abuse is one subject that seems to
never be brought up in discussion
and people that have been raised
on it believe that it is acceptable.
landmark uses mental abuse on its
clients and calls it a roller coaster
ride.

see how they change the meanings
of the words

in the forum as landmark tears down
your way of thinking in order to
insert their way of thinking they use
abusive tactics.

they get in your face, they scream
sometimes , they tell u that everything
u say and do that is not in accordance
with their way of thinking is a racket.

and because abuse is so rampant in
the united states most everybody
stands aside and says and i quote

"its their right u know"

im not getting much of a response on
my abuse thread.











see what i mean :)

PD,

I rec'd email notification of other posts, but not this one - but if it came the same day as an earlier one, I don't think a 2nd notice is sent. I missed this one.

There was some discussion a while back - if you go to the posts "from the beginning" there is some talk about abuse. Contributors to these threads come and go so many times threads just fizzle out.

The other thing is, behavior that is not obvious physical abuse is oftentimes not recognized as abuse. Emotional and verbal abuse usually doesn't have an impact until the person on the receiving end is out of the situation.

Quote

I'm also wondering if the leader makes the Forum because I've heard such extremes in descriptions of experiences. My leader was offensive, abusive, and such an actor, turning on the tears on cue, that I couldn't take much of what he said seriously. He could also be quite funny, especially after being particularly abusive and all I could think of was "narcissistic sociopath". He was predictable so not a lot of people shared. Even though I couldn't explain how I was being manipulated at the time, I knew I was being manipulated. When I deduct time spent selling Landmark Education, and the staged emotional stuff, it wasn't worth the 0.

I wrote this months ago. However, now I realize the very idea of controlling people to stay put in a physically uncomfortable room, to basically withhold food (oh yeah - they say breaks are every 2-3 hrs - but they were 1/2 hr), and to confront and embarass folks in front of 150, all the while claiming to be experts who are trained to help, is definitely abuse.

more to follow..

thank u, maybe we can give more details
soon as to the psycological abuse tactics,
and i think we need to include the abuse
that people are getting from their families
before they ever get to landmark.

I have been involved with LE for 2 years now. Before that I spent 4 years in an acting conservatory and I can tell you that the exercises we did in school were far more abusive, intrusive, and damading than ANYTHING I have seen in the past two years.
For Example, I had a professor that would SCREAM at me in front of an entire class for the sole purpose of making me feel humiliated (sp) for in order for me to breaktrhough my barriers. I am just saying that the exercises in LE are common exercises in any theare, dance or art class.

I don't want to pick a fight but I do request that you look at that what is abusive to you might not seem at all abusive to anyother person. I take responsibility that LE isn't for everyone and accept people's choice not to participate. I also acknowledge that LE has not always been respectful of that choice.

"in the forum as landmark tears down
your way of thinking in order to
insert their way of thinking they use
abusive tactics.

they get in your face, they scream
sometimes , they tell u that everything
u say and do that is not in accordance
with their way of thinking is a racket.

So do athletic coahces. acting teachers, dance instructors, and you know what it produces results.

Abuse also produces anorectics, bullies, insecurity, and results based on fear, humiliation and the feeling of not being good enough. Just because other people abuse doesn't mean it's okay. Landmark does not make it a point to let prospective attendees know what actually goes on during a Forum weekend. They manipulate with the expertise of sociopaths. There is no place anywhere for abuse, whether it be by coaches, dance\theatre instructors or whatever. When did that become acceptable?

My point is that to me it is not abusive--and you can call me barinwashed but you know what I have a life I love. I love my job. How many of you can say you delight in going to work everyday? I have a relationship with my family that I never dreamed possible. In short, I am thriving because I am being called to be. I was just asking you to consider for some people these exercises and conversations are not abusive. For you they may be but please look at the fact that

Express,

There is no reason to pay to be humiliated. When one enters into an acting class or is on a team, the participant has ways of finding out about the teacher or the coach. LE does not provide that, nor does it give any idea of how the "technology" is carried out. In other earlier posts, I have made it clear that I think perhaps each forum leader is different - they would have to be, as they are human, so your exercises may have not been carried out like mine. What I saw in my Forum was abusive. I had multiple conversations with reps from LE prior to actually going to the Forum and they knew my situation, yet kept very important information from me. Had I not taken the initiative and driven down to the site, I would have been in a dangerous situation as far as my health goes. They also lied about the Forum structure.
The questions I asked before the Forum were specific, yet they lied in their answers. By lying, I do not mean they used their convulted Landmark jargon so I could take the meaning many different ways. They lied outright.

They change their tune when people come back to them after the Forum, when they are in crisis and need answers. LE reps have suggested therapy to other attendees that I know (ass-covering), but during the Forum, they go thru great lengths to criticize therapy as a waste of time ,because they have a quick fix to everyone's problems, and it you don't get it in the Forum, there are oodles of seminars one can take. My leader spent a good hour mocking therapy and the people who go to therapists. But - then claimed he NEVER said DON'T go to therapy. This kind of stuff is bullshit and very confusing to people who may be vulnerable, and probably others.

I think what you need to realize is they do not screen - though they have a lengthy legal waiver as part of their application process - to cover their asses. They love vulnerable people. They can come back and say they were warned, when in fact, they were not. No REAL information is given in their brochure nor on their upgraded website.

Putting people into crisis mode and then into dissociation and denial, which is the only way to get them through the weekend and feeling happy by the end (the emotional rollercoaster - LE knows what it's doing), is abusive.

Accepting humiliation as okay is probably the saddest thing I've ever heard. It's what keeps people in abusive relationships - it's perceived as normal. It becomes acceptable then to abuse others, because others do it. When does it stop?

Dont' be sad for me. You misread what I said I am not being humilated and if you felt that I am sorry.

I guess I was lucky because I knew full well about the interactions therefore nothing shocked me as well as who was leading my forum.

In fact I feel sad for you because you are so angry and seem to dwell in it. I say this not knowing much about you but that is how your post come across.

I joined this site to suggest that not everybody saw things as you did. I understand that was futile.