Yes. Download her letters, at least. I suspect the FB police will delete Shalom’s post.

Reepicheep Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Has anybody looked at FB lately? There are reports
> that Gary is saying that this is all HIS idea! He
> started the investigation.

I wonder how long it is going to take him to discover he has been shielding sexual predators for decades? I hope it is something he can see right away.

I_woke_up Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Heads up! Just as a precaution start print
> screening Shalom’s thread. My Facebook account was
> hacked!

puddington Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes. Download her letters, at least. I suspect
> the FB police will delete Shalom’s post.

Yes

This was posted by John Miller on FB, on Shalom’s post:

Hi Shalom…tons of blessings, love and our most intense support to You, Daniel and your beautiful Sons! Wow, closing in on 1000 posts/responses. Who would have ever thought just a few days ago a floodtide of this magnitude would have happened?! We are witnessing and experiencing a historic moment in time; and the courage, transparency/vulnerability, and heart that You and Daniel have and are demonstrating is the catalyst for this floodtide, and an inspiration and example for all of us.

You already know how Jenelle and I feel about you and what you are accomplishing here, but we wanted to put a stake in the ground re: our unequivocal position on a few concerns which it appears we share with you and so many who have posted here over the last few days. Please forgive the length of this post, it will most likely be the first and last one I place on this thread. As recommended and advised to me through conversations yesterday (Sat. 10-27-18) with several leading contributors to this thread, I will be taking responses to Point #4 on my Facebook IM so as to not clutter or distract from the purpose of your thread. If there are responses/comments re: the first three points, I suggest that people should feel free to post them here as they may be relevant to this thread.

1. Rick Holbrook (RH) has repeatedly demonstrated his complete inability to function within the bounds of even the lowest expectations of appropriate behavior towards underage and adult women. His violations are egregious, heinous, and may end up being of special interest to the local Law Enforcement Agencies. Therefore, his recent termination is far past due. All people of good will who have a direct interest in and knowledge of his violations know this termination should have occurred long ago. That said, his termination should be final with no chance of restoration to any of his former involvement in what is left of the organization. Additionally, he needs to know what it is like to be a real human being, and as “the Good Book” says, “learn to work by the sweat of his brow,” i.e., get a job in the real world! Which of course means that he should subsequently receive no further finances.

My above RH remarks are based on my first-hand involvement dealing with RH in various church admin settings, and foremost as the three time go-to-guy to help clean up his scandals. This involvement took place over a period of almost six years – at three, two-year intervals, 1995-1996, 1999-2000, and 2008-2009. I was requested by G/M to come to LA and for lack of better words try and figure out what to do with RH and how to deal with the fall-out of each of those scandals. Prior to those dates I was not privy to any of his other illicit encounters, but of course I, like everyone else, knew he was on his third wife by that time. My focus was primarily on the issue of what I felt to be a lack of care for the people in both TLW and CLW as they were caught in the ensuing relational disasters. I am not casting aspersions on any of the men and women at CLW who were attempting to do right by the sheep. I could provide a list of these CLW ones if needed. Their efforts were not necessarily at fault, they weren’t perfect, but they were trying. Their frustration and ultimate failure was primarily derived from the fact that RH fought them constantly and blocked pretty much everything they tried to do. I myself engaged in what amounted to hundreds of hours of interviews and counseling with slaughtered sheep; most begging me to not allow RH to ever be put back in charge again. (I have many examples of the pleas from people to not let RH be re-installed. If needed I could bring them forward.) My response in all three of my two-year intervals there in LA was to work with the CLW church elders to try and establish a system by which the needs of the people could be attended to, especially the many who were wounded from whichever current scandal fall-out was happening at the time. Much, much more detail could be added here. Please feel free to ask. Re: TLW, there was never even the slightest opportunity to help the sheep there. RH would never allow it; so, my focus stayed with the CLW sheep and elders. In order to shorten this section, I will say the above description occurred across all three of my interventions in LA. Additionally, each intervention time period was attended with countless hours of discussion and updates with G/M, sometimes Matt W, Silas, Boney, etc., with many sessions going almost all day and sometimes as late as 1am, 2am, or later into the night. My recommendation to G/M and others at the end of each of my two-year interventions was always the same: “Do not re-install RH as a leader or an authority figure in LA. He is a repeat offender and one of the worst church overseers I have ever seen.” It was like he lived to be contrary to the sheep and others who were at least trying to do the right thing. Subsequently within very short time frames, he was back in charge. The Hargraves never counseled with me re: an exit strategy and a plan for what should be done with him next, they just re-empowered him and made him the LA authority again. After my “08-’09 intervention” and return to San Diego, it was not long before I was placed under some pretty harsh discipline by the new lady overseer of SD, and from there turned over to the Haworths in Shiloh, where I was subsequently fired. So, the following point I make re: RH, comes with a good deal of first-hand knowledge.

