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Jack Oskar LarmQuote
ON2 LF
One size and one philosophy DOES NOT do the trick.
That's my belief, too. ON2 LF, some really good responses! I think boonetahoe has found something that helps validate his/her journey. That's great, but it's obviously a bad strategy to post pro-LGAT stuff here. Always good to hear 'success' stories.
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Blue PillQuote
Jack Oskar LarmQuote
ON2 LF
One size and one philosophy DOES NOT do the trick.
That's my belief, too. ON2 LF, some really good responses! I think boonetahoe has found something that helps validate his/her journey. That's great, but it's obviously a bad strategy to post pro-LGAT stuff here. Always good to hear 'success' stories.
A very good debate here and its interesting to see the various buttons that can be pushed on either side of this debate. My experience of Landmark Education is not totally negative, you can draw positives from literally every situation in life. I went through a break-up of a long term relationship a stronger person by learning more about myself and challenging my whole perspective on life to become more open to other opinions and ideas.
So do they engender repaired relationships? Sure – I witnessed it happening. Do people come out of it being more expressed and able to work better with others? Sure I saw that happen as well. Is it all about making money from vulnerable people – probably, but there is no conclusive evidence either way and probably never will be unless some government out there decide to look into it. If it is then maybe that’s not wrong either. Sky, Microsoft, Nike are all accused of shady, manipulative and shady dealings, profiteering etc etc.
Here is my personal list of why I am enraged about Landmark (not experienced any others and will never do so). Apologies if I am repeating myself or others
1. The outright hypocrisy of their belief system. For example a statement of “Total care for people’s well being” vs 3am finishes for volunteers. I could go on and list all the others but you are all well informed and know what they are
2. Absolutely no tolerance at all for logical enquiry into that belief system. Its absolutism at its finest and it’s the route to Totalitarianism in every sense.
3. It’s scattergun, borrowed (some would say stolen) Psychology and Philosophy tactics without taking responsibility for the negative or harmful effects it has on some that are well known and documented
4. Its cavalier, arrogant attitude towards its critics, again a basic tenant of their inherent Hypocrisy. “Allow yourself to be coached” it says to its followers. Does it do the same in the other direction from often well meaning contributors? Does it heck!
5. Their fanatical and deeply disturbing tactics for gaining more business, pressuring its customers to be their own sales force using some of the most twisted, bullying, mind games I have ever witnessed (I have seen a few in my own career I can tell you)
6. Their determination to dictate their values on society, their customers and their unpaid workforce through whatever means possible. Example – a checklist to make sure you are living life with Integrity???????? Just f*&ck off! This is control freak mentality gone into a whole new dimension.
There are probably more but I’ll stop there before I ruin my own day.
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At the same time, the experiential training model itself isn't inherently flawed with these excesses. It's interesting to read your list and to compare it to the practices of a member-run, non-profit LGAT. Those cult-like aspects of the LGAT are largely (not totally, I'm sure) lost over time when the organization is controlled by a diverse and collaborative board. For many reasons, the exclusive mentality becomes far more sober and inclusive.
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boonetahoe
Here is my personal list of why I am enraged about Landmark (not experienced any others and will never do so). Apologies if I am repeating myself or others
1. The outright hypocrisy of their belief system. For example a statement of “Total care for people’s well being” vs 3am finishes for volunteers. I could go on and list all the others but you are all well informed and know what they are
2. Absolutely no tolerance at all for logical enquiry into that belief system. Its absolutism at its finest and it’s the route to Totalitarianism in every sense.
3. It’s scattergun, borrowed (some would say stolen) Psychology and Philosophy tactics without taking responsibility for the negative or harmful effects it has on some that are well known and documented
4. Its cavalier, arrogant attitude towards its critics, again a basic tenant of their inherent Hypocrisy. “Allow yourself to be coached” it says to its followers. Does it do the same in the other direction from often well meaning contributors? Does it heck!
5. Their fanatical and deeply disturbing tactics for gaining more business, pressuring its customers to be their own sales force using some of the most twisted, bullying, mind games I have ever witnessed (I have seen a few in my own career I can tell you)
6. Their determination to dictate their values on society, their customers and their unpaid workforce through whatever means possible. Example – a checklist to make sure you are living life with Integrity???????? Just f*&ck off! This is control freak mentality gone into a whole new dimension.
There are probably more but I’ll stop there before I ruin my own day.
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The first est Training took place at the Jack Tar Hotel in San Francisco, California in October 1971. From this first course, as word of mouth about this powerful and life-changing 'experience-centered' workshop began to circulate, more and more people wanted to sign up, and est began to grow rapidly.
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ON2 LF
I probably need to just admit that I did not know her as well as I thought I did.
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skepticQuote
ON2 LF
I probably need to just admit that I did not know her as well as I thought I did.
I've had this same thought about a close, trusted friend of 15 years who got into a cultic relationship (after going through CONtext) and then turned against me. I have been totally baffled by it, for about five years now, thinking that I really didn't know him. Just recently I thought about it differently. I think I did know him and that his personality change is due to the power and control of a master manipulator. Same thing lgats do to people.
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ON2 LF
... whether there was ever a genuine friendship there. Bullshit isn't always powerful enough to pit a friend against another. I think I over estimated my friend's loyalty to me. I over estimated the quality of the friendship. I can only use my own idea of what being a friend is, to measure by. I think I took the friendship a bit more seriously than my friend did. If not, I wouldn't still be tossing the issue back and forth while my lost friend continues on her merry way, without ever once having given a thought to her unfair and calculating behaviors, once landmark reinfected her mind. ... When did reality begin to get such a raw deal anyway?