Has anyone unwittingly been "the other woman" with a Sterling man? I have read through many of the threads here, and find it all intriguing, but I was very much in love with someone who claimed to be single, even does professional trainings about living an "intentional and mindful life"... I just discovered his lies. I had suspected he was a coward when he abruptly dumped me at a very hard time in my life, but I had no idea it was anything like this.

Not only did I find out that he has been married all this time (despite telling me time after time things about his "divorce"), but I discovered that the "men's group" he belonged to is none other than Sterling!! Now it puts his busy schedule into a whole new perspective, too. I could never understand why he was on the phone all the time, driving all over town--I thought it was for his business and civic involvement.

I am still so shaken up at my discovery. Has anyone else been through this? I just think of the cigars in the front seat of his car, and keep imagining him high-fiving his buddies around the campfire, sharing stories of his conquest. Oh--I just feel so bad for his wife and kids, too. The details just make it worse, but worst of all is his obvious contempt for all women, his intentional cruelty, even though he claims something so different outwardly.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

Naivenomore,

As a former Sterling man who does not like much about Justin and his organization, and is not a brainwashed idiot, I have to say that I think it is highly unlikely that his behavior has anything to do with the fact that he was/is involved with Sterling. In my time there I never once encountered men engaging in infidelity, or for that matter, condoning it. I believe that is/was the man, not Sterling. I cannot say this with certainty as I do not know this man, but the men I knew would not have tolerated behavior like that in their circle. Being a good husband and father was encouraged. It is a screwed up place, and a cult, but I do not think it is the cause of this. This man has issues.

I am sorry you had to go through this. Some men suck. You were right to say he is a coward - that's putting it mildly. Thanks for the post.

Dave

Dave,

Thanks for answering. It's nice to hear from someone who was directly involved in the organization. I guess my thinking was based on what I read about the "short-term recreational" relationships that are apparently encouraged, as well as what I read about some of the bragging about sexual exploits. Is that part of the weekend, or did I misunderstand?

Either way, the whole idea of defining a STR as using women sexually before a long-term relationship is just horrible. It doesn't seem that Sterling encourages men to have any sort of real friendship with a woman at any time! Also, I always wonder if they would actually marry any of the women who had been determined "STR-usable." Are any of the STR women ever in the FOW??

Either way, I think any organization that condones that kind of treatment of women almost sets the stage for infidelity later. The man (and I use that term loosely) I was seeing had some desires that he seemed to feel were "bad", and it seemed to be refreshing to him to be in what he called a "safe environment" to explore emotions and sexuality. I thought it was a remarkably freeing relationship in many ways, but not unusual other than that I loved him -- the man I thought he was. Once, though, he made a comment about things he would never have done when he was married, because "he couldn't do them with his wife". It seemed such a twisted idea of intimacy to me, but I assumed it was something he had worked out through his "divorce".

In fact, I am certain that the lack of intimacy is still is a problem in his marriage in many ways. I know he is still out looking, but apparently he has made it much more clear that he wants sex only. It seems some attempt to get all his needs met away from his wife. I broke it all off when he disappeared--I just didn't like being put on hold when I needed him (I now think that was part of the stuff I read about STRs: to run at the first sign of trouble). When I did that, it was even before I knew he was still married.

Yes, I do believe that he has problems beyond Sterling. I guess that he was attracted to Sterling because he is trying to feel more grounded in his life, but they also seem to encourage a lot of self-hatred in a guy who has always spent much more time with women, and used to enjoy them. It's such a shame that this is a guy who really was quite wonderful in many ways, but seems so confused.

I cannot imagine how his family copes with the whole situation.

Thank you so much for the clarification!

the amount of negative reports that keep coming out around the Sterling Men's Weekend is really unbelievable, its right up there with Landmark.

Hi Naivenomore,

A lot of your concerns/ questions are the same as those I came out with in the end of my relationship with a Sterling man. I'm pretty sure that I know how you feel. That kind of manipulation is a pretty mind-boggling thing to have been through.

I know that Dave Vanian is trying to create a balanced perspective, and I appreciate any information that comes to the table, but I still think there is overwhelming evidence to indicate that the Sterling ideology does actively, if not enthusiastically, promote misogyny.

