Re: Mankind Project - Garbage In Garbage Out
Posted by:
wanderingbutnotlost
()
Date: October 29, 2007 09:44AM
First, this is NOT research. I work in a research lab, and not the pseudo-science kind, I actually made it thru graduate school in a ligitimate field of science.
This board is a promotion for the rick ross institute. It allows people like you to follow the herd and deem everything a "cult". The more groups they label "cults" the broader the market for this pseudo-science clinic.
The reason there is a supposed market for this website and the information it provides is that most LGATs were not honest enough with potential enrollees and did not warn them the severity of activities involved in one of those infamous seminar weekends. You imply that Rick Ross Institute makes a profit from the people who post on this forum. I don't pay him, I know that much. But you sure as heck aren't going to get to do ANYTHING for free when it comes to Landmark, Impact, Sterling, or any of those garbage organizations that mess up lives and ruin families and friendships and destroy spiritual communities.
This website provides information that most LGATs are afraid to give potential enrollees. If LGAT members were allowed to tell potential enrollees what their "weekend seminar" actually entailed, NOBODY WOULD FRICKIN' GO! The people on here who defend the LGAT... sure you got great things from it, and you continue to commit yourself and blah blah snooze snooze... but the bottom line is, if you knew ahead of time you would be spending $600 (or whatever the LGAT-du-jour is charging) to be broken down, sleep- and bathroom-deprived, and emotionally abused, you would not have gone. And some part of you knows that.
I am SO glad this website is here. Market? Please, the only ones charging for this service is your friendly neighborhood LGAT group.
Have a pleasant life. Most brainwashed people do... till they wake up.
This board is a promotion for the rick ross institute. It allows people like you to follow the herd and deem everything a "cult". The more groups they label "cults" the broader the market for this pseudo-science clinic.
The reason there is a supposed market for this website and the information it provides is that most LGATs were not honest enough with potential enrollees and did not warn them the severity of activities involved in one of those infamous seminar weekends. You imply that Rick Ross Institute makes a profit from the people who post on this forum. I don't pay him, I know that much. But you sure as heck aren't going to get to do ANYTHING for free when it comes to Landmark, Impact, Sterling, or any of those garbage organizations that mess up lives and ruin families and friendships and destroy spiritual communities.
This website provides information that most LGATs are afraid to give potential enrollees. If LGAT members were allowed to tell potential enrollees what their "weekend seminar" actually entailed, NOBODY WOULD FRICKIN' GO! The people on here who defend the LGAT... sure you got great things from it, and you continue to commit yourself and blah blah snooze snooze... but the bottom line is, if you knew ahead of time you would be spending $600 (or whatever the LGAT-du-jour is charging) to be broken down, sleep- and bathroom-deprived, and emotionally abused, you would not have gone. And some part of you knows that.
I am SO glad this website is here. Market? Please, the only ones charging for this service is your friendly neighborhood LGAT group.
Have a pleasant life. Most brainwashed people do... till they wake up.
No one visits RickRoss.com due to false advertising
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 29, 2007 11:22PM
And, no one visits RickRoss.com due to false advertising.
RR.com is up front about what it is.
Two, RR.com never tries to spook dissidents by using intimidating litigation.
(Ahem! Ahem!)
The only disciplinary action taken by RRcom is the same as what other message boards employ: users are banned from the board for violating the rules that they've agreed to when registering to become members.
(Just for some perspective: some owners of controversial blogs have chosen to disable the comments sections on their blogs precisely because they have the time or energy to cope with filtering out rants raves and vitriol from those who dislike the content of their blogs. By allowing us a forum for free (but reasonably courteous) exchange of opinions, Mr Ross and the moderators put in hours per day to ensure that the space remains a productive venue for discussions. They provide these services at no charge to us.)
People come here and then remain here because they choose to do so.
(Unless, perhaps they are told to come here and stir the pot by whatever odd
organization they are in that dislikes what RR.com provides--ahem)
No one gets spammed by RR.com. You dont click on an innocent link and suddenly get a pop up window that fills your computer screen with RR.com when you dont want it to be there.
Now what can happen is that someone may visit RR.com, assuming that the stuff on this site is nonsense and find their anxieties aroused beyond ability to cope with it.
These emotions may feel overwhelming, unmangeable, and that is hard, because it happens when the user is alone at his or her computer, without social support on hand. A person who finds they cannot ignore what is here may feel frightened, angry, and choose to blame RR.com, rather than consider that something might be wrong with the the leader, church or group that is being discussed.
