Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 09, 2007 02:25PM
I am working on connecting the dots here.
I have not read the book "Dianetics" yet, I remember it back when it came out. I avoided it like the plague back then.
As I have been doing research on LGAT's, and Scientology. As I have been back tracking with what information I get on these two things.
I am picking up a very strong sense of a connection here. But not in a direct fashion to Scientology. But a connection between LGAT philosphy and Scientology via Dianetics.
Which is the same as a direct connection since L. Ron Hubbard who founded Scientology wrote the book, "Dianetics."
I looked the official website of Scientology, and looked around a bit. Here is he summary of the book on this site, and here is link to where I copied from.
[catalog.scientology.net]
Does anyone else feel like your reading a promise given from a LGAT company and what they will do in someones life?
I really believe that Scientology via Dianetics is the mother of all these LGAT's that are out there.
The only difference is how these companies have modified it to be a big business that makes alot of money delivering this messed up philosphy in our society.
What your thoughts on this connection?
Let me hear them. Please.
I have not read the book "Dianetics" yet, I remember it back when it came out. I avoided it like the plague back then.
As I have been doing research on LGAT's, and Scientology. As I have been back tracking with what information I get on these two things.
I am picking up a very strong sense of a connection here. But not in a direct fashion to Scientology. But a connection between LGAT philosphy and Scientology via Dianetics.
Which is the same as a direct connection since L. Ron Hubbard who founded Scientology wrote the book, "Dianetics."
I looked the official website of Scientology, and looked around a bit. Here is he summary of the book on this site, and here is link to where I copied from.
[catalog.scientology.net]
Quote
If you’ve ever felt there was something holding you back in life, ruining your plans and stopping you from being who you want to be, you were right. The fact is, there is a single source of all your problems, stress, unhappiness and self-doubt. It’s called the reactive mind – the hidden part of your mind that stores all painful experiences, then uses them against you.
Does anyone else feel like your reading a promise given from a LGAT company and what they will do in someones life?
I really believe that Scientology via Dianetics is the mother of all these LGAT's that are out there.
The only difference is how these companies have modified it to be a big business that makes alot of money delivering this messed up philosphy in our society.
What your thoughts on this connection?
Let me hear them. Please.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 09, 2007 02:49PM
Interesting read.
I did not know that L. Ron Hubbard declared war on psychiatry and his philosphy and its agenda is to rid the world of psychiatry.
Here is link, and copy of the portion talking about it. Read more of the site. Good reading...
[www.arts.ualberta.ca]
Scientology's International Attacks Against Psychiatry
The "war" against psychiatry has been integral to Hubbard's mission since his first book on Dianetics in 1950,(4) and continues to this day. Writing in 1968, Hubbard indicated that throughout the entire eighteen year history of Dianetics and Scientology, "only one small group" had "hammered" them. This small but internationally connected group, Hubbard charged, was behind the "lies and slander" that both the press and government agencies received, and its members "reach into International Finance, Health Ministries, Schools, [and] the press." Were the situation not dire enough, Hubbard grimly warned his readers that this small group also "infiltrated boards of education, the armed services, even the churches." Lest any doubt might have existed about who constituted the small but influential and conspiratorial group, Hubbard announced that it was "[p]sychiatry and 'Mental Health," which together were "a vehicle to undermine and destroy the West!" through their techniques of electric shocks and brain operations.
Hubbard claimed that, fortunately, Scientology was able to undo the negative effects that psychiatrists and mental health personnel had on the West (Hubbard 1968, p.1). Hubbard declared that Scientology was fighting back, and "the effectiveness of our means will become history" (Hubbard 1968, p.2). In the realm of international politics, the gravest danger from "the psychiatrist" came from that profession's "hoping to place one of his ilk in a blackmail position behind every head of state" (Hubbard 1982a, p.2). In a fashion reminiscent of the Jesuits, Hubbard felt that psychiatrists had sought to obtain international political power by becoming the contemporary "confessors" and counsellors of the politically powerful.(5)
Hubbard also portrayed psychiatrists as demons. They not only ruined this world but also had been adversely affecting humanity throughout all of people's previous lives (called their 'time track' or simply 'track'). In a passage that condemned psychiatrists for the woes of the cosmos, Hubbard determined that:
nder the false data of the psychs (who have been on the track a long time and are the sole cause of decline in this universe) both pain and sex are gaining ground in this society and, coupled with robbery (which is a hooded companion of both), may very well soon make the land a true jungle of crime (Hubbard 1982c, pp.1-2 [emphasis in original]).
