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Maxui


Perhaps there should be a pre workshop 'test' to see if the participant is ready to face their demons and if not be deferred until they are? *shurg*

anyway back tot he issue of "cult" after looking into this question I came up with an answer that "works for me" :)

If, indeed this is a cult and it produces people (for the most part in my experience) who come out into the world saysing things like " I am Love" or "I am Peace"

sign me up :)

thanks for reading :D

How much have you read about Insight, MSIA, and John-Roger? How much do you know about cults? Do you know what a "bliss-ninny" is? Are you saying that a cult "works for you?"

Do some research before you go any farther. Insight is one of the more creepy and abusive cults. Peter McWilliams wrote a very good book about it called "Life 102; What To Do When Your Guru Sues You."


Ellen

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Maxui

Having said that I do feel sympathy for SaneAgain and others who have had bad experiences.

I propose you feel nothing of the kind. You support a group that uses group-based mental conditioning techniques without the trainees knowledge or consent. You also support a company who produces victims such as Saneagain and many others who exhibit psychotic side-effects and mental disorder as a direct result of dealing with these frauds.

Sympathy? Bah, apathy is more like it. You basically said, "Well, It worked for me, so fu** the rest!" Self-centered, narcissistic brainwashed nonsense.

Hi "Sane Again";
i think that Quest might just be another name for Landmark Education Corporation, or perhaps they are a new type of franchise who bought their "technology" from Landmark?

In any event, i am curious to know if you signed a concent form, and if you have Quest permission to hypnotise you?

Landmark states that people are required to sign a document which they state is a Concent Form, however, at no time do they tell participants, or futute participants that they are going to be hypnotised.

If people chose to sue Landmark/Quest they will most likely have some success on the grounds that while they may have given "consent" it was NOT INFORMED Consent.

People do not believe that it is possible to be brainwashed in four days, but they are wrong. And the brainwashing starts at the very moment that recruits and participants walk through the door.

Landmark/Quest, and all other organizations using these neurolinguistic techniques to coherse people to sign up, and work for free need to be stopped. They also have to be held accountable for the emotional and mental damage that their "technology" has caused.

right on! , exImpact.

Mauxi - i don't believe you. Either you work for Quest/Landmark, or you are living in an alternate reality.

But what is more likely is that you realize that you have been duped, but you need to save face.

As I will tell my friend when she finally "sees the light" (gets her brain back!) is this.
We all feel vulnerable or worthless at some time in our lives. That is normal. - and that is when we are "ripe for the picking" by groups/individuals whom I shall refer to as "bottom-feeders". Quest/Landmark (aka. EST) are a group of extremely unethical people who only care about how much money they can get from you. They use group hypnosis without your knowledge or concent. They rob you of your free will - they are very clever (after all, they have been perfecting their "technology" for the past 40 years!

At first I tried to convince my friend that she had been duped - but the nature of the brainwashing is such that the more you try to make the person realize what has been done to them, the more RESISTANT they will become. That resistance was programmed into their neurotransmitters very early on in the Landmark/Quest training.

If anyone has a friend or loved one whose mind has been bent by these unscrupulous individuals all you can do is wait and hope; if they have a mental breakdown and you can't afford a lawyer, contact your local Member of Parliament or Ombudsman.

These Mind-Benders have to be stopped. They are doing more harm than good, and they are making a fortune doing it!

Good morning.
First some clarity.

I do not work for Landmark or Quest or any other "transformational company" and in fact have not attended a Landmark,Quest or Insight workshop. I deliberately did not mention which workshops I had done because I knew someone would suggest I worked for X or Y. If you want confirmation of this I will gladly forward you my work details in private.


and I am a little shocked at the response to my post.

I put forward my experiences and now I am a liar because it differs from what you experienced?


SaneAgain :*SHRUG* sorry I misspelled it and thank you for not attacking me as some others did here. :)

elena : You don't know me and yet you judge me? I assure you I have great sympathy for SaneAgain and anyone else who has had bad experience with this kind of thing, as I stated in my my initial post this "cult" as you call it has worked for me. and many many others like me - same way shrinks work for many many people and not for others and in fact some people come out of therapy more damaged then when they went in (I speak from experience here) and lets not even get started on the psychosis brought on by legal medication dished out so freely by psychiatrists.

If you want to get nasty I propose that you are just upset that it didn't work for you. perhaps the attitude you display towards others stopped you from "Getting it"? - note the sarcasm.

It is a good 2 years down the line and my life works - sorry .. I guess.
and this is not a fu*k you to SaneAgain or anyone else really
it is a clear statement of fact - for me and many other like me this has worked wonders.

I am not denying that some people should probably not attend these kinds of things because

yes - they are stressful.
yes - you are thrown into chaos
yes - you are forced to face your fears head on.

and some times these things can be too much

Finally I would like it very much if we could continue this debate without name calling and other nastiness.

I joined this forum to contribute and offer my views on things
If this is not what the forum was set up for please let me know and i will leave

thanks

Matt

Elana: please accept my apologies
the comments directed at you in my previous post should have been directed at exImpact.