I think the overriding tenants of Justin Sterling are best summed up in "Does Sterling Institute Men's Weekend Promote Hostility Towards Women?" (called something like that), posted by a MAN in the Sterling Institute section of this website. The writer does not appear to have an ax to grind, but to be simply recounting what he witnessed and heard at a Men's Weekend. There are many similar writings out there, but his post seems to bring it all together. Also, his account of what Justin told the group is a near exact paraphrase of all the gender-role nonsense that my ex-was trying to convince me of. He even said as he was trying to explain Sterling to me: "There are only two kinds of women. The ones you marry. And the strippers you take to Las Vegas for a weekend." Needless to say, that was very hurtful and confusing -- he didn't clarify which of the types he saw me as; and I still don't know 'cause I broke up with him soon after that (with that statement still burning my ears).

Sure, there are lots of "rotten apples" in this world, but Sterling seems to do more to encourage bad behavior than to actually promote healthy trusting relationships between the sexes. If anything, the rotten apples seem to be the men that Sterling seeks out as they are the ones who are most eager to jump on the women-hating bandwagon in order to lay blame elsewhere for their own personal shortcomings. It seems as though only the intelligent, decent, and sincere men are the ones able to see through the Sterling sham for what it is: pure social poison.

So, I don't know, Dave (since I'm sure you're reading this too), maybe your experience with Sterling was something slightly more benign, but I don't see much value in defending the organization when clearly, there is much evidence to suggest that Sterling Men are shameless women-haters. The women who have written about being involved with Sterling Men seem to have all had negative experiences that can be traced back to the mouth of Justin Sterling directly.

(Sorry I didn't respond to your last post to me, Dave. No, I haven't seen that guy since I dumped him, and I haven't run into that couple since after I found out that the husband had gone to a weekend, so I just didn't feel like I had much to respond to you with...)

Oh, and in regards to infidelity? According to the words of my ex-Sterling Man, having mistresses in addition to a wife at home is the way things are historically/naturally supposed to be. "Boys will be boys" is basically how it was explained to me.

I also have a copy of a recruitment letter for a Mens Weekend that he allegedly wrote himself (although I get the impression that it is mainly boilerplate text) with the basic sales pitch: "And you too can have your own harem of beautiful, exciting women with no problems in the relationships whatsoever!" I mean, if people consent to having an open relationship, that's their choice, but multiple partnership (for Sterling Men) is a reoccurring theme in my direct experiences with, and in what I have read about/ by, the organization. (It would be interesting to know if women from the FOW have the same freedoms.)

Dear Nancy,

Thanks so much for your replies. "Harem of beautiful, exciting women," huh? Well, I do realize now that I was the "Las Vegas" woman of the moment, and had pretty much figured it out as soon as I found out he was married--I think that's what hurt so much. For the sake of privacy, I can't post details about the specific timing of his last "disappearance," and how I found out about his wife or his involvement with Sterling. He lured me under the guise of a common desire to improve living conditions for a vulnerable population, but his actions were so harmful to me, my family, his own family! In fact, it was a perverse use of the "good person" persona for his own selfish interests. Con man.

I do highly doubt that the Sterling relationship is an open one on both sides. In the case of the guy I was seeing, he clearly was not seeking women who knew he was married, and he expressed extreme anger at the notion of his "ex" wife's infidelity. I have no idea if his wife knew what was going on, if she really had ever been unfaithful, or if she was involved with Sterling. I would guess that the men's stuff on the side is to prevent them from forming a "need" for sex from the women they are married to, thus keeping them detached and more in control. Keeping the little lady in her place, in other words. This is what Sterling seems to push on its women, as well.

I did once, coincidentally, attend an "open" FOW meeting during rush... I mean, "recruitment week". I never realized it was the same group until WAY later (after I stopped seeing the guy). I thought they seemed like nice enough women, but kind of weirdly connected to their group, and with some really strange expectations about being feminine all the time. And the time commitment!! I couldn't do it, never thought about it or the "$$weekend$$", but wow, what a small world.

Thanks for your insights!! AND GOOD LUCK!!

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naivenomore
Has anyone unwittingly been "the other woman" with a Sterling man? I have read through many of the threads here, and find it all intriguing, but I was very much in love with someone who claimed to be single, even does professional trainings about living an "intentional and mindful life"... I just discovered his lies. I had suspected he was a coward when he abruptly dumped me at a very hard time in my life, but I had no idea it was anything like this.

Not only did I find out that he has been married all this time (despite telling me time after time things about his "divorce"), but I discovered that the "men's group" he belonged to is none other than Sterling!! Now it puts his busy schedule into a whole new perspective, too. I could never understand why he was on the phone all the time, driving all over town--I thought it was for his business and civic involvement.

I am still so shaken up at my discovery. Has anyone else been through this? I just think of the cigars in the front seat of his car, and keep imagining him high-fiving his buddies around the campfire, sharing stories of his conquest. Oh--I just feel so bad for his wife and kids, too. The details just make it worse, but worst of all is his obvious contempt for all women, his intentional cruelty, even though he claims something so different outwardly.

Has anyone else been in a similar situation?

Every man I know who is involved in Sterling has or has had a mistress, or at the very least wouldn't object to having one. This doesn't surprise me at all. Men in Sterling are encouraged, in fact, to give in to their natural urges, are told that that's what makes them real men! It makes me want to vomit.

I am so sorry for what you've been through. I pray every day that my ex-friends who are involved in Sterling's misogynist BS up to their eyeballs will wake up, come to their senses, and we can all be friends again. I pray that they'll stop abusing Native American spirituality and using their position as lodge leaders in the local NA community as recruitment tools for Justin and his filthy little band of misogynists pigs. The organization is sick, and I find that even the so-called "educated" people who are involved have had significant vulnerabiltiies and weak-mindedness that led them into Justin's insane little flock.

I pray for them every day.

I will pray for your healing, as well. I'm sorry your life has been touched by these bastards.

Very interesting about the Native American connection. The guy I was dating made some references to that as well, but it was more along the lines of doing charitable work for native communities than actively recruiting from them. However, it doesn't surprise me that these guys are trained to sniff out vulnerable people to exercise their control over, whoever and wherever they may be. I know a lot of Sterling's raison d'etre has to do with making money, of course, but then there's this whole dimension of wanting to exercise power purely for the sake of exercising power. I guess, like you said, that's how the "so-called educated people" get caught up; their "weak-mindedness" is obviously driving their irrational desire to feel powerful over others.

I've been seeing more things out in the public to do with Sterling. Some guy posted a blog about an upcoming Sterling Men's weekend for graduates in Monrovia, CA. And then a woman has created a Myspace page for the Family of Women. It would seem to me that these select people don't quite get the element of secrecy that is part of the "organization." Like the people who post videos on U-Tube about their "liberating" Landmark experiences, these amateur online champions of Sterling seem to be a little on the naive side, maybe not the "sharpest tacks"... They are obviously trying to do good, but are clearly misguided and don't really understand what they're doing.

Hello Naivenomore,

I was never the “other woman” of a Sterling guy (I refuse to call them men), but wound up, unwittingly, in a “short-term recreational" relationship (definition below) with a Sterling Institute of Relationship (SIR) guy. If anyone reading this is considering getting involved with an SIR guy, a Mens’ Division guy or any other such SIR affiliate, please read and then run in the opposite direction, and don’t look back.

When I began dating this guy, he told me a bit about this men’s group he was active in, and in which he held a leadership position so I went up to the official SIR web site, read about its mission, and thought it was a good thing; it worked with my somewhat traditional (though not medieval) view of men and relationships. After he unceremoniously dumped me, a friend advised me to Google SIR so I would know what kind of guy I’d been involved with, and what his so-called “men’s organization” was REALLY about. (That’s how I found Rick Ross.) I only wish I had done this earlier. I could’ve saved myself a lot of pain and self doubts. There were warning signs which I patently ignored.

First off, he was a first-rate liar. On our 2nd date, he told me his marriage failed because his wife never allowed him to have sex with her; they never consummated their marriage because she’d been traumatized by rape. He didn’t realize the extent of her problem until they married. (He wanted to wait until marriage before they had sex. Sounds charming, but? ) As a result, he said he didn’t have kids. The next day I Googled him and found his family tree online. There I learned he did have a child with her, a son. So he lied on both counts. But because I was drawn to him, I figured the dissolution of his marriage and estrangement from his son must have been terribly painful, and he hadn’t felt like discussing the facts until we knew each other better. My thought was to wait and eventually he’d feel close enough to confide in me, which of course never happened. I never brought it up.

There were other signs. He always talked about men growing up “feminized” (He grew up with 3 brothers, no sisters, yet he was sure –paranoid – that his manhood had been compromised), how women were “devious”, how men were just lovable “jerks”, prone to bad behavior, complained about taxes like some old cranky man (think Grandpa character on the Simpson’s “Back in my day, we didn’t have ______, and we LIKED it!") Yea, I hung out with a guy like that. Ew!

During the six months we were involved, when we did get together, I admit he could be affectionate, smart, an interesting conversationalist, and the sex was great. But he kept me at arm’s distance, after a couple months he began going home in the middle of the night, never allowed me inside his home, never invited me out with his friends (I suppose they all knew I was just a STR girlfriend), never introduced me to his family, etc. Several times I asked him if he was really interested in me, or if he wanted a meaningful relationship with me. He always answered yes, but looking back, I have to admit, his reply lacked conviction. Actions speak louder than words. After discovering (too late) the level of his dishonesty (no intention of developing a committed, caring relationship in the first place) it all made sense. And it was hurtful. I felt used by a guy who touted all this "honorable man" stuff. What a load.

But remember, unbeknownst to me, he was simply practicing one of the Sterling boys’ most offensive, but time-honored nasty tradition of using women in what they call a short term recreational way. (Would be nice if the Sterling boys were honest about that upfront. There might be gals who don’t want a commitment, just recreational sex a la Samantha of Sex in the City. More power to those who are can be like that. Then they could leave the rest of us who yearn for something more alone to pursue that.

Below is a description, straight from the Sterling Institute/Mens’ Division rule book - this is what the Sterling leaders present and advocate in their weekend initiation:
Short Term Recreational (STR)
• Defined as basically--for sex only, without involvement. You should get out of a STR relationship at the first sign of trouble, but with the following exceptions--
1. "If she gives good head"
2. "If she swallows"
3. "If she takes it up the ass".

It’s amazing that our relationship lasted as long as it did. Apparently I was just “practice” until someone better came along, which didn’t take too long. I believe he’s now in what the Sterling boys call a Long Term Committed relationship cuz I know the new gal is allowed inside his home. But I bet she’s not allowed to feminize, i.e. touch anything. ;-)

Long Term Committed (LTC)
• You should never get involved in a LTC relationship until you are totally self-sufficient which means you can go without pussy. You should never get involved in a LTC relationship until you have succeeded in STR relationships. (Meaning until you’ve used and dumped a few unaware women. – my addition – WISERNOW)

When we broke up - over the phone - he coldly said he wouldn’t give me any of his time. Yea, I was such a time suck; I made a point of rarely calling him, giving him plenty of time and space. I was sensitive to the fact that he had a business to run and other obligations. I’m not one to insinuate myself into someone’s life without an invitation. We didn’t get together more than once a week. His tone was dismissive and mean which was unnecessary. I understood it was over without him having to talk to me in such a harsh way. We haven’t spoken since although I have the misfortune of catching glimpses of him (rarely) since we live in the same neighborhood. Nothing like having to physically face your mistakes occasionally. But he's become easy to ignore.

I take responsibility for not ending things when there were so many indications that this relationship was extremely sick. My only excuse it that I was in a vulnerable state when we met and thus allowed this self-centered, negative person into my life. What bothers me the most is that I was kind, thoughtful and generous with him. I never got pushy and stupidly let things “take their time”. In the end he threw me away like yesterday’s newspaper. Maybe he was feeling some trouble brewing (like I might voice my need for a loving relationship) and needed to bail. This was afterall a Short-Term Recreational fling, and he had to uphold the definition, without my consent or knowledge. (It certainly isn't recreational for the women.)

Happy ending: Soon after, despite misgivings about getting involved with anyone ever again, I met a *wonderful* MAN!! He’s never needed to spend hundreds of dollars on a weekend “seminar” or countless hours in mandatory meetings w/ moronic, immature, women-hating guys in an effort to learn to be a man - he just is one. He’s masculine, funny, generous, caring, smart, athletic, successful, handsome and wild about me. We’ve been together for over a year. Maybe I needed to experience a horrible relationship to truly appreciate a great one.

But remember, friends don’t let friends get involved with SIR guys. Please spread the word to women you know. Guys associated with The Sterling Institute and its Mens Division are, for the most part, dishonest and self-centered with no qualms about hurting and using women as “short term recreational girlfriends”; not the kind of person a gal would want to let into her life. I don’t know how any sane, self-respecting woman would knowingly want to be intimate with a guy who she knows accepts and advocates using and tossing women (sisters) aside as if they had no feelings or value.