Finally, RR.com does not keep you up past your bedtime. (unless the content is utterly fascinating, or arouses anxiety beyond one's coping capacities. Yet one can still choose to log off at any time. RR.com will not pursue you with unwanted phone calls, demanding to know why you've not logged on in teh past 24 hours)
The only requirement is to honor the rules of the board, have a basic respect for what other people have been through. Its fine to disagree, but essentially the crucial thing is to remember that RR.com is a place to bear witness, not a place to go for mere amusement or to poke and tease.
The worst thing about the groups we discuss is that they deny the inherant dignity of the ordinary, unenlightened, untransformed human person and reduce all us to objects that require salvation or reprogramming.
And on RR.com, my guess is most of us are hear because we have decided there is more to life than being used as objects.
We are glad to provide help and pointers for research to sincere and interested students, but cannot do people's homework for them.
Finally, registration is free.
RR.com is up front about what it is.
Two, RR.com never tries to spook dissidents by using intimidating litigation.
(Ahem! Ahem!)
The only disciplinary action taken by RRcom is the same as what other message boards employ: users are banned from the board for violating the rules that they've agreed to when registering to become members.
(Just for some perspective: some owners of controversial blogs have chosen to disable the comments sections on their blogs precisely because they have the time or energy to cope with filtering out rants raves and vitriol from those who dislike the content of their blogs. By allowing us a forum for free (but reasonably courteous) exchange of opinions, Mr Ross and the moderators put in hours per day to ensure that the space remains a productive venue for discussions. They provide these services at no charge to us.)
People come here and then remain here because they choose to do so.
(Unless, perhaps they are told to come here and stir the pot by whatever odd
organization they are in that dislikes what RR.com provides--ahem)
No one gets spammed by RR.com. You dont click on an innocent link and suddenly get a pop up window that fills your computer screen with RR.com when you dont want it to be there.
Now what can happen is that someone may visit RR.com, assuming that the stuff on this site is nonsense and find their anxieties aroused beyond ability to cope with it.
These emotions may feel overwhelming, unmangeable, and that is hard, because it happens when the user is alone at his or her computer, without social support on hand. A person who finds they cannot ignore what is here may feel frightened, angry, and choose to blame RR.com, rather than consider that something might be wrong with the the leader, church or group that is being discussed.
Finally, RR.com does not keep you up past your bedtime. (unless the content is utterly fascinating, or arouses anxiety beyond one's coping capacities. Yet one can still choose to log off at any time. RR.com will not pursue you with unwanted phone calls, demanding to know why you've not logged on in teh past 24 hours)
The only requirement is to honor the rules of the board, have a basic respect for what other people have been through. Its fine to disagree, but essentially the crucial thing is to remember that RR.com is a place to bear witness, not a place to go for mere amusement or to poke and tease.
The worst thing about the groups we discuss is that they deny the inherant dignity of the ordinary, unenlightened, untransformed human person and reduce all us to objects that require salvation or reprogramming.
And on RR.com, my guess is most of us are hear because we have decided there is more to life than being used as objects.
We are glad to provide help and pointers for research to sincere and interested students, but cannot do people's homework for them.
Finally, registration is free.
Re: No one visits RickRoss.com due to false advertising
Posted by:
ON2 LF
()
Date: October 30, 2007 05:07AM
Great points corboy! Hopefully the dedicated designated lekkies watching this board will give serious consideration to the points you've made regarding involvement with a group that is voluntary, uncoerced and is legitimately supportive of its members.
What would be even better is if the personal freedom associated with membership in a place like this one would draw them even closer...
The 'free registration' part should get their attention as well, considering that their other membership(s) are likely costing them their all.
What would be even better is if the personal freedom associated with membership in a place like this one would draw them even closer...
The 'free registration' part should get their attention as well, considering that their other membership(s) are likely costing them their all.
Here's a pitfall
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 30, 2007 09:37AM
(I am just making this up, allowing my imagination to roam and go free-range)
Imagine some group that dislikes RR.com. A really great way for this hypothetical entity to install a no-exit state of mind would be to train its members to go to RR.com and be disruptive.
That way, if they get dumped on and then get banned, this would subconsciously leave them believing that RR.com is an unwelcoming and abusive place...which would distract from them recognizing that it is the LGAT they are in that told them to go to RR.com and troll, that is actually the abusive place.
A really sad part of this hypothetical scenario might be someone who is told by Group X to oroslytize/troll on RR.com, gets banned for trolling, then eventually leaves Group X, either because of misgivings or because their health breaks down after months or years of overwork.
Having left abusive Group X, the refugee might feel afraid to go to RR.com and read up on Group X after they've left because the trolling they did when under the influence of Group X might have implanted the belief that RR.com is abusive and that after being banned they can never return, even after having left thier group.
