bacon; WOW! I mean, are you re-reading your posts before sending? Example:

bacon QUOTE"...The only credentials that the staff had that I worked with at New Era was that they genuinely cared a lot. I believe most of the staff is unpaid and are willing to do their best for everyone. Generally speaking, good-hearted volunteers can be trusted..."

I care a lot about many things. How does that make me qualified to advise people? I'm willing to do 'my best' but how on Earth does that make me qualified to do anything? I'm 'good-hearted' but if my 'good-heartedness' has been coached by an obvious cult, doesn't that negate my 'good-heartedness' since I'd be approaching from a cultic-get-the-money attitude which I would believe in my heart was in the best for the victims?

Also from bacon QUOTE:"...The reason I compare it to mental health professionals is that both attempt to achieve the same goals on people without too many "real" problems. One treats with drugs, the other treats with a social network. The only difference is what happens when they "mess up". A psychiatrist can lose millions of dollars and the license to continue profiting off of bored Americans and their petty problems, while New Era will probably just have to give that person a monetary refund. However, this makes sense as psychiatrists are far more popular and have a higher chance to make false diagnoses and are prone to wrongful treatments, so of course they need to be held more accountable..."

This is so patently offensive to me I cannot believe you sent this to this forum. I have several friends who are Psychiatrists. Besides Scientologists and yourself I have never heard such attacks on a FIELD OF SCIENCE (capitals intentional) as this. To compare 8 years in medical school with a 3-5 year intern program with attending a couple little mind fucking seminars and being REALLY REALLY 'GOOD-HEARTED' and wanting to do 'MY BEST' as being EQUAL is, in my mind, crazy.

PETTY problems? Are you serious? Depression is one of the most under diagnosed and underlying problems within society.

It is nice to see an apologist and a troll such as yourself having all the answers to life and the universe! How wonderful it must be to be you! (sarcasm/off)

Also if you believe that what you wrote is true QUOTE:"...while New Era will probably just have to give that person a monetary refund..." if the person is not satisfied.

Rrrrrright. You are a true apologist.

New Era seems to have such apparent ties to Lifespring et al it is unbelievable. Years ago as a sales rep at a sales convention, Lifespring (attending the same Hilton) tried to rope me in with their clean-cut pretty 'salespeople'. When I told them 'yes, I've heard you are a cult' the pretty salespeople ran like the cockroaches they were, looking to grab other young business people who were not 'Ross-Armored' attending other seminars at the hotel.

I walked away chuckling at them. Thank you, Rick! That LGAT awareness was due to you and this site.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/26/2009 09:12AM by Sparky.

I'm not an apologist, just telling you what I've seen, which cannot possibly be the whole picture. Shouldn't you guys be warning me to not finish the rest of the program or something instead of calling me names? Seriously, what kind of education forum is this. (J/K no more flames plz)

Sparky, there are several things you have to realize about my viewpoint:
1. I didn't go through all three stages. I only went to the first, which I hear is much less "intense" and "challenging".
2. I'm sorry if my opinions on the soft sciences offend you, but this isn't an academic forum so I didn't care too much. I will however try not to belittle depression and the "rigor" of psychology as a science in a public setting. I don't usually rudely deny God's existence to my Christian friends, so I am sorry for being out of line.
3. Can I point out again that I actually got my money back because I didn't find value in the program? No hassle. Well a little hassle. I had to send them a fax the next day and it involved me running to Kinko's.


1. The people running the program are great at their business. They are making millions every year. In short, they aren't stupid, and if something has been shown to be psychologically damaging in the past, they probably tweak it so that they don't have to settle the same damned lawsuits.
2. Do I believe it's run on greed? Yeah, the numbers don't lie. Does this make it less effective? Not really, IN MY EXPERIENCE (which was only 1/3 of the program). If people are happy, why rain on their parade? (This might be true if the other 2/3 is dangerous. I admit that I don't know EVERYTHING about the universe.)
3. Friends > psychiatrists. If you don't agree with that, your friends might suck. Or they might be psychiatrists! lol (What I'm trying to say is that at New Era you pay loads of money for people who REALLY REALLY want to be your friend. And they do, they're not even getting paid. It's kind of disconcerting in the beginning, because they're being overly nice and in your business, but if you don't reject them they can help you with your "problems", like any good friend would.)

moderator:
I read the detailed report of the first stage of lifespring, and it largely corroborated with my own experience there. (Except no child rape victims outlandishly confessing their own responsibility... wtf) Do any exist for the second or third stages?

