Re: Choices Seminar - I called for information...they are FRAUDS!!!
Posted by: anonday ()
Date: September 21, 2016 11:40AM

sportsguy44 Wrote:
> and also @anon
> reading your other posts,it seems you doubt and
> question what landmark is and has done to you.
> why defend it if you've already come to grips with
> its malicious intent?

My other posts prove that I'm not the apologist you accuse me of. What you need to come to grips with is that my original post in this thread was not about defending Landmark and more about helping you to see why your aggressive tone is getting you nowhere. I understand you're hurting and are unaware of how you're coming off to people, but you gotta understand that in life, if you want to make progress, sometimes you gotta look at yourself and consider what you can change about yourself to get where you want to go.

And that has nothing to do with Landmark. Take care and best of luck.

Re: Choices Seminar - I called for information...they are FRAUDS!!!
Posted by: GloriaG ()
Date: September 21, 2016 07:59PM

Hi Sportsguy44,

I hear you. And I thought that there was nothing wrong in the questions you asked the receptionist at Choices. They won't be able to answer your questions because your instincts are correct. This is not a good organisation with transparency - where you can check up on the qualifications of their trainers etc.. just you would why you select a therapist to work with.

Have a look at the helpful post from Corboy. He's a stalwart of support on this site. He's been around a long time and continually posts helpful links. I admire his determination to stick up for folks in pain who come here seeking answers.

Good luck in finding the answers you want. And I appreciate its very painful to lose someone you love to a group like this. It hasn't happened to me but it must be very hard.

Landmark Jargon - see if your own LGAT uses it
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: September 21, 2016 10:39PM

Sportsguy44 wrote:


thought I was pretty strong person but now feel stupid and wasteful for falling for her/their tactics and letting it affect my old skeletons, even though I never went.

These LGATs (Large Group Awareness Trainings) have been around for decades.

Which means they have decades of experience in which to hone their tactics. Plus, outsiders are never given honest, full disclosure.

You'd have to have been downright paranoid to have *not* fallen for it. This jargon has the effect of keeping outsiders confused and off balance.

Here are some specimens of the jargon used by Landmarkers.

Specimens - as in put on rubber gloves, a mask, pick up with tongs, place
in a sealed container, preferably lead-lined, with a bio hazard sticker.

Scientology is filled with jargon. Werner Erhard, creator of est/The Forum/Landmark Education, learned a great deal from Scientology.


On this discussion people described the effect this jargon had when others used it on them.



From Wikiversity - a list of Landmark jargonFeel free to write definitions, and sign them with <small>~~~</small>. Feel free, as well, to write brief comments or alternative definitions.

These definitions have not been approved by Landmark Worldwide.

