The practice of replacing a mature pastor with a new a##-kissing young adult probably originated more with Marilyn than JRS. The practice certainly continues on to this very day. Most of the old guard are gone now. Forced into retirement.

"The practice of replacing a mature pastor with a new a##-kissing young adult probably originated more with Marilyn than JRS. The practice certainly continues on to this very day. Most of the old guard are gone now. Forced into retirement."

GREAT POINT Paleface. I was thinking that the words about the second generation and the third generation and all that happened about the time that Marilyn was either openly in the picture or back stage somewhere. I believe you are right. I believe the influence on JRS was way back at the Unfolding, about the time Hargrave got way up in the chain of command, come to think of it. Marilyn, in my oppinion had lots of influence in the latter years. Just speculation in my part. I could be wrong, but I could be right.

JRS did say he had a dream whereby a younger man would take over the Walk and abuse the "sheep." I personally think that Marilyn has run the show for many years, since a good while before JRS died.

I would say this to those that are still in Living Word fellowship, to those that are under the totalitarian thumb of the leaders of fake Christianity, to throw off the yoke of bondage and give their hearts back to the Lord. They were after the Lord but they got fooled, but you don’t have to stay fooled. Like the song says, “why lay there forever in your abandon,” you don’t have to live like a refugee. You can be a human being with a right relationship with God, you don’t have to empower those that are using you, and you know they are using you. You know that Gary and Marilyn are rich on your sweat, they are taking what is yours and your children’s and they are living like king and queen. That is not serving God, that is serving the Antichrist.

As much as what happened in the "fellowship" was hard to take, I believe that the steps of a righteous man are ordered by the Lord. We may consider ourselves fools for associating with a group like that, and may regret the price paid both personal and otherwise, but I suspect that God's hand was in it more than we may ever know.

When I wrote that God would be brought up on charges it was my own sort of wry humor but recall that even Jesus characterized the Father as an unjust judge. And I have no doubt that he loves us beyond words having given His Son for us -- but the fact is that sometimes the hell we are put through has nothing whatsoever to do with us (as personal as it may seem). Just ask righteous Job who was stripped of everything because God was trying to make a point with Satan.

And so I think one has to forgive, perhaps themselves and in my case God, because until one gets past all that there us no way to see beyond the hurt and the sense of failure. Still, no matter what happened there was no failure any more than Job failed because he could not pray enough to save his family. Even Elijah thought himself a failure, but the story did not end there, and Elijah in the end triumphed and Job fortunes were restored double. Neither has the story ended for us, and who knows where life and divine providence will take us next.

There is by the way not a single verse I know of that could back the statement I made about forgiving God, but then a relationship with the Lord has never been about doctrines and the letter which Jesus violated on a regular basis. We forgive people because they hurt us, but even though they hurt us, they may in fact have done nothing wrong. From our perspective, yes, we got the raw deal, but perhaps there is another vantage point and another explanation. So I forgive God not because He did anything wrong but because it sure seemed that way to me, and had He asked me I could have gladly offered a few suggestions on a more palatable outcome!

Amos:

See [www.culteducation.com]

This page answers the basic questions about cults and how they operate. How to recognize a destructive cult or leader and how they typically manipulate people.

Each cult victim may think that their group or leader is unique, but they all share common characteristics and patterns of behavior.

Note the links within the page that provide additional information and research.

Some cult leaders use the bible, others a claimed therapy or political cause to deceive those they exploit and prey upon. They rely upon "brainwashing," which is a synthesis of coercive persuasion and influence techniques.

No one is immune and anyone can fall prey to such manipulation given the right set of circumstances. It can happen to Christians, Jews, Muslims, people from good families, bad families, the poor, rich, educated and uneducated.

I have done about 500 interventions to rescue people from cults. Five of those people I worked with were medical doctors. Two of those doctors were committed Christians that knew their bible.

Jesus said that many would come in his name, but he would not know them. They would be wolves in sheep clothing. Paul warned about abusive controlling leaders in Galatians.

This is not a new thing.

No one should blame themselves or blame God. Rather blame the cult leader who did the damage, often used deception and exploited them.

No need for victim bashing here.

rrmoderator Wrote:
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> No one should blame themselves or blame God.
> Rather blame the cult leader who did the damage,
> often used deception and exploited them.
> No need for victim bashing here.

I haven't spent any time, at least that I'm aware of, blaming God for what I've been through in TLWF. That line of thought has actually been a foreign concept. However, I have been disappointed in allowing my own vulnerabilities be exploited by cult leaders--and this forum has been extremely helpful in shutting this door--and restoring a health sense of personal identity. Thanks again, RR, for providing this vehicle.

I’ve been thinking about the word “selfish” and how it is used in the LW to manipulate people. If a person is not being submissive, a subtle way to make them feel guilty about it is to call them “selfish”. For example: “Your being selfish because you want to go to the movies instead of working at the church tonight.” It is a way to cut down a person who has a will or a desire to do anything outside of the cult activities. It is very subtle and quite powerful.

I’ve recently learned (from a professional in this field) that the state of being selfish is actually a spectrum with “total co-dependency” being on one side of the spectrum and being a “total self-centered person” on the other side of the spectrum, and “self-care” being near the center of the spectrum. Most healthy people live near this balanced center. There are some things that they do for others and they do things to give-back to humanity, but there are things that they do for themselves as well, to maintain a free healthy mental state. But the LW (and most other cults as well) want their congregants to live at the far end of the spectrum, where they are co-dependent and do nothing outside of what is expected of them in the cult. Their lives are not their own. They are taught to be a faithful bondservant. But this comes at a cost. It erodes an inner identity and ultimately can lead to an emotional and/or mental break-down. I’ve experienced this first hand. Even in the LW, it happens. It is subtle, but it is there. Ever been called “selfish” ?

Amos Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As much as what happened in the "fellowship" was
> hard to take, I believe that the steps of a
> righteous man are ordered by the Lord. We may
> consider ourselves fools for associating with a
> group like that, and may regret the price paid
> both personal and otherwise, but I suspect that
> God's hand was in it more than we may ever know.
>
>___________________________________________

God says he will turn what was meant for evil into good (Gen 50:20.) For myself I thought that meant that post LW, God would rock my world, you know float my boat. That didn't happen. What happened is I learned, possibly from God's perspective, one of the biggest lessons of my life that I won't be fooled again. I will never again fall prey to an abusive controlling leader.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/20/2015 01:38AM by lily rose.

I quit Living Word as soon as I saw Marilyn, as I said. I don’t know much about the Walk the sequel, only the original Walk, led by JRS. I am finding out though, that I don’t know much about the original Walk either, because there was so much difference between inner circle and the people in the area where I lived, it’s not even the same church, it was as different as Calvinists and Armenians.

There is an opportunity for them to repent if they will, and restore whatever they have devastated, if there is anyone that has lost their pension, they could restore it. If they want to remain ruthless, that is their choice, but there is a higher judge over them, they are not going to have any clout before the judgement seat of Christ because they were the senior pastor of Living Word and the Lamp of Israel, that will not impress the Lord any more than JRS being the Apostle to the Kingdom. All these titles that man puts on himself are just temporal. All of this money and property that man accumulates for himself means nothing to him or her when they give account to Jesus Christ. That is the message that was missing in Living Word, there is a judgement, and they are not the judge.

The idea that they would simply displace Christ and BECOME Christ in the earth is a self-delusion. I don’t know if there is any validity to the Latter Rain movement, or any of the offshoots of Latter Rain, that hold to all or some of the teachings but disclaim any involvement with it, but whether there was any validity to it or not, deception swept in Living Word Fellowship, it came in from somewhere.

Perhaps the Hargraves have attempted to steer away from some of the Latter Rain thing, they seem to have established a typical charismatic cult with the emphasis on themselves. Time is running out for them, the judgement is coming. I will pray for them.

Previously: “A relationship with the Lord has never been about doctrines and the letter which Jesus violated on a regular basis.”

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The best things are imbued Spirit to spirit unto each individual uniquely, “The Great Formless Silent Powerful Mystery (God)” makes alive the otherwise face of the deep for those concerned.

TLWF hardliners never understood that God was working directly with the underlings, circumventing the hierarchical loop. The Sadducees, Pharisees, Priests and Authorities made the same mistake with Jesus.

The Spirit blows free as the wind, neither a book of rules nor mainstream religious norms and expectations can subdue spiritual freedom. What an example Jesus has provided. Thank God.