2. It is also of great importance to recognize that RH is only a sad sidelight manifestation of a much deeper and more pernicious cultural and systemic malignancy; one of unbridled hyper-authoritarian top-down leadership void of any legitimate checks and balances. This systemic condition pervading TLWF has long created the climate for the incidence and rise of an RH and his accomplices and enablers. However, to make RH as issue – perhaps one could say a scapegoat - without fully recognizing the absolute culpability, responsibility, and enabling of the top-down leadership would be a farce of epic proportion. RH is what he is…now he is gone. Accountability must not, cannot stop there, that is, with his departure. Shalom you have suffered more at the hands of TLWF than any of us may ever know; therefore, it is imperative that you, and the many others posting here who are also victims of this culture, see the justice of “the buck stopping where it rightly should,” i.e., with Gary Hargrave (GH). His name is on the bottom line of the corporate documents granting him the privilege of oversight, but hand-in-hand with bottom-line oversight comes bottom-line responsibility and accountability for the events, activities, and supervision of the behavior of his organizational subordinates. He has continually failed on these issues. At this point in the present TLWF fiasco the only correct and proper option – in order to fulfill his fiduciary responsibility - would be for GH to resign/step down and immediately acknowledge his complicity in RH’s behavior, and/or negligence in his long-term leadership practices. His track record in these matters has rendered him unqualified to continue in his present position.

To be continued on next post...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/29/2018 08:52AM by puddington.

Continue from previous post
3. Shalom, I would further suggest that in order to create any possible future trust or credibility re: TLWF - as viewed by the majority of those posting on your thread - all remaining top-tier members of the organization’s leadership follow in GH’s example, and for the welfare and progress of the fellowship, immediately resign/step down and likewise freely confess their own complicity and enabling in the creation of the organization’s various malignancies. This would of course include all significant oversight Board Directors. I would also express that the loss of these ones from active organizational oversight will greatly contribute to a fruitful and positive going forward. This “going forward” would be based on a trust in God to provide a leadership element which is strongly connected to a whole new approach to church governance, one which continually serves the best interests of God and His Flock; not one which serves the interests of a privileged cadre of leaders.

4. A concluding point for the moment is of a personal nature. Shalom, as you and many of your posters know I too was once a visible member of TLWF Leadership, aka, APCO, and off-and-on for quite a number of years the main pastor of the San Diego Church. Over time, a few people have asked me, and perhaps others have wondered, why I am no longer active in these ministry areas, i.e., where have I been. I say the following (which is but a thumbnail sketch of my past eight years), hopefully not as a defense or self-justification, but because some have asked why I have been so silent.

My previous church related activities began to significantly decline in 2010 due to being removed as a pastor, and shortly thereafter I was terminated by the TLWF top-tier Overseers saying, “I was not of their spirit…I was 100% wrong in all areas of my spiritual life…there was nothing I did that was right…and there was no place I fit in TLWF.” There was actually more said, but enough. I felt then, as I do now, I could not be happier that they felt I was not of their spirit, etc. These remarks were actually left-handed compliments to me. Since then, and having no retirement, my wife and I have been rebuilding our lives, trying to start a couple of business, and are participating in a number of amazing churches - long story, many details. If anyone is interested we would be happy to speak with any of you re: the termination issues, and our subsequent life rebuilding. But, please not on this thread because this thread is not about Miller’s issue, it is about the immediate heart-breaking, gut wrenching, and tragic experiences of Shalom and many others. Rather, please feel free to IM me on my Facebook in re: the above, and also any responses to the following:

My departure back then does not, however, acquit me, from my complicity of at one time promoting the TLWF agenda, and/or violating the trust of the members of the San Diego Church. I see my offences falling into those categories. Having been a long-standing member of APCO and a pastor of a sizeable local church I recognize and accept the fact that I too am accountable/responsible for my own areas of incompetence, miss-guided counsel and/or actions, especially my participation at that time in and promotion of the TLWF agenda; and God (and perhaps many of you) only knows what else. Therefore, where I have hurt and offended anyone, and have been less to you than a good shepherd and man of God I want to begin the process of repentance and humbling myself as I should. Tell me what I need to know and don’t, or what I did and should not have, etc. By the grace of God, I will provide no excuses nor cast blame. Please by all means IM me and let me know my errors and offences. I sincerely want to repent and either restore broken relationships and/or hopefully create new ones. It would be my great privilege and responsibility to help heal what I have hurt. I am accountable.

Thanks, and know that Jenelle Sparks Miller and I love you all very much.
John Miller

I'm wondering if the page is also getting overloaded with so many posts at the same time.

The mystery of the Waller family (including the Prewetts) leaving TLWF has been answered. No drama. No assault on the children. Just a family of people who realized TLWF was a cult and walked out. The dad of the family had given so much for so long and was really dedicated to an organization that turned out to be nothing more than a cult serving a few people at the top. That was it.

They just learned the truth sooner than most of us did and acted appropriately.