I have no way of knowing if this has ever happened, but it is a possible scenario we should keep in mind.
Recovery is a complex process. It is possible to physically leave or get kicked out of a group, yet emotionally fight the ghastly impact of facing one's trust has been betrayed and that one has been used as an object and even been led to engage in behavior one now regrets.
And many of these entities leave people with a complex mix of happy memories along with a payload of shame, one can have experienced benefits in some areass of one's life, while having been grievously harmed elsewhere. Its these mixed legacy groups that are hardest to face--often because one wavers between lucidity and then waves of confusion.
Its hard to tell when someone is going through this, and someone who is coldly trolling.
But if someone has made a firm decision to repudiate the trolling, in such a case, if the person were to register under a new name and show a sincere interest and be respectful of what others write, they'd be welcome to come back.
Imagine some group that dislikes RR.com. A really great way for this hypothetical entity to install a no-exit state of mind would be to train its members to go to RR.com and be disruptive.
That way, if they get dumped on and then get banned, this would subconsciously leave them believing that RR.com is an unwelcoming and abusive place...which would distract from them recognizing that it is the LGAT they are in that told them to go to RR.com and troll, that is actually the abusive place.
A really sad part of this hypothetical scenario might be someone who is told by Group X to oroslytize/troll on RR.com, gets banned for trolling, then eventually leaves Group X, either because of misgivings or because their health breaks down after months or years of overwork.
Having left abusive Group X, the refugee might feel afraid to go to RR.com and read up on Group X after they've left because the trolling they did when under the influence of Group X might have implanted the belief that RR.com is abusive and that after being banned they can never return, even after having left thier group.
I have no way of knowing if this has ever happened, but it is a possible scenario we should keep in mind.
Recovery is a complex process. It is possible to physically leave or get kicked out of a group, yet emotionally fight the ghastly impact of facing one's trust has been betrayed and that one has been used as an object and even been led to engage in behavior one now regrets.
And many of these entities leave people with a complex mix of happy memories along with a payload of shame, one can have experienced benefits in some areass of one's life, while having been grievously harmed elsewhere. Its these mixed legacy groups that are hardest to face--often because one wavers between lucidity and then waves of confusion.
Its hard to tell when someone is going through this, and someone who is coldly trolling.
But if someone has made a firm decision to repudiate the trolling, in such a case, if the person were to register under a new name and show a sincere interest and be respectful of what others write, they'd be welcome to come back.
Re: Mankind Project - Garbage In Garbage Out
Posted by:
ON2 LF
()
Date: October 30, 2007 01:14PM
Quote
corboy
Imagine some group that dislikes RR.com.
perish the thought...unimaginable! :)
kidding aside, its a damn good point you've made. It causes me to think back to a few I've been less than kind to on this board when I've been certain they were just out for a quick intrusive troll. I hope to God I haven't made them feel like they have no where left to turn when they leave their LGAT.
sharp 'free ranging' imagination, :) good call.
What if the trolls are here for such a sick reason as to be forced into a situation where they burn any potential bridges, and to cut any life lines they might need later on. That thought makes me sick.
I don't fully understand all the processes one has to suffer through after a cult but I am well acquainted with suffering and with shame, I shudder to think of how much worse the darkness gets when a person is confronted with the reality that there is in fact, NO WHERE left to turn.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2007 01:20PM by ON2 LF.
What if groups encourage or tell people to troll?
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 30, 2007 09:30PM
Thanks, ON 2LF.
Today's troll may perhaps become tomorrow's cult education consultant.
In the mean time, the Prime Directive on the message board has always been courtesy--to support this as a sanctuary/boundaried space where people feel free to raise questions about whatever group, project or relationship they've been through.
That means keeping discussion at a level where everyone feels that their shares are respected, even if not everyone agrees with a particular point.
If in the present moment, someone is trolling, its right to say that what they are doing is out of sych with the stated purposes of the board. We can hope for someone's eventual recovery, while at the same time setting limits on disruptive behavior.
It is behavior in the present moment that matters.
There's a policy some use if they have a friend or loved one who is an active alcoholic---you're welcome to visit when you are not inebriated but we will not let you in the house when you are drunk or stoned.
Today's troll may perhaps become tomorrow's cult education consultant.
In the mean time, the Prime Directive on the message board has always been courtesy--to support this as a sanctuary/boundaried space where people feel free to raise questions about whatever group, project or relationship they've been through.
That means keeping discussion at a level where everyone feels that their shares are respected, even if not everyone agrees with a particular point.