Psychiatrists took on the classic Western characteristics of evil in a cartoon printed in the first International Edition of Scientology's publication, Freedom, where a front page drawing depicted eight psychiatrists as horned, goateed, tailed, and cloven-hoofed devils injecting 'patients' with drugs and performing electric shock, topectomies, and lobotomies (Freedom 1969, p.1).
Since psychiatry is Scientology`s alleged cosmic enemy, Hubbard and his followers want to see the profession destroyed, and its functions in society replaced by Scientology tech. If society's authorities do not abolish it (so the organization asserted), then Scientology will. Thus Hubbard concluded that:
Doctors are too often careless and incompetent, psychiatrists are simply outright murderers. The solution is not to pick up their pieces for them but to demand medical doctors become competent and to abolish psychiatry and psychiatrists as well as other infamous Nazi criminal outgrowths (Hubbard 1976b).
Expanding his list of associations between psychiatry and wrongdoing, Hubbard allegedly pinpointed "the cause of crime" as three psychiatric treatments: "[e]lectric shocks, behavior modification, [and] abuse of the soul." Consequently, he reasoned, "[t]here's only one remedy for crime--get rid of the psychs!" (Hubbard 1982b, p.1).
As directed, Scientology as an organization took on the task of psychiatry's eradication. In a 1990 publication, it asserted that "Scientologists are making enormous strides in abolishing the cause of crime--psychiatry" (Religious Technology Center 1990, p.[4v]; see Atack 1990, pp.220-221, 261-262). Also in the same year another Scientology publication boldly proclaimed that "[w]e set out to eradicate the psychiatric suppression from society, so that truly workable LRH technology can instead be applied to improve conditions" (Weiland 1990, p. 21). As we soon shall see, Scientology's abolitionist war has had some impact upon the psychiatric profession and its members.
I did not know that L. Ron Hubbard declared war on psychiatry and his philosphy and its agenda is to rid the world of psychiatry.
Here is link, and copy of the portion talking about it. Read more of the site. Good reading...
[www.arts.ualberta.ca]
Scientology's International Attacks Against Psychiatry
The "war" against psychiatry has been integral to Hubbard's mission since his first book on Dianetics in 1950,(4) and continues to this day. Writing in 1968, Hubbard indicated that throughout the entire eighteen year history of Dianetics and Scientology, "only one small group" had "hammered" them. This small but internationally connected group, Hubbard charged, was behind the "lies and slander" that both the press and government agencies received, and its members "reach into International Finance, Health Ministries, Schools, [and] the press." Were the situation not dire enough, Hubbard grimly warned his readers that this small group also "infiltrated boards of education, the armed services, even the churches." Lest any doubt might have existed about who constituted the small but influential and conspiratorial group, Hubbard announced that it was "[p]sychiatry and 'Mental Health," which together were "a vehicle to undermine and destroy the West!" through their techniques of electric shocks and brain operations.
Hubbard claimed that, fortunately, Scientology was able to undo the negative effects that psychiatrists and mental health personnel had on the West (Hubbard 1968, p.1). Hubbard declared that Scientology was fighting back, and "the effectiveness of our means will become history" (Hubbard 1968, p.2). In the realm of international politics, the gravest danger from "the psychiatrist" came from that profession's "hoping to place one of his ilk in a blackmail position behind every head of state" (Hubbard 1982a, p.2). In a fashion reminiscent of the Jesuits, Hubbard felt that psychiatrists had sought to obtain international political power by becoming the contemporary "confessors" and counsellors of the politically powerful.(5)
Hubbard also portrayed psychiatrists as demons. They not only ruined this world but also had been adversely affecting humanity throughout all of people's previous lives (called their 'time track' or simply 'track'). In a passage that condemned psychiatrists for the woes of the cosmos, Hubbard determined that:
nder the false data of the psychs (who have been on the track a long time and are the sole cause of decline in this universe) both pain and sex are gaining ground in this society and, coupled with robbery (which is a hooded companion of both), may very well soon make the land a true jungle of crime (Hubbard 1982c, pp.1-2 [emphasis in original]).
Psychiatrists took on the classic Western characteristics of evil in a cartoon printed in the first International Edition of Scientology's publication, Freedom, where a front page drawing depicted eight psychiatrists as horned, goateed, tailed, and cloven-hoofed devils injecting 'patients' with drugs and performing electric shock, topectomies, and lobotomies (Freedom 1969, p.1).
Since psychiatry is Scientology`s alleged cosmic enemy, Hubbard and his followers want to see the profession destroyed, and its functions in society replaced by Scientology tech. If society's authorities do not abolish it (so the organization asserted), then Scientology will. Thus Hubbard concluded that:
Doctors are too often careless and incompetent, psychiatrists are simply outright murderers. The solution is not to pick up their pieces for them but to demand medical doctors become competent and to abolish psychiatry and psychiatrists as well as other infamous Nazi criminal outgrowths (Hubbard 1976b).
Expanding his list of associations between psychiatry and wrongdoing, Hubbard allegedly pinpointed "the cause of crime" as three psychiatric treatments: "[e]lectric shocks, behavior modification, [and] abuse of the soul." Consequently, he reasoned, "[t]here's only one remedy for crime--get rid of the psychs!" (Hubbard 1982b, p.1).
As directed, Scientology as an organization took on the task of psychiatry's eradication. In a 1990 publication, it asserted that "Scientologists are making enormous strides in abolishing the cause of crime--psychiatry" (Religious Technology Center 1990, p.[4v]; see Atack 1990, pp.220-221, 261-262). Also in the same year another Scientology publication boldly proclaimed that "[w]e set out to eradicate the psychiatric suppression from society, so that truly workable LRH technology can instead be applied to improve conditions" (Weiland 1990, p. 21). As we soon shall see, Scientology's abolitionist war has had some impact upon the psychiatric profession and its members.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 09, 2007 03:01PM
Isn't it interesting how LGAT's deal within the psychological realm as psychiatrists do. Yet, LGAT's deny this up front with a participant going in, and then "WHAM" every aspect of the seminars is psychological in how it is dealing with a participant.
Things that make you go hmmm...
Dianetics as the cement that holds the foundation together for LGAT philosphy...
What do you all think?
I am sure seeing it...
Things that make you go hmmm...
Dianetics as the cement that holds the foundation together for LGAT philosphy...
What do you all think?
I am sure seeing it...
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 09, 2007 03:12PM
Here is another good read part of this link that I gave above.
[www.arts.ualberta.ca]
The scope and complexity of Scientology's international activities should encourage a renewed interest in the organization as a focus of academic study. Academics who take up the study will witness noteworthy events over the next few years, only a few of which they can predict. First, researchers will witness Scientologists and their organization investing a substantial portion of money saved by the American tax-exemption into a coordinated, worldwide campaign against the group's perceived cosmic ememy, psychiatry. A December 7, 1993 letter sent out by Don Gershbock, Membership Officer at the CCHR in the United States, urged people "to join CCHR US, as a card carrying member, and help us put an end to psychiatric abuse forever" (Citizens Commission on Human Rights 1993). Its attached mailing identified the tax deductible status of contributions to CCHR (which was granted as part of the IRS decision), and also contained the promise (printed in large, heavy black letters), that "The psychs are next" (Citizens Commission on Human Rights 1993). These promised attacks are providing unusual opportunities for researchers to observe an ideological assault against a secular and scientific discipline.
[www.arts.ualberta.ca]
The scope and complexity of Scientology's international activities should encourage a renewed interest in the organization as a focus of academic study. Academics who take up the study will witness noteworthy events over the next few years, only a few of which they can predict. First, researchers will witness Scientologists and their organization investing a substantial portion of money saved by the American tax-exemption into a coordinated, worldwide campaign against the group's perceived cosmic ememy, psychiatry. A December 7, 1993 letter sent out by Don Gershbock, Membership Officer at the CCHR in the United States, urged people "to join CCHR US, as a card carrying member, and help us put an end to psychiatric abuse forever" (Citizens Commission on Human Rights 1993). Its attached mailing identified the tax deductible status of contributions to CCHR (which was granted as part of the IRS decision), and also contained the promise (printed in large, heavy black letters), that "The psychs are next" (Citizens Commission on Human Rights 1993). These promised attacks are providing unusual opportunities for researchers to observe an ideological assault against a secular and scientific discipline.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
upsidedownnewspaper
()
Date: July 09, 2007 03:23PM
Hi Rswinters,
I just replied at length, got logged off and of course, my reply vanished. I'll try to be more succinct!
I have read your several posts lately suggesting Scientology is the fountainhead of new age LGAT therapies. I think you are falling into a trap.
Scientology would love for you to think they have measured the perimeters of a new way of thought and that all else stems from it. Fact is, the philosophies of Scientology and LGATs have been around for centuries.
I am reading Voltaire's Candide right now. Written in 1758, it is a witty attack on the philosophies of Liebnitz and other Optimists in the Enlightenment who wondered, is everything as it should be? These ideas are aped in modern times by new age gurus like Rhonda Byrne. The difference is, the new age gurus tighten the reins: they don't just wonder about such ways of looking at the world, they insist upon it and dogmatically teach it as their own.
You sound like you are very capably embarking on a history of ideas, starting in the modern times. Browse official Scientology websites, if you wish, but don't let them convince you to stop with them. You can, I guess, if you want to, but not based upon their sales pitches that only Scientology's trademarked, unique vision can truly enlighten you.
Read beyond the official website. Education is free. Philosophy is free.
Just backspace after you log back in. What you've written will still be there and you can post it.
EZ[/color:5cfa3c9f36]
I just replied at length, got logged off and of course, my reply vanished. I'll try to be more succinct!
I have read your several posts lately suggesting Scientology is the fountainhead of new age LGAT therapies. I think you are falling into a trap.
Scientology would love for you to think they have measured the perimeters of a new way of thought and that all else stems from it. Fact is, the philosophies of Scientology and LGATs have been around for centuries.
I am reading Voltaire's Candide right now. Written in 1758, it is a witty attack on the philosophies of Liebnitz and other Optimists in the Enlightenment who wondered, is everything as it should be? These ideas are aped in modern times by new age gurus like Rhonda Byrne. The difference is, the new age gurus tighten the reins: they don't just wonder about such ways of looking at the world, they insist upon it and dogmatically teach it as their own.
You sound like you are very capably embarking on a history of ideas, starting in the modern times. Browse official Scientology websites, if you wish, but don't let them convince you to stop with them. You can, I guess, if you want to, but not based upon their sales pitches that only Scientology's trademarked, unique vision can truly enlighten you.
Read beyond the official website. Education is free. Philosophy is free.
Just backspace after you log back in. What you've written will still be there and you can post it.
EZ[/color:5cfa3c9f36]
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
SaneAgain
()
Date: July 10, 2007 02:00AM
This is all fascinating. I also stumbled across some things about Heidegger, 'house philosopher of the third reich' on this thread:
[board.culteducation.com]
Seems he believed language creates reality and the correct use of language can create "authentic" reality. Amongst other things. Heidegger is on the Quest reading list, by the way.
The history of ideas is interesting but the striking thing about Scientology is it seems to be the first organisation that used the combination of lgat ideas and lgat techniques together.
The techniques I'm thinking of are dyads (long periods of eye-contact with another person while sitting with a fixed body posture, a trance-inducing technique) and confession / "secrets" processes.
upsidedownnewspaper - do you know of any other organisations in history that have combined the ideas and techniques? Apart from - I guess you could say heidegger influenced Hitler and Hitler used a form of mass hypnosis - but is there anything else more specific in history?
It is also fascinating to see the pot calling the kettle black:
One of the biggest complaints I've seen against scientology in the limited reading I"ve done is that they get people to confess their secrets and keep records of these secrets. Then if people turn against Scientology the secrets are used for blackmail. Scientology auditors are the "contemporary confessors and counsellors of the politically (or at least hollywood-ly) powerful. Exactly what Hubbard accused psychiatrists of!
I haven't heard of secrets from lgat training being used to blackmail people, but I think the mere fact they have the secrets leaves people in a vulnerable position.
I am also curious about the history of confession and how this came to be used by Scientologists and lgats. Did they just copy from the catholic church? At points in history the catholic church also sold (what is the correct word?) - some kind of forgiveness points from god - for a fee. Religion confuses me; I thought the point of christianity was that you only have to ask Jesus for forgiveness yet catholic church is christian but expects you to go through a priest. Maybe someone could explain that, if it is not too off-topic.
And then there is the psychological side of conffession and absolution, where it fits in society in general and particularly a secular society?
And linked to all of that - the abuse of confession, where it seems some organisations deliberately instill guilt and shame so that people develop a need to use the organisation for confession.
I am thinking here not specifically of "secrets" processes in lgats but also the simple processes where people say what's wrong in their lives, then that gets turned into their responsibility (person choosing to be a victim or whatever) and surely that is a kind of absolution for any perpetrators in the room??? And what about false guilt for the victims?
[board.culteducation.com]
Seems he believed language creates reality and the correct use of language can create "authentic" reality. Amongst other things. Heidegger is on the Quest reading list, by the way.
The history of ideas is interesting but the striking thing about Scientology is it seems to be the first organisation that used the combination of lgat ideas and lgat techniques together.
The techniques I'm thinking of are dyads (long periods of eye-contact with another person while sitting with a fixed body posture, a trance-inducing technique) and confession / "secrets" processes.
upsidedownnewspaper - do you know of any other organisations in history that have combined the ideas and techniques? Apart from - I guess you could say heidegger influenced Hitler and Hitler used a form of mass hypnosis - but is there anything else more specific in history?
It is also fascinating to see the pot calling the kettle black:
Quote
In the realm of international politics, the gravest danger from "the psychiatrist" came from that profession's "hoping to place one of his ilk in a blackmail position behind every head of state" (Hubbard 1982a, p.2). In a fashion reminiscent of the Jesuits, Hubbard felt that psychiatrists had sought to obtain international political power by becoming the contemporary "confessors" and counsellors of the politically powerful.(5)
One of the biggest complaints I've seen against scientology in the limited reading I"ve done is that they get people to confess their secrets and keep records of these secrets. Then if people turn against Scientology the secrets are used for blackmail. Scientology auditors are the "contemporary confessors and counsellors of the politically (or at least hollywood-ly) powerful. Exactly what Hubbard accused psychiatrists of!
I haven't heard of secrets from lgat training being used to blackmail people, but I think the mere fact they have the secrets leaves people in a vulnerable position.
I am also curious about the history of confession and how this came to be used by Scientologists and lgats. Did they just copy from the catholic church? At points in history the catholic church also sold (what is the correct word?) - some kind of forgiveness points from god - for a fee. Religion confuses me; I thought the point of christianity was that you only have to ask Jesus for forgiveness yet catholic church is christian but expects you to go through a priest. Maybe someone could explain that, if it is not too off-topic.
And then there is the psychological side of conffession and absolution, where it fits in society in general and particularly a secular society?
And linked to all of that - the abuse of confession, where it seems some organisations deliberately instill guilt and shame so that people develop a need to use the organisation for confession.
I am thinking here not specifically of "secrets" processes in lgats but also the simple processes where people say what's wrong in their lives, then that gets turned into their responsibility (person choosing to be a victim or whatever) and surely that is a kind of absolution for any perpetrators in the room??? And what about false guilt for the victims?
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 10, 2007 02:22AM
Quote
SaneAgain
I thought the point of christianity was that you only have to ask Jesus for forgiveness yet catholic church is christian but expects you to go through a priest. Maybe someone could explain that, if it is not too off-topic.
Real quickly to not go to far off topic. I have been what I understand to be what I will call myself as a biblical Christian that has a relationship with God based on Jesus Christ and His death on the cross for my salvation, and the resurrection from the dead.
This is the Christian definition I operate from in my life.
I have been discovering that the definition of what Christian is, and is not is very different for many people.
My definition of Christianity is definitely not the same as Brian Klemmer and his companies definition of it. Nor is it similar to that of Scientology.
My definition of Christianity is definitly not the same definition that seems to be held by many on this website.
I don't agree with the way many people who profess to be Christians use this as a means to treat others in a manner that in my opinion is definitely not Christian in my opinion from 30 years of being a biblical Christian.
My Christianity makes me face myself, and requires my being held accountable for how I show up in life, and how I am being in relationships.
It does not give me the excuse to treat others as I have seen, and heard many so called Christians choose to do and then justify themselves in not being accountable for how they show up.
So to put it simply. The term Christian in our society is not a valid description any longer.
The use of Christian has been so abused in our society that it is not an accurate description to describe someone with any longer.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
SaneAgain
()
Date: July 10, 2007 02:45AM
Thanks Rs. This makes a lot of sense:
Sorry to wonder so off topic, just got curious in light of confessions in scientology.
Quote
The use of Christian has been so abused in our society that it is not an accurate description to describe someone with any longer.
Sorry to wonder so off topic, just got curious in light of confessions in scientology.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Rswinters
()
Date: July 10, 2007 05:42AM
For now I am a little fixated on this connection. Only because of what I have discovered in my researching out Klemmer & Associates and how it has developed into a broader research project. Klemmer & Associates is just a pawn in an overall game plan. In my opinion that is.
As I have been researching LGAT's as a whole after coming to this site and discovering the similarities of all LGAT's. Heck the LGAT’s are even using the same techniques, and the same games that are used in their seminars to set up participants in facing their belief systems in such a emotionally powerful manner that influences a participant to turn off critical thinking which leaves them wide open to allowing for LGAT’s to implant a different belief system to live by.
What belief system? What philosophy? I agree with all the stuff on this website on how these LGAT’s operate, and how they are deceptive. Yet, I challenge everyone to take it further. Don’t just stop at the messenger (LGAT). Broaden the scope of what is looked at here.
In my research and reading on what the doctrine of Scientology/Dianetics is all about. What their belief is, and what is their agenda in getting this belief spread across our world. As I get this bigger picture on the scope of what is Scientology.
I am seeing very strong patterns in my research that can't be ignored by me. So, I am bringing it to this website. My hope is to get different perspectives on this matter.
There are those out there that are far more knowledgeable on this stuff than me.
What if Scientology is using LGAT's in an indirect attack to destroy the accepted medical aspect of psychiatric care in our nation? What if those who have been mentored in the doctrine of Scientology/Dianetic philosophy in their lives are truly the founders of these LGAT’s that we have all come to hate.
One of the things that I discovered in reading the doctrine of Scientology was the inability to really nail down what is believed. It is all basically relative, and is so elusive in pinning down that a person would go crazy trying to get it stated what Scientology/Dianetics actually believe in a given situation. It will change based on the circumstances.
The only common denominator that I saw in reading this doctrine is. In any relational conflict with a person/company/or whatever that is grounded and brainwashed by this philosophy. It will always be your negativity that is causing conflict, and not theirs. Any negativity that is in conflict is from you being at cause of it, and it is not their being at cause.
This is insane as they are contradicting themselves as they state, you are at cause for what I am choosing to behave in response to your choice which translates that they are not choosing their behavior themselves. It is a result of the other person’s choice that is attracting it in conflict. Since the behavior is meaningless, and it is the meaning that the person struggling with being treated a certain way is the cause of conflict.
NOTE: There are overall general and accepted behavior limits within relationships on all levels in our society. There are basically established and understood guidelines on what is healthy and unhealthy within relational behavior. These accepted and reasonable guidelines that are established within our society for relational interactions within our society are what guides us in healthy and proper relational interactions among people. I am not saying that these are absolutes in nature. I am saying there are accepted limits within relational interactions that LGAT’s and this messed up Scientology/Dianetic philosophy violates within relational arenas at all levels. The degree to which this violation occurs in a given relational conflict is directly connected to the emotional health of each individual involved in conflict.
This aspect of each individual and where they are emotionally in life is why the LGAT/Scientology/Dianetic philosophy is skewed. It is destructive when a philosophy influences a person to remove their own healthy introspection which needs to be done by both people within any relational conflict. Especially in regards to what is being brought relationally on their end. If a person only allows for the focus to be kept on external aspects versus having focus be a healthy balance of both external and internal perspectives be looked at. There must be the application in both parties of a conflict that looks at, and takes into account both the positive and negative being brought to the relational table in both themselves, and the other person in any relational conflict. This is what creates mutual relationships to be developed, and conflict resolution to occur between two people, and organization.
These healthy relational conflict resolution dynamics are the accepted dynamics in our society that these LGAT’s/Scientology/Dianetics are influencing people to ignore and to disregard in dealing relationally in our society.
What they are swapping out in belief systems with those who are allowing themselves to be brainwashed by this philosophy is one of manipulation within relational environments. Changing the meaning, turning off critical thinking and making it an negative which needs to be avoided. I could go on, and on. But it is all about creating a self focus that is entitled to pleasure/positive and not any negative or what can be associated to negative. All this does is to create a place where a person believes to be happy emotionally there must be the removal of any, and all negative in life to become, and remain happy in life.
“The psychologically healthy person does not ignore reality. However, they do try to remember the positive while dealing constructively with the negative.” Quote from the book, “Children of the Self-Absorbed. A grownup’s guide to getting over narcissistic parents” written by Nina W. Brown. Ed.D., L.P.C.
By the way this is a good book overall. Especially in view of what is being discussed. My professional psychologist that I am seeing gave me this book as an assignment to read. Not just to address the aspect of the title in counseling. But also to address the unhealthy narcissism within myself that in my opinion was the internal magnet that set me up emotionally to buy into Klemmer & Associates seminars that produced severe destruction in the application of their philosophy in my life.
Anyhow, I have gotten off subject. Although, as I look at the broader picture of the subject matter being discussed on this website. Can a person really get off subject when it is so broad in how it affects our society?
We live in an era where there is a battle going on in the bigger realm of society. The whole moral fiber that has been the founding philosophy on which our society has been built is under attack.
In general the overall philosophy has been one of relational mutuality with skirmishes at times which fought this philosophy in our history. Yet, the overwhelming aspect of relational mutuality seemed to of been the influence that won out in past conflicts.
Now with the influence of various source of influence upon our society such as LGAT’s, Scientology/Dianetics has been having on our society over the recent years. There seems to be a lean towards the influence of “The Self-Absorbed” alias destructive narcissism operating within our society.
I don’t know about anyone else? But, I have had to come face to face with this messed up mindset within me, and as I have done so. This addressing within me this self-absorption within myself has removed the scales from my own eyes. As these scales have been removed from my eyes, there has become a clarity of sight in seeing this aspect within our society.
Especially in LGAT’s such as Klemmer & Associates and their self-absorbed teachings within their seminars and company philosophy taught to participants.
I was one, and now I see the truth.
As I have been researching LGAT's as a whole after coming to this site and discovering the similarities of all LGAT's. Heck the LGAT’s are even using the same techniques, and the same games that are used in their seminars to set up participants in facing their belief systems in such a emotionally powerful manner that influences a participant to turn off critical thinking which leaves them wide open to allowing for LGAT’s to implant a different belief system to live by.
What belief system? What philosophy? I agree with all the stuff on this website on how these LGAT’s operate, and how they are deceptive. Yet, I challenge everyone to take it further. Don’t just stop at the messenger (LGAT). Broaden the scope of what is looked at here.
In my research and reading on what the doctrine of Scientology/Dianetics is all about. What their belief is, and what is their agenda in getting this belief spread across our world. As I get this bigger picture on the scope of what is Scientology.
I am seeing very strong patterns in my research that can't be ignored by me. So, I am bringing it to this website. My hope is to get different perspectives on this matter.
There are those out there that are far more knowledgeable on this stuff than me.
What if Scientology is using LGAT's in an indirect attack to destroy the accepted medical aspect of psychiatric care in our nation? What if those who have been mentored in the doctrine of Scientology/Dianetic philosophy in their lives are truly the founders of these LGAT’s that we have all come to hate.
One of the things that I discovered in reading the doctrine of Scientology was the inability to really nail down what is believed. It is all basically relative, and is so elusive in pinning down that a person would go crazy trying to get it stated what Scientology/Dianetics actually believe in a given situation. It will change based on the circumstances.
The only common denominator that I saw in reading this doctrine is. In any relational conflict with a person/company/or whatever that is grounded and brainwashed by this philosophy. It will always be your negativity that is causing conflict, and not theirs. Any negativity that is in conflict is from you being at cause of it, and it is not their being at cause.
This is insane as they are contradicting themselves as they state, you are at cause for what I am choosing to behave in response to your choice which translates that they are not choosing their behavior themselves. It is a result of the other person’s choice that is attracting it in conflict. Since the behavior is meaningless, and it is the meaning that the person struggling with being treated a certain way is the cause of conflict.
NOTE: There are overall general and accepted behavior limits within relationships on all levels in our society. There are basically established and understood guidelines on what is healthy and unhealthy within relational behavior. These accepted and reasonable guidelines that are established within our society for relational interactions within our society are what guides us in healthy and proper relational interactions among people. I am not saying that these are absolutes in nature. I am saying there are accepted limits within relational interactions that LGAT’s and this messed up Scientology/Dianetic philosophy violates within relational arenas at all levels. The degree to which this violation occurs in a given relational conflict is directly connected to the emotional health of each individual involved in conflict.
This aspect of each individual and where they are emotionally in life is why the LGAT/Scientology/Dianetic philosophy is skewed. It is destructive when a philosophy influences a person to remove their own healthy introspection which needs to be done by both people within any relational conflict. Especially in regards to what is being brought relationally on their end. If a person only allows for the focus to be kept on external aspects versus having focus be a healthy balance of both external and internal perspectives be looked at. There must be the application in both parties of a conflict that looks at, and takes into account both the positive and negative being brought to the relational table in both themselves, and the other person in any relational conflict. This is what creates mutual relationships to be developed, and conflict resolution to occur between two people, and organization.
These healthy relational conflict resolution dynamics are the accepted dynamics in our society that these LGAT’s/Scientology/Dianetics are influencing people to ignore and to disregard in dealing relationally in our society.
What they are swapping out in belief systems with those who are allowing themselves to be brainwashed by this philosophy is one of manipulation within relational environments. Changing the meaning, turning off critical thinking and making it an negative which needs to be avoided. I could go on, and on. But it is all about creating a self focus that is entitled to pleasure/positive and not any negative or what can be associated to negative. All this does is to create a place where a person believes to be happy emotionally there must be the removal of any, and all negative in life to become, and remain happy in life.
“The psychologically healthy person does not ignore reality. However, they do try to remember the positive while dealing constructively with the negative.” Quote from the book, “Children of the Self-Absorbed. A grownup’s guide to getting over narcissistic parents” written by Nina W. Brown. Ed.D., L.P.C.
By the way this is a good book overall. Especially in view of what is being discussed. My professional psychologist that I am seeing gave me this book as an assignment to read. Not just to address the aspect of the title in counseling. But also to address the unhealthy narcissism within myself that in my opinion was the internal magnet that set me up emotionally to buy into Klemmer & Associates seminars that produced severe destruction in the application of their philosophy in my life.
Anyhow, I have gotten off subject. Although, as I look at the broader picture of the subject matter being discussed on this website. Can a person really get off subject when it is so broad in how it affects our society?
We live in an era where there is a battle going on in the bigger realm of society. The whole moral fiber that has been the founding philosophy on which our society has been built is under attack.
In general the overall philosophy has been one of relational mutuality with skirmishes at times which fought this philosophy in our history. Yet, the overwhelming aspect of relational mutuality seemed to of been the influence that won out in past conflicts.
Now with the influence of various source of influence upon our society such as LGAT’s, Scientology/Dianetics has been having on our society over the recent years. There seems to be a lean towards the influence of “The Self-Absorbed” alias destructive narcissism operating within our society.
I don’t know about anyone else? But, I have had to come face to face with this messed up mindset within me, and as I have done so. This addressing within me this self-absorption within myself has removed the scales from my own eyes. As these scales have been removed from my eyes, there has become a clarity of sight in seeing this aspect within our society.
Especially in LGAT’s such as Klemmer & Associates and their self-absorbed teachings within their seminars and company philosophy taught to participants.
I was one, and now I see the truth.
Scientology = Dianetics which produced founders of EST &
Posted by:
Jack Oskar Larm
()
Date: July 10, 2007 11:59AM
An interesting thing happened in the news yesterday. I can't quote verbatim because the report I saw was on commercial TV (and we know how much depth they cover their stories). Anyway, apparently there was a fatal episode within a family of Scientologists here in Australia. From what I understood, the daughter of this family had been diagnosed with quite severe psychological issues and ended up killing members of her family. I don't know the details (no doubt someone can add more), but the reasoning for her violent outburst was due in part to her parents denying her psyche-drugs (no doubt denying her psychiatric care too).
I thought this was interesting in light of what is being discussed here.
BTW, there must be numerous other similar cases, especially in the US.
I thought this was interesting in light of what is being discussed here.
BTW, there must be numerous other similar cases, especially in the US.
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.