Already always listening.™ Undistinguished pre-existing interpretations that shape, color and influence the way people experience their relationships with people, circumstances, and even themselves. grantlam
Advanced Course. The second course in the "Curriculum for Living."
At effect. Usage is "at the effect of [some circumstance]"; to be a victim of circumstances or dependent upon them for success. See also At cause. Abd
Authenticity.When one is being consistent with how they portray themselves to be with others and themselves. grantlam
Breakthrough.Freeing yourself from some limitation that allows you to achieve immediate and permanent quantum leaps in performance and quality of life. grantlam
Breakdown. A breakdown happens when some possibility, intention or commitment is frustrated, stopped or thwarted grantlam
Complete. When one is complete with any aspect of the past and therefore the past has no constraint on who one is being or how they are acting in the present. In communication, being complete is one being left with no lingering resentments, regrets or "unfinished business. grantlam
Cost. (as used in Rackets™). The impact of one’s reactive ways of being and acting. See also Payoff. Abd edited by grantlam
The costs of rackets™ are love/affinity, vitality/well-being, self-expression, and satisfaction/fulfillment, all of which fall under aliveness. Shinigami Realm
Change. (versus transformation). Change begins with a something that is made different in distance (from here to there), time (from now to then) or form (for example, from a square to a circle). An aspect of the nature of change is that change causes the persistence of the something being changed. grantlam
Curriculum for Living™ The basic Landmark curriculum, which includes The Landmark Forum®, The Advanced Course®, The Self Expression and Leadership Program, and The Landmark Forum In Action Series.
Disappear To "disappear something" is to eliminate it, such as to disappear a complaint. JF, edited by Abd (discuss • contribs)
Distinction. A distinction is a linguistic phenomenon that brings something into being as a presence, for which previously there was no presence. grantlam
Distinguish. To take something from an undifferentiated background and bring it to the foreground. Shinigami Realm
Effect. See At effect.
Enrollment. A kind of sharing that causes a new possibility to be present for another such that they are touched moved and inspired by that new possibility. This is not to be confused with Registration. grantlam
The Landmark Forum. An accelerated learning experience, set up as a guided dialog between the instructor and participants designed to bring about a transformational shift in the participants' effectiveness and quality of life in three days. The first course in the "Curriculum for Living," The Landmark Forum® is the entry point for all Landmark programs. grantlam
Graduate. A person who has completed The Landmark Forum. edited by grantlam
I. What people tend to think of, in its capacity as an identity, as being a collection of characteristics, attributes, and experiences from the past. Shinigami Realm
A pattern of patterns of neurons firing, see Identity. Abd
Identity. A story that we invented about ourselves. The process of inventing an identity began in childhood, as we gradually adopted ways of being and acting to deal successfully with things that didn't quite go the way we thought they should. Abd
Informative learning. Learning that increases what people know and adds to their skills by bringing new knowledge to an existing worldview and frame of reference. Compare to transformative learning. Shinigami Realm
Integrity. Integrity is a condition that is "whole, perfect, and complete," and specifically that one does what one says one will do, when one says one will do it, and in the manner expected, and that one does complete work. When there is a breakdown, "restoring your integrity" means honoring the word given by acknowledging the breakdown, and recommitting -- or withdrawing the promise when it becomes clear that one is not going to fulfill it. Abd
Life, as in "yourself and your life." Our entire set of relationships with people. Abd
Meaningless. "Life is empty and meaningless and it is empty and meaningless that it is empty and meaningless." "Meaning" here refers to invented meaning, this is not an ultimate philosophical or religious declaration but a "distinction," a tool. Abd
Payoff. Payoffs are consequences of behavior that are perceived as rewards, such as Being Right, Making Others Wrong, Looking Good or Making Others Look Bad. See also Cost. Abd
Pop. To transform, like popcorn, in one moment. Much as a kernel's popping is the result of its being heated, the popping is the culmination of transformative learning. A moment occurs when a newly recognized state of being is opened. Shinigami Realm
Possibility. The future does not exist, it's imaginary, but possibilities are real. Real possibilities, that is. The most powerful possibilities arise from nothing. Abd
Power. The velocity with which possibilities are translated into action. Shinigami Realm
Racket.™ A persistent complaint combined with a fixed way of being. Rackets are maintained because of payoffs (see payoff) and persist until dropping the racket (and thus its associated cost) is chosen. Abd
Reality. What we think of as including an objective world that exists independent of us, where cause and effect are key operative factors. Shinigami Realm
Reason. An excuse we invent to justify choices we make. That would be w:Ambrose Bierce's definition. When choices are made according to "reasons," they are distinguished as the "machine" operating, based on assumptions about truth and reality. Genuine choice operates on another level. Reasoning is not denied, but distinguished as rooted in our stories about reality.
Reasonable. Landmark turns these terms on their head. To be "reasonable" is to stick with what is safe, and therefore unlikely to transform life and generate new possibilities. See also Unreasonable. Abd
Registration. See also Enrollment. Acceptance of a request or offered choice. The goal of a "successful registration conversation" is that a person is invited to take some action, and makes a choice, and is satisfied with their choice. While the invited action might be that the person register in a course, the term is used very generally in the training, and most "registration conversations" that are reported are not "Forum registration conversations," except in the Introduction Leader Program, where such are, of course, common.Abd
Resentment. A poison people swallow hoping it will kill the other person.
Self-Expression and Leadership Program. A program that seeks to help participants expand their natural capacity for leadership and express their thinking and ideas effectively in a way that calls forth the alignment, cooperation, and partnership of others.
Speaking into the listening. Speaking experienced as created by the listening, as an interaction, not as the speaker just expressing personal opinion. When a person speaks to the listening, the listener experiences it as if it was their own speech, i.e., "Great minds think alike."
Stinginess. Unwillingness to share anecdotes, thoughts, etc. that would create opportunities for the other participants to learn something.
Story. A "story" is an interpretation or set of interpretations of what happened, providing meaning and thus influencing behavior. Depending on context, the same happening may generate radically different stories. Stories are powerful organizers of experience, developed through language, but also limit us, often severely, when the stories are accepted as real, as "what happened." Human beings tell stories, it's universal, we learn to do this as children, but distinguishing stories from what happened is a crucial Landmark distinction, often liberating in itself. See also What happened. Abd
Strong suit. Special skills developed as a response to early childhood trauma and consequential choices. Strong suits can be excellent tools, but they are not generally transformative when we depend only on them. Strong suits used to be called "winning formulas". Abd
Superstition. The system of ideas, beliefs, social and cultural assumptions, and taken-for-granted conclusions, etc., through which an individual interprets and interacts with the world, other people, and himself or herself. Shinigami Realm
Transformation. A shift in being, not merely a change, but an entry into a new realm. See also Change. Abd
Transformative learning. Learning that gives people an awareness of the basic structures in which they know, think, and act. Compare to informative learning. Shinigami Realm
Unreasonable. An assignment in a course may be to "Be unreasonable!" It means to do something outside the world of routine expectation, to go for results that might be thought impossible. See also Reasonable. Abd
Unreasonable Request. A request that is "unreasonable," that would routinely be avoided as, perhaps, being "too much" or that might be rejected. Examples: my first SELP leader requested that the pizza place across the street give him a free piece of pizza. He was a regular customer. They gave it to him. See Talk for some examples.
Vicious circle.™ When stories are collapsed with what happens, i.e., believed to be what happened, the stories create further stories about stories, leading to deeper estrangement from what happens, leading us to increasingly filter out what is inconsistent with or not related to our stories, and thus miss what is actually happening and possible. We tend to remember dramatic stories more than direct sensory experience. --Abd
What happened. Consensual reality, "objective," aside from judgment, blame, right/wrong, good/bad, and other forms of "meaning." What happens occurs to us as it is analyzed by the Already Always Listening to be good/bad, etc. If my ex-wife told me she had a problem with what I've done, that's what happened. If I say that she was unreasonable, that's my story about it, not what happened. See also Story. --Abd
Terms with "™" are known to be trademarked by Landmark Education.