Yay for them all!! They are a wonderful family and I have nothing but good memories of every single one of them and I'm so glad there was nothing horrible lurking beneath the surface.

Greetings everyone,

I'm sharing some documents I've accumulated recently.

1) Here is Woodrow Nichol's book on TLW. In it, Nichols documents many travesties which serve as warning signs for some of the terrible things we've unfortunately all become aware of recently. Nichols raises many warning signs about JRS' authoritarian personality, as well as his insistence on total submission and unquestioning loyalty from his followers. Nichols also documents allegations of JRS abusing the trust and devotion his congregation placed in him by using his position as pastor to pursue and commit affairs, beginning as early as 1967. That particular incident split the Valley church when love letters were found corroborating claims that he'd been using his influence as pastor to seduce a deacon's wife.
[drive.google.com]

2) This is an article in the Honolulu Advertiser dated Sunday, June 27th, 1999, a time that Gary was likely giving a Summer Camp sermon at Shiloh, Iowa. In the article, Gary is showing off his "Hidden Island Sanctuary," a luxurious property he and Marilyn owned on Oahu. This property is located within a mile of both the ocean and Diamond Head State Park. In the article, Gary claims that most of the renovations were done almost exclusively with church labor. It appears that in either June of 2000 or April 2005, Gary sold this property at a considerable gain. If it was sold in 2005, the sale price was $3.5M. Also in April 2005, Gary purchased his current property, located within a half mile of another beach. Gary's current property appears to have also been renovated and has since seen a large increase in value as well, from approx. $1.75 million in 2005 to approx. $3.25M today. My sources all come from public data available online, primarily the City & County of Honolulu and a local Oahu real estate page, oahure.com. Therefore, these figures could be inaccurate, but are reasonable estimations. I share them because this is how things appear based on public data. At the very least, this shows an example of the luxury Gary and Marilyn have enjoyed for the past few decades. Unfortunately, if accurate, it could also serve as an example of Gary using church labor to greatly amplify his personal wealth.
[drive.google.com]

3. An interview given to the Iowa City Press Citizen detailing "death prayers" being directed by leadership toward Martha Stevens at Shiloh. These prayers have been vehemently denied by leadership as having occurred, although at times it is admitted that they were prevalent, but "in no way sanctioned by JRS or senior leaders."
[drive.google.com]

4. A Des Moines Register article detailing a burglary case involving Joe Knott, a member of TLW, who burned down the house of a critic of John Robert Stevens. In the court case, Knott claimed that the local church at Shiloh incited him to commit the burglary and arson.
[drive.google.com]

These articles do not prove beyond a reasonable doubt any wrong doing. That said, they should raise questions. Those questions should be asked, and they should not be discouraged. These events do not need to be believed, but we should all be aware that they're possibilities. I repeat, they should not be discouraged. At this point in TLWF's history, ex-members probably outnumber current members by thousands. There are countless testimonies of ex-members explaining how TLWF harshly discourages asking questions that are critical of its history or the decisions of its leaders. My point is not to spread gossip. My point is that this church has discouraged any criticism whatsoever with phrases like "that's just gossip," "check your spirit," or "so and so is just bitter." Ask questions. Demand answers. There is nothing shameful about seeking the truth.

GS



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/29/2018 11:21AM by GSchaeff.

I know that forgiveness provides a path to freedom for those who have been offended. Trust, on the other hand, is something that is earned. Decades of good behavior can be offset by one betrayal. However, decades of betrayal reveal a deep character flaw that should not be ignored. The corporation of TLWF could be closed down, ending public outcry over violations, since it no longer exists – as well as accountability of those involved. Moving the same leaders to a new corporation does not solve the problem - even if it may end bad press from the past. Business corporations do it all the time to limit the liability of their Board of Directors. Same people, new name, and the same problems. No matter where you go, there you are – even if you declare it’s a new day and any past problems were the other guys fault.

I am suspect of the new open door for complaints, since for many years it was the method of fishing for who to remove from the fellowship. If you disagree, you’re gone. It may also be a way of exposing legitimate legal concerns so that legal defense strategies can be put in place. There is not the history that would show a legitimate concern for the people, instead of personal gain. For Gary to suggest that it is he who started an investigation is laughable. He just finally got exposed a little deeper. One can only hope that as people bare their hearts, there will at least be some shepherds that will show compassion, instead of following the party line no matter who it hurts.

Sexual abuse is always a wake-up call to most people. It certainly has generated a lively recent discussion – perhaps because of the Me Too movement. Spiritual abuse, on the other hand, can be equally damaging. I experienced both in TLWF, and for me, the spiritual abuse was much more traumatic and difficult to unravel. Most people, who were old enough to make the choice (first, second, and third generations), became a part of TLWF seeking a deeper walk with God. Most left questioning their Christianity altogether. That is not good fruit. I’m encouraged by the overwhelming response to Shalom’s letters by mostly her peers. It gives me hope for the future.