because it’s built on a lie, because it’s built on the blood, sweat, and tears of people who were brainwashed into believing their drivel.
I can only hope this continues and that the whole congregation wakes up, and that every person that has played a part in this fiasco has to go out and find a real job and find a real life, one where they have no control over other people’s lives, one where they must earn trust instead of having it anointed by a crackpot fantasy.