Matt

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Maxui
Good morning.
First some clarity.

I do not work for Landmark or Quest or any other "transformational company" and in fact have not attended a Landmark,Quest or Insight workshop. I deliberately did not mention which workshops I had done because I knew someone would suggest I worked for X or Y. If you want confirmation of this I will gladly forward you my work details in private.


and I am a little shocked at the response to my post.

I put forward my experiences and now I am a liar because it differs from what you experienced?


SaneAgain :*SHRUG* sorry I misspelled it and thank you for not attacking me as some others did here. :)

elena : You don't know me and yet you judge me? I assure you I have great sympathy for SaneAgain and anyone else who has had bad experience with this kind of thing, as I stated in my my initial post this "cult" as you call it has worked for me. and many many others like me - same way shrinks work for many many people and not for others and in fact some people come out of therapy more damaged then when they went in (I speak from experience here) and lets not even get started on the psychosis brought on by legal medication dished out so freely by psychiatrists.

If you want to get nasty I propose that you are just upset that it didn't work for you. perhaps the attitude you display towards others stopped you from "Getting it"? - note the sarcasm.

It is a good 2 years down the line and my life works - sorry .. I guess.
and this is not a fu*k you to SaneAgain or anyone else really
it is a clear statement of fact - for me and many other like me this has worked wonders.

I am not denying that some people should probably not attend these kinds of things because

yes - they are stressful.
yes - you are thrown into chaos
yes - you are forced to face your fears head on.

and some times these things can be too much

Finally I would like it very much if we could continue this debate without name calling and other nastiness.

I joined this forum to contribute and offer my views on things
If this is not what the forum was set up for please let me know and i will leave

thanks

Matt

Even though I disagree with Matt' post here on many points. He does make a solid point that I am in agreement with.

This forum does go to far to the ohter extreme in judging things.

I am not guiltless, as well as matt is not guiltless as there is not an approach that addresses the damaged folks from these LGAT's such as me.

Yet, I do not want to be as arrogant as this post is being in not addressing the overall impact of LGAT's and looking by declaring how it works for me and thats that.

There needs to be a blend of sharing that allows for all views to be posted, and allowed in a manner for everyone to make a informed decision without being told what to think, or not think.

So, on that note. I agree with matt in part here, and disagree with matt in other parts.

Mainly in how these LGAT's do not screen out participants that are dealing with emotional damage that the LGAT will aggravate and cause the person to self destruct in trying to apply a philosophy that is extremely damaging to a already emotionally damaged person.

I can't go to a place of saying how it would affect a healthy person emotionally.

All I can use is myself as a reference point, and the people that I saw in my 2 year of 3 seminars, and a 4th one that had two mini weekend seminars with a 6 month long enmeshing the beliefs into my daily life to go on.

I did see many other emotionally disturbed people in my experiences in these seminars as well. I saw others making emotionally destructive choices as well during all these seminars.

The LGAT kept grinding in the aspect to only look at myself, and what I was experiencing only.

Which in my opinion was to keep me from being aware of the overall picture of what was happening to participants lives.

So, matt. I am glad it works well for you. Yet at the same time I agree to disagree with you broad statements made about how good an LGAT is just because you are making it work in your life.

But, at the same time. I will also not hound you to the ground in how wrong your view is here.

Readers will read all the posts on this forum and draw there own informed decision after reading them.

Including your posts in support of them.

So, thanks for deceptively manipulating a topic thread where you can turn obvious lean towards a negative judgement against this forum in your attempt to be supporting an LGAT with a very tactfull manner of using the negative on this forum agianst itself as you did here.

Your a sly one. But I have to had it to you. You used the tactic of an LGAT facilitator in doing so.

You speak of slyness and subtlty
a skill you possess in abundance it would seem

the first few lines of your post I was smiling thinking to myself hey - this guy isn't so bad after all - we disagree on a few things and thats normal - if we all agreed we wouldn't need a forum to discuss things.
then it turns out you were baiting me.
lulling me into a false sense of security to then take advantage of me in a most insidious manner

I put it to you that You, my friend, are the cunning one.

can't we all just get along?

also as far as I can remember Leviticus 19:18 "love thy neighbour as thyself"


Practice what you preach my friend. That is integrity and I didn't need a workshop to work that one out.

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Maxui
the first few lines of your post I was smiling thinking to myself hey - this guy isn't so bad after all - we disagree on a few things and thats normal - if we all agreed we wouldn't need a forum to discuss things.
then it turns out you were baiting me.
lulling me into a false sense of security to then take advantage of me in a most insidious manner...

...Practice what you preach my friend. That is integrity and I didn't need a workshop to work that one out.

Seeing your self in a mirror are we?

Funny how you can twist things to your benefit. You must be a skilled communicator that can manipulate people very well...

I will pass on your definition of integrity. It is just another way of saying manipulation of another person...

Your the one who began with being conniving here. Not me.

*sigh*

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

If you feel manipulated I apologise, it was never my intention

Have a good day my friend

Matt