If in the present moment, someone is trolling, its right to say that what they are doing is out of sych with the stated purposes of the board. We can hope for someone's eventual recovery, while at the same time setting limits on disruptive behavior.
It is behavior in the present moment that matters.
There's a policy some use if they have a friend or loved one who is an active alcoholic---you're welcome to visit when you are not inebriated but we will not let you in the house when you are drunk or stoned.
Re: What if groups encourage or tell people to troll?
Posted by:
ON2 LF
()
Date: October 31, 2007 07:06AM
Quote
corboy
Today's troll may perhaps become tomorrow's cult education consultant.
In the mean time, the Prime Directive on the message board has always been courtesy--to support this as a sanctuary/boundaried space where people feel free to raise questions about whatever group, project or relationship they've been through.
yes, step lightly on ALL toes. It is so easy to get and stay angry about something but such a relief to step outside the anger and just breathe.
I personally cannot say enough for the difference that having this site as a sanctuary, has made.
Re: Mankind Project - Garbage In Garbage Out
Posted by:
bigboyx5
()
Date: October 31, 2007 08:51AM
I'll second that. it's refreshing to see that the crap this (and other) groups put members and families through is not being ignored. It's good to come here and see you're not alone in the experiences.
Re: Mankind Project - Garbage In Garbage Out
Posted by:
The_Houdini
()
Date: November 08, 2007 03:21AM
The reason there is a supposed market for this website and the information it provides is that most LGATs were not honest enough with potential enrollees and did not warn them the severity of activities involved in one of those infamous seminar weekends. You imply that Rick Ross Institute makes a profit from the people who post on this forum. I don't pay him, I know that much. But you sure as heck aren't going to get to do ANYTHING for free when it comes to Landmark, Impact, Sterling, or any of those garbage organizations that mess up lives and ruin families and friendships and destroy spiritual communities.
Honesty? You're on culteducation.com and you are posting about honesty. Do you even know who Rick Ross is? I never implied that this "institute" makes a profit from this message board. They do however peddle various books, clinics, DVD's etc. Garbage organizations are your opinion. Frankly, my bank and health insurance provider cause mess up more lives than NWTA ever could even if they wanted to.
This website provides information that most LGATs are afraid to give potential enrollees. If LGAT members were allowed to tell potential enrollees what their "weekend seminar" actually entailed, NOBODY WOULD FRICKIN' GO! The people on here who defend the LGAT... sure you got great things from it, and you continue to commit yourself and blah blah snooze snooze... but the bottom line is, if you knew ahead of time you would be spending $600 (or whatever the LGAT-du-jour is charging) to be broken down, sleep- and bathroom-deprived, and emotionally abused, you would not have gone. And some part of you knows that.
This is a .com website. .com = commercial. Lots of organizations are paid before the product is seen. Ever been to a baseball or football game? If you knew ahead of time your team would lose would you still buy a ticket?
I am SO glad this website is here. Market? Please, the only ones charging for this service is your friendly neighborhood LGAT group.
Look beyond the forum and you'll find all kinds of things for sale on this site.
Have a pleasant life. Most brainwashed people do... till they wake up.[/quote]
Brainwashed umm isn't that name calling? Or am I the only one who is ever accused of name calling? Well, what is it rrmod? I have been called all sorts of names on this site and the ONE time I name called I get reprimanded for it.
To be honest, I came to this website looking for dirt on NWTA because I thought what I went thru in the 30 minutes I was at it. I ran across this forum and realized that you people are more of sheep than the MKP social inepts. I only wanted to voice my opinion from ligit experience that these people are weird, but not a cult and I get shit on. This forum has more cult-like charectoristics than that group could ever hope to. And as for Mr Rick Ross, congrats on supporting a criminal, liar, cheat and a peice of shit person who expects everything for free. Quite an impressive criminal record and looks like he has some friends in high places to get all this shit thrown out of the courts all the time. I'm sure you people will probably ignore it. Oh, thank you, I do have a very pleasant life and don't need you to tell me.
[www.nndb.com]
Rick Ross
AKA Ricky Alan Ross
Born: 24-Nov-1952
Birthplace: Cleveland, OH
Gender: Male
Religion: Jewish
Race or Ethnicity: White
Occupation: Activist
Nationality: United States
Executive summary: Cult expert, deprogrammer
A nationally-recognized authority on destructive religious cults, Rick Ross is universally hated by Scientologists, Waco conspiracists, and nutballs of every creed. Unfortunately Ross has a minor and not-very-relevant criminal history (vacated by the Arizona court over a decade ago, as permitted under state law) which opponents often try to bring into play when he is debating a cult apologist.