bacon, I respect your opinions, but I do believe that your referring to Psychiatrists as a "soft science" to need a little deeper explaination. I know that the "Last Frontier" of understanding the mind is in its infancy, but the term 'soft science' makes it sound like you are dismissing an entire branch of medical science (whose papers and studies are peer reviewed, btw). The CoS (Church of Scientology) teaches that shrinks are 'evil'. L. Ron Hubbard apparently was plagued by these doctors since he was, well, NUTS. I think that M.D.'s with Phd's doing research scinece are not 'soft science' as much as a newer field of science just taking to flight.

bumped for jfizzle there are some prime examples of the non thinkers that lgats turn out in this thread as well as some staunch warnings about this and all LGATS

Hello,

I want to bump this thread. It does not look like people have discussed New Era Trainings from Concord California in a few years. Is there anyone else out there with anything to share?

I am trying to make sense of my own experience.

-wamback

Looke at this posting from 1993 posted under the Rick Ross Lifespring archive. A detailed account of the first 5-day training session for an unnamed LGAT. This sounds just like New Era. Are all LGATs made from the same cookie cutter and 20 years later still the same? I wish I read this before.

[www.culteducation.com]

wamback

Other threads about New Era Tranings are in the culteducation.com forum. This one entitled "Concord California LGAT" looks very informative.

[forum.culteducation.com]

Here are a few good points, it rings true. I wish I had read it all.


"I hope your friend is'nt in the LP (ACT) program. If so he is in deep. Hell be taken away from his job with phone calls all day long from either his buddy or his group or his "senior" its impossible to get work done when they wont leave you alone. The phonecalls wont stop at normal hours they continue on all hours becasue you need to be able to stand for your group always!"


"A lot of Thought Reform methods goes on in the first two the "trainers" play good cop bad cop. The last part is more rigorous Thought Reform + Group Think...if you snap out of it all you gonna be dealing with some cognitive dissonance to get your mind back. Critical thinking is unacceptable. Grey ares of life are overlooked, everything is simplified to "BLACK" or "RED". They sell you the idea that justifications are made by the self righteous, but they make justifications for those who leave saying the person was not willing to own up to their experience, or they didn't "Show up" to begin with etc...when you see a different "possibility" it suggested away as "selling your self short" or "not setting yourself up to win". GRHHHHHHHH!!! Save your time and money (spend it well), see a licensed therapist, get frank and honest feedback from trusted friends, love ones, coworkers, bosses etc...if you feel you need to look at your unconscious behavior!!!"


"I will say that although I felt, and do feel that are benefits to some if the curriculum, I don't advocate it to anyone. It was obvious after the 1st weekend of "ACT" that main objective is to recruit more people, for the program. This in my mind negates all of the benefits. They will admonish you as being week and self serving if you protest the recruitment portion, which is involved in all phases of the training, but very important in the last piece, They premise the recruitment part as "giving back" but it is clearly promotional and serving the interests of the owners. Incidentally a major requirement for successfully completing the program is recruiting a minimum number of new people ( you will excluded from attending the final weekend retreat which is part the cost of the program and is not refundable).

Somethings that really went against my grain were...
1. They expect you to put the program first and foremost over even your family, I personally went hoping to be a better Husband and Parent. Putting anything before that is contrary to my objective.
2. They are an elitist group, telling us to forget trying to enlist anybody that doesn't have 2 nickels to rub together. They are clearly looking to recruit folks in the higher middle to upper economic demographic.
3. The female Instructor "Lynne" was extremely verbally abusive to individuals in her efforts to silence any decent, or questioning minds. (You are basically directed to give up higher thought and embrace the group directives).
4. I believe that this program could be risky for people already dealing with deep psychological problems, they say that the screening process minimizes this risk, they have a few questions relating to your mental health, but this screening assumes everyone is honest or aware of their current mental state. There is no screening performed by any mental health or medical professionals, the questionnaire is really just for their protection from liability if there is a problem."


"Also interesting... they claimed to be a struggling startup and they themselves (Jim, Lynn and her boyfriend) are making huge personal sacrifices to bring this to the people, and that we could make it possible for others to receive their great gift to the world via enrolling as they called it.

A quick internet search, and I see they are actually part of "Life Spring" which boasts of 40 centers, "New Era" in Concord included."


"Its been 3 years since they infected my life and I escaped not so unharmed. I lost friends, some because I stopped going to endless trainings meetings, weekends, and never ending phone calls, and started thinking for my self again, and others because I hounded them to no end til they enrolled themselves or cut me out of their life for some peace. I lost my self own respect for some time."

wamback

yes, and its good.