Copied this over from a Landmark thread, just to keep things together. Hope thats okay with you Nutrino.

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nutrino
Senior Member


Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 353

Posted: 06-14-2007 07:00 PM Post subject:

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At present... there has been an overwhelming tendency for "self improvement semiarians"... well above and beyond the Landmarkians, to require the customer (regardless of what language evasion they use to disguise this basic business fact of customer-to-vendor) to sign away as many rights, recourses, and protections as they can induce one to do.

You simply cannot attend most of the popular events, Tony Robbins, Richard Bandler, Landmark, and Lord knows who and what else, without signing one or more releases.... often one release is for recording, such as you on stage with the "trainer" or whatever ends up on a widely distributed DVD, well, you signed off in advance... and the other is, naturally, to absolve THEM of any responsibility for whatever happens to you...

Which sounds somewhere between self contradictory, ridiculous, and malicious depending on the circumstances.

It IS high time that this entire "industry", as they seem to be trying to position themselves.... is subjected to some very close scrutiny at federal and state levels... and they have proven to be masters of the slippery tadpole game of evasion, No.... we aren't a business, we are a religion, except when we are an, ummm, "applied philosophy", well, OK, we do have contractual relationships with our... ummmm..... unwashed masses, err... children... I mean.... customers.... so you can't expect little old us to conform to that big bad regulatory framework....

However.... there presently IS a growing background hum, if you listen closely... to demanding concrete answers..... what, exactly, ARE they teaching, and who, exactly, owns or controls these organizations, and HOW, exactly do they monitor the "unplanned adverse reactions".???... and, best of all, HOW are their trainers trained, and what are their explicit and implicit goals, such as number of enrolees for advanced courses, projects, planes of enlightenment, of whatever...


The best thing anyone can do is to maintain a constant whiff of awareness with one's congressman or congresswoman... find out who your district representative is and write them a personal letter... believe it or not, personal letters that are not obviously part of a canned legislative project do get special attention... they represent the real concerns of real constituents... and slowly but surely they beging to develop into legislative focus....


Demand to know what is up with the LGATs, what their training processes consist of, WHY they believe that those processes are effective, WHAT their stated and unstated goals are, and WHICH large corporations utilize their "products" perhaps rebranded for corporate consumption, WHICH schools are using their materials, and WHAT is the outcome of this ?

I'd love to see a few Rosenbergs attempting standard english before some pointed questioning under oath from a congressional subcommittee....

I have recently read a great book by Louise Samways called "The Dangerous Persuaders" which deals with these issues, and even mentions Landmark, EST etc. I don't know if anyone else has read it, because it is an Australian book, and is sadly now out of print (highlighting the general level of public apathy over this subject if it doesn't directly affect them)
However, a quick search on google should locate you a copy somewhere.

I would like to go into this further adding a few suggestions of my own, but unfortunately I haven't made enough posts to be able to pm anyone yet :roll:

Any lawyers interested in discussing a lawsuit case toward an LGAT??

Good document on law and Mental health.

Here is link.

[www.reidpsychiatry.com]

The Landmark Education corporation is continously sueing people all over the world which have critical views on their website to remove the site or include links to "official material", while some of these material from doctors and psychotherapists are written by Landmark graduates. I know at least two for sure.

But actually, it should be exactly the other way round. Like tobacco advertisements, Landmark should be forced to include warnings (for example a link to the Rick Ross website) to inform people about possible dangers of the courses.

Landmark reaches a critical mass in my country like a virus. It is absolutely scary. Something happened today, that has never happened before: A friend phoned me, that someone else has invited her to Landmark and asked what I think about it. It is a cult I said.
I told her about Landmark 10 years ago, when I was still involved. Using small-world statistics, one could estimate the probability for this event.

I world full of Landmark graduates is a sh ...world. We need to do something.

I do not understand why psychotherapists or other mental health professionals and acedemia do nothing about these cults. So far, I have seen only a few studies.

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MartinH
I do not understand why psychotherapists or other mental health professionals and acedemia do nothing about these cults. So far, I have seen only a few studies.

I second that!

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skeptic

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MartinH
I do not understand why psychotherapists or other mental health professionals and acedemia do nothing about these cults. So far, I have seen only a few studies.

I second that!

I believe its because the ones that have been destroyed from LGAT's like my case with Klemmer & Associates.

We are so overwhelmed that we are not able to communicate to the right people. Nor do we know who the right people are.

I have noticed since I have joined this website a few things. One that is definitely good. There has been a huge awareness of how all LGAT's are carbon copies, and are not as unique as these companies so declare.

I hope that my contribution to this website has been a factor in this discovery. I know it was huge for me to see it for myself in my healing so far from Klemmer in my life.

I still believe we have a untapped path here that will lead to striking a severe legal blow against LGAT's.

I actually see a class action lawsuit against LGAT's in order. We just need to connect the dots with the right law firm, and ex-participants in doing so.

I believe with my circumstances, and the documentation I kept with what I wrote about my attending professional counseling on my registration forms for all Klemmers seminars. I along with many others can address a class action lawsuit against LGAT's as a whole. While maybe establishing a foundation to give the mental health care in our nation a bases to address this LGAT issue by giving them some teeth to bite with.

I know alone and isolated with my portion. There is not enough to go after LGAT's but in combination with all of the ones who have been so harmed.

I see a very solid case from the broader picture versus an individual one here.

I also see it being done on the federal level versus the state level for the most part. Why? Well, let me explain. As you look at Klemmer and it seems other LGAT's operate the same here.

first seminar is in participants state and are held across our nation, and world. The second and third level seminars are held in California. The third, and last seminar is held in Arizona, and the participants state combined over a 6 month process of seminar interacting with other participants and coaching across the nation during seminar.

Which in my opinion, and will need to be discussed with a law firm on this aspect. It is a national issue, and not just a state one here. So, to address and deal with it properly there will need to be the ability to address it at the federal level and the federal judicial system.

Yes, it may take a long drawn out process to do this, as it will probably involve the aspect of going through the state level first. But ultimately it seems it will need to be handled at the federal level where these LGAT's are operating in.

We are in desperate need of a legally savvy person here in laying out the steps to accomplish this task. I am not legally savvy, but I have seen basically this process be used in our history to deal with similar organizations.

For example. I watched a very interesting show on how the Klu Klux Klan was dismantled by the federal government. It was a long and arduous endeavor. But, the same tenacity that was used to dismantle the Klan is needed here.

We just need to find the spot to ignite the political flame in getting the federal government to address it, and begin the investigation process needed to stop them down the road in time.

We need to find the place to begin.