Elena's comments obviously refer to certain types of teenage boys bragging about their conquests, including things like how much the *chick* loved it, blah blah, without mentioning that they paid for it, and the *chick* was probably bored out of her skull.
Maxui, I think you're jumping to conclusions. elena's not slating prostitutes, she's slating boys that lie about using them.
This was elena's first post, that you also took offense at:
How much have you read about Insight, MSIA, and John-Roger? How much do you know about cults? Do you know what a "bliss-ninny" is? Are you saying that a cult "works for you?"
Do some research before you go any farther. Insight is one of the more creepy and abusive cults. Peter McWilliams wrote a very good book about it called "Life 102; What To Do When Your Guru Sues You."
They're all questions. They're not abuse. They even provide references for you. I can see how you might take offense about the bliss-ninny bit, but knowing what a bliss-ninny is is useful, because if you understand that you understand a lot about the effect of lgat processes on body chemistry, how that works in the conversion process, and the fact that its a form of addiction, where things associated with the original processes re-trigger the release of endorphins...etc etc - as elena said, how much research have you done, before jumping in to defend your lgat?
I have given you a lot of basis for a rational conversation, by asking a lot of reasonable questions - but instead of dealing with the issues you've [i:d8f73a9a2f]embroiled yourself [/i:d8f73a9a2f]in name calling. That's something you [i:d8f73a9a2f]can[/i:d8f73a9a2f] take responsibility for.
Questions I've asked are things like:
However my response would not be "*shrug* It worked for me."
That is a massively selfish response and not in line at all with what I got out of the workshops I attended.
For me we are all one (and for rsWinters this is scientifically provable)
and any deliberate loss of life is unacceptable.
Presumably then you would not recommend that anyone attend an LGAT, and if anyone asked your advice you would recommend that they not do it?
Since reading this board and concluding that some sort of pre-screening should be implemented, have you gone back to your workshop leader and asked him to do so?
What kind of pre-screening would you recommend? Are the workshop leaders qualified to assess psychological and psychiatric issues? Would they be willing to use mainstream psychologists and psychiatrists, which their belief system does not approve of?
Brainwashing a person without their consent is a violation of the fundamental human right to freedom of our own thoughts, beliefs and identity.
Let me know if you disagree with that.
You may not be consciously recruiting for your organisation, but you are a walking advert for it. Every time you tell someone your fantastic experience its 'air-time for the lgat'. The main point of lgat training is to brainwash people to think they've had a fantastic time, and then *share* that with others. Since you agree you've been brainwashed - ? Even if you do have positive benefits from it - yes, every con has to have something going for it, at least for a few people.
The bottom line is its con-game, and when people find out they've been conned the normal response is surprise, shock, outrage, embarrassment, sense of betrayal and so forth. Even for those who've had a good experience. That's why its so difficult to take you at face-value when you say you're not part of the organisation - if you see that its a con, and you're still in it - ?? I don't know, maybe for some people it just takes take longer to sink in.
The fact that you claim you're open and trusting here, while not divulging which organisation you're from, doesn't help that. You have told me by personal mail which lgat you are from; maybe that is why I am less aggressive than the others are.
Sadly its true that your initial post and general arguments are "cookie-cut".
Here is another to compare it to:
I graduated from Impact Trainings two years ago. Everyone who attends the trainings had a different result, as I am sure my results are different than anyone else's. I cannot take away form anyone's expereince there and I know some people didn't like it. I did.
I had been seeing a therapist for several years and I gained more insight in myself in those few days at Impact than I did in many hours with her. She saw it too and complimented me on what I had learned and applied in my life.
This training isn't for everyone. It is for anyone who really doesn't like how their life is going and is willing to take a look at themselves and make a difference in how they are living life. The results of my training have allowed me to have a healthy relationship with my gfriend / fiance that wouldn't have been possible before. I treat others better. I learn from my mistakes instead of being hard on myself for making them. I could go on and on about how the training 'Impacted' me.
For those who had a bad experience and have turned to bashing it, also know that there are many many people who have taken the training and made a difference in their own lives.
.... Nobody pressured me to staff, nobody pressured me to get friends and family there.
...one of the largest problems with LGAT's, and you just mentioned it. They don't screen the applicants to choose the ones who are likely to remain emotionally healthy. They will enroll anyone and hope for the best, but possibly use a bit og spin control out when someone has a bad reaction and goes wacky.
Empowering someone who then feels it for the first time can certainly be dangerous. They have no experience in how ot use that empowerment and usually end up misusing it to some degee. I told off my mom after Summit and she didn't deserve it (it did feel good though to stand up to her after so many years of henpecking). The more unstabel a trainee, the more potential they have to go off and do something stuid with their "new found power."
Sorry if that was to tedious to read. There are more, roughly the same for each different lgat, all the same script:
- My experience was great, never mind yours.
- It doesn't work for everyone.
- I was never pressured.
- If anyone had a bad experience its their own fault (blaming the victim)
Can you understand how ... difficult it is to tell one lgat promoter from another, why we get suspicious, why some get bored with dealing with the same questions, and rather say - go do your research, you're a carbon copy?
In this case, you and otter even have the same history - did the training two years ago, shrink didn't cut it for you. And so on.
By the way, are you aware of the links between lgats and scientology? THe common concepts, processes, terminology? What do you think of that?