Definitions to be added[edit]
No agreement
On the court (or in the stands)
Realm of survival/Realm of enrollment
Transform (versus change)
Trump card

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/23/2016 09:19PM by corboy.

How 2 make a Large Group Training back off & leave you alone
Posted by: corboy ()
Date: September 21, 2016 10:45PM



Posted by: The Anticult
Date: October 11, 2010 10:40AM

In terms of the legal contracts they force people to sign before attending a LGAT seminar.
Of course, VERBALLY they say the opposite to the contract.
So a fun thing to do, is to turn the tables.

Write down what they say, and cross out the other parts of the contract.
Have them sit down, and explain every clause in the contract, and if they discount a part, cross it out.

Then tell them you are going to take the contract to your attorney, and then have it notarized with the changes they have said verbally. Get their full legal name, and tell them you will need their signature in the presence of a witness.

You will never hear from that LGAT again.
They want easy targets. They want to hold all the power over you, and will avoid anyone with any knowledge of how the system really works.
Unfortunately, they prey on people who will sign a massive 5-10 page releases, without reading it.

Byron Katie, the zillionaress who created "The Work" reportedly was once
involved with Werner Erhard's Large Group Awareness Trainings.


THere's a vast discussion thread concerning Byron Katie here.


It ran to 294 pages.

Discussions of Byron Katie and of Landmark Education also brought out the largest
number of trolls ever seen on the CEI message board.

The real "Work' Katie and her minions do is to turn your mind and heart into
their personal ATM.

Re: Choices Seminar - I called for information...they are FRAUDS!!!
Posted by: sportsguy44 ()
Date: September 23, 2016 05:47AM

thank you to those who've posted, shared and supported, very much appreciated.

I get confused just trying to understand all of it. I feel a bit like I did when I battled my depression after she dumped me. where as when I met her, I was at the peak moment of my life so far. it's almost like she took these trainings and applied it to herself and mixed it with narcissism and left me an empty she'll if who I am or what I used to be.

Appreciate the conversation, I see out landmark friend still didn't answer any of my questions.

Re: Choices Seminar - I called for information...they are FRAUDS!!!
Posted by: sportsguy44 ()
Date: