Ghreldion:

How do you feel about a teacher having sex with his students?

Do you feel that this is appropriate?

Personally I am a very open-minded person.
Would I engage in a sexual activity to increase my spiritual self... yes, I think I would.
But it can also work against both party's if the student is not of a certain level.
What I mean by that is that if I was a teacher, and I would engage in a sexual activity with a student, I would make sure that the student could be trusted.
The student being around the teacher and following the system of teachings for 2 years before engaging in any sexual activity. If a student is around a teacher for that time, surely he knows that the teacher can be trusted in my opinion.

Not to promote anything, but the teachings given by HBI have changed me a lot in Balancing myself out between the Man & Female energy's.
I like woman more, but I could fall for a men also. It is just where their consciousness is at that I’m more looking at then the sexual nature of the person.

Is it appropriate? Well, that is a decision that everybody should make for themselves.
I can understand why people would say Yes, and other say No. Again, how open Minded is the person, and what background do they have? What concepts and idea’s have they taken upon themselves and are letting themselves be influenced by them in their judgement?

Ghreldion:

So you think that it is OK when Eric Pepin has sex with his students?

Are you expecting to have sex with Pepin?

I've had a few friends who were Higher Balance practitioners and they all seem to say that same thing: that it "works" and that they have "changed." I don't think they seemed to get it that all the rest of their friends were saying "yes you have changed...but not in a good way." I mean all cults change people, but it just seems that when people are in it they don't have anything else to go by - it's like they were such "bad" people before or just not "spiritual" enough and now they are...the sad thing is that when the old batch of people finally learn, the new batch of fresh eyed innocents comes along ready to buy into it again.

I don't think that many of these people would have defended a man who admitted to having sex with his students, but now because he "get's results" its okay or even good. Look, my accountant "gets results" but doesn't mean he gets to have sex with me. My doctor "get's results" but doesn't mean he gets to have sex with me."

It is sooo convenient to say that this man is activating spiritual energies in people by having sex with them - and even if this is true - why do these particular energies need to be activated anyway? Where do we draw the line?
I mean there are black magic guys out there who reckon that the life force from killing animals and people can power their magic. I'm not debating whether this is true or not - but why do I need it? I don't.

I don't like spirituality that sells that who I am now is not good enough, that I need to change, that I need "results." It buys into a fear based mentality that ends up having people being led around like the proverbial donkey chasing carrots.

People who follow this man need to ask themselves the honest truth: would you even think of questioning or disagreeing with him? If the answer is no then you need to ask yourself why.

I think you got to look at the motivation of both party's.

I think that you can have sex with anyone you want if that person agrees with it and if the law states that it is OK ( read Age ).
Now for the teacher - student scenario, I think you can apply the same rules. The motivation of course may differ.

Say that you want to increase your spirituality, and sexual activity is a way to achieve this, then there you have your motivation.
Now if you are open to this kind of experience, got the lawful age, and you and your teacher agree with each other, then why not?

For the moment I do not expect to have sex with Eric Pepin.

Ghreldion:

How could having sex with Eric Pepin "increase your spirituality"?

I hear your point Ghreldion, I just can't help thinking that a spiritual teacher such as this is in a position where the students are obviously looking up to him with no small amount of adoration. From this position it would not be so difficult to use this leverage to have sex with ones students for reasons other than "spiritual" ones.

So to look at the "motivations of both parties" as you said: In this case the party which is the student/s could well just be wanting to please or make their teacher happy - this could extend into believing everything that the teacher is saying such as(for example) "having sex with me will enhance your spiritual growth".

As for the motivation of the teacher well...this teacher could genuinely believe that they are helping their student's spiritual growth, or they could just want to have sex with the student and knowing that the student will pretty much buy anything the teacher says decides to play the spiritual card.

I guess it's just not my belief that you need to have sex with a person to help them get "enlightened." I've met a few self styled teachers around my country who are notorious for having sex with students in order to "raise their kundalini" or "shakti" for enlightenment. Neither the students or the teachers have seemed very enlightened to me. That's fine with me, I don't require them to be, but I find it dodgy that the reasons for sex are equated to spiritual awakening and so on.

Hello,

I think the general tone of this thread has leveled out a bit...that's great! It is nice to dialogue with rational minds.

In my opinion, the conversation is still pretty speculative though. As I'm still waiting for my CDs of the court recordings (though the check I sent the court has now cleared), I can't take on much of this speculation head on and back it up with any evidence other than the trust I've developed by listening to Eric's classes, practicing the meditation techniques, interacting with his staff, and interacting with other students. I am a very intelligent, intuitive, and compassionate person and not prone to joining cults. I have never been in one, am not in one now, and never expect to be in one.

I have been practicing these methods for just about a year now. I ordered my Foundation set and signed up for the Star Reach program basically at the same time last August and have been heavily immersed since then. I receive new classes every month and am on the phone with one of his top instructors every two weeks in order to optimize the results of my involvment. At the time that I began, I did my due diligence and "Googled" Eric and HBI. I came across his legal issues almost immediately. Because I had already begun working with his material and because the accusations did not automatically convict him in my opinion, I continued on and got to know Eric and his staff. The more I worked with them, the more the prosecution's accusations stunk. Not only have the techniques surpassed everything that I've worked with over the last fifteen years of these types of studies, but the whole group has been great.

At this point, I do not believe that Eric engaged in inappropriate sex with students. I believe most of this dialogue is based on two or three very biased articles and that the entire case was the result of false accusation motivated out of greed for money at the expense of Eric's hard work and reputation...and motivated by the animosity of a conservative worldview toward any spiritual practices that are alternative to mainstream Christianity. The county in which Eric and Jamison were charged is a notoriously conservative county and, as I understand it, the case wouldn't have been looked at twice in most of the neighboring counties.

[...]

Warmly . . . Heart

heart:

Please don't post promotional links here.

It is against the rules to preach or promote specific spiritual beliefs at this message board.

That section on your post has been deleted.

I'm amazed at some of the things written here. If this whole forum isn't biased I don't know what is. The very fact this place brands itself as a cult education forum makes it lean towards making whatever is posted here a cult by the mere fact it's being discussed here.

That people can also post here saying they know what was at the trial and then proceed to say whatever they want without question is also disturbing. Who is trying to control minds here?

What Heart was suggesting by saying johnblocksd is perpetuating slander is that what he is saying is not true. John said Pepin admitted to having sex with all seven of his male employee's.

That is not true. If you don't believe John it's because you don't believe everything just because some guy on a forum says it's so and in my book that makes you an intelligent, able-minded individual.

Eric Pepin testified he has had past relationships with 3 employee's. Count it, that's 3 out of 11. All of them prior to being employed, all of them monogamous. One of the people more than 10 years prior to being hired.

What is wrong with that? If he's willing to remain friends with an ex that long and wants to hire them, what business is it of yours or anyone else's?

The two male Higher Balance employee's who testified said they have never had any sexual contact with Eric Pepin, he's never suggested any such contact take place, and there's never been a problem with that.

You don't believe me? Good. Listen to the transcripts. It's there. Think for yourself. That's what Eric Pepin, this supposed cult master, says all the time in his courses. Question him, question everything.

You know what else is funny all these people who say they have listened to the court transcripts don't seem to want to talk about? The "Master" robe.

The accuser said he first met Eric in some robe with "Master" on it. It's been all over these news stories, if you want to call them that... yet when you listen to the trial guess what?

They had pictures of Eric getting the robe as a gift from an employee a year after this person met him. They even had a receipt. It was given by an employee who was a big student of martial arts and he testified he called all his teachers, "Master", and it was meant out of respect. He said Eric has never called himself that and has asked people not to call him that.

You know what the accuser said when he found out they had that evidence? He said the police got it wrong. That he never said he met him wearing that robe. He said instead it was a brown, fuzzy robe. Wow. How can you go from a black robe with "Master" written on it to something like that? He even testified when the news report came out he called the detective and told him he got it wrong.

The defense asked the detective that if they knew they got it wrong, and the accuser, Young, really did call them, why didn't they call the paper and retract the statement?

Because the whole "Master" robe meeting was all made up like the rest of this person's story. Made to seem dramatic.

For someone to say this case isn't about money is also amazing. Young asked Pepin for $500,000 to settle the case. Half a million bucks and this isn't about money? Come on.

If you also listen to the transcript, and not just say you have, you'll get to hear the initial set up call the police did between Young and Pepin.

Young, by the way, is a musical performer. He makes his living off acting in front of people and boy you can tell. As soon as Pepin answers Young turns on the water works and starts crying on the spot. If you have a bunch of police standing around you, how many people are going to be able to cry on cue like that?

In the recording, Young tells Pepin police came by the house asking about a story he told his mom about him and Pepin. He said he told them it wasn't true. Then Pepin says he wants the name of the detective so he can talk to him and that he's tired of helping Young and getting burned. This only confirms what Pepin is saying. If he were so worried about being guilty, why wouldn't he try and cover it up then and there? Why go out of the way and tell Young to give him the detectives information, heading straight to the police?

Because he had nothing to hide. Speaking of Young's mom, she testified that she considered the time he was working for Higher Balance as beneficial and noticed big improvements in her son. She also said he had a history of lying and she and other members of her family had banned him from their homes or helping him.

The last thing I find most amazing, that has also been left out from these people who have supposedly listened to the transcripts, is when Young first went to the police and filed a report it never mentioned anything about underage sex, at all. He didn't say a word about any of this alleged abuse that was said to have occurred.

Then he went and got a civil attorney. Suddenly, now that he has an attorney, the story changes and is all about abuse, and cults, and underage sex. How could the story change so much? Could it be that a civil attorney knows what it takes to win a civil case? Could it be that if Pepin were found guilty it would be an instant win for Young? Is it at all suspicious that the civil attorney he went to was a former District Attorney in the county where the charges were filed, someone who would still have connections and could pull favors? No, the US is much more fair and just then that right? Could never happen, except, oh the recent Duke case where the DA was found to be hiding evidence and making promises to get himself re-elected. But other than that, surely, there's a reasonable explanation.

Guess what the prosecution said about the sudden change in stories? The initial officer got it wrong. He misheard Young and wrote something completely different. The defense pointed out that this is a professional police officer. A person whose job it is to file accurate reports. To not miss any detail. Do you know what the officer who wrote the initial report said? He did his job. He got it right.

You don't like Eric Pepin, my guess is he's fine with that. Doesn't make it right to go around writing whatever you want and saying you've listened to the transcripts when you haven't. Have some common decency.