Father: Paul Ross (adoptive)
Mother: Ethel Ross (adoptive)
High School: North High School, Phoenix, AZ (1970)
Bankruptcy 1995
Conspiracy (to commit grand theft) Arizona, convicted 1975, vacated 1983
Grand Theft charge reduced
Violating Probation 29-Jul-1975
Burglary (attempted burglary) Phoenix, AZ 23-Dec-1974, charge reduced
Conspiracy (to commit burglary) Arizona, convicted 22-Dec-1974, vacated 1983
False Imprisonment 1991, charges dropped, refiled, acquitted
Adopted
Risk Factors: Smoking
Official Website:
[www.culteducation.com]
Do you know something we don't?
Submit a correction or make a comment about this profile
Copyright ©2007 Soylent Communications
Honesty? You're on culteducation.com and you are posting about honesty. Do you even know who Rick Ross is? I never implied that this "institute" makes a profit from this message board. They do however peddle various books, clinics, DVD's etc. Garbage organizations are your opinion. Frankly, my bank and health insurance provider cause mess up more lives than NWTA ever could even if they wanted to.
This website provides information that most LGATs are afraid to give potential enrollees. If LGAT members were allowed to tell potential enrollees what their "weekend seminar" actually entailed, NOBODY WOULD FRICKIN' GO! The people on here who defend the LGAT... sure you got great things from it, and you continue to commit yourself and blah blah snooze snooze... but the bottom line is, if you knew ahead of time you would be spending $600 (or whatever the LGAT-du-jour is charging) to be broken down, sleep- and bathroom-deprived, and emotionally abused, you would not have gone. And some part of you knows that.
This is a .com website. .com = commercial. Lots of organizations are paid before the product is seen. Ever been to a baseball or football game? If you knew ahead of time your team would lose would you still buy a ticket?
I am SO glad this website is here. Market? Please, the only ones charging for this service is your friendly neighborhood LGAT group.
Look beyond the forum and you'll find all kinds of things for sale on this site.
Have a pleasant life. Most brainwashed people do... till they wake up.[/quote]
Brainwashed umm isn't that name calling? Or am I the only one who is ever accused of name calling? Well, what is it rrmod? I have been called all sorts of names on this site and the ONE time I name called I get reprimanded for it.
To be honest, I came to this website looking for dirt on NWTA because I thought what I went thru in the 30 minutes I was at it. I ran across this forum and realized that you people are more of sheep than the MKP social inepts. I only wanted to voice my opinion from ligit experience that these people are weird, but not a cult and I get shit on. This forum has more cult-like charectoristics than that group could ever hope to. And as for Mr Rick Ross, congrats on supporting a criminal, liar, cheat and a peice of shit person who expects everything for free. Quite an impressive criminal record and looks like he has some friends in high places to get all this shit thrown out of the courts all the time. I'm sure you people will probably ignore it. Oh, thank you, I do have a very pleasant life and don't need you to tell me.
[www.nndb.com]
Rick Ross
AKA Ricky Alan Ross
Born: 24-Nov-1952
Birthplace: Cleveland, OH
Gender: Male
Religion: Jewish
Race or Ethnicity: White
Occupation: Activist
Nationality: United States
Executive summary: Cult expert, deprogrammer
A nationally-recognized authority on destructive religious cults, Rick Ross is universally hated by Scientologists, Waco conspiracists, and nutballs of every creed. Unfortunately Ross has a minor and not-very-relevant criminal history (vacated by the Arizona court over a decade ago, as permitted under state law) which opponents often try to bring into play when he is debating a cult apologist.
Father: Paul Ross (adoptive)
Mother: Ethel Ross (adoptive)
High School: North High School, Phoenix, AZ (1970)
Bankruptcy 1995
Conspiracy (to commit grand theft) Arizona, convicted 1975, vacated 1983
Grand Theft charge reduced
Violating Probation 29-Jul-1975
Burglary (attempted burglary) Phoenix, AZ 23-Dec-1974, charge reduced
Conspiracy (to commit burglary) Arizona, convicted 22-Dec-1974, vacated 1983
False Imprisonment 1991, charges dropped, refiled, acquitted
Adopted
Risk Factors: Smoking
Official Website:
[www.culteducation.com]
Do you know something we don't?
Submit a correction or make a comment about this profile
Copyright ©2007 Soylent Communications
Re: Mankind Project - Garbage In Garbage Out
Posted by:
Vic-Luc
()
Date: November 08, 2007 12:28PM
Tell me something we don't know, genius. I'm dazzled by your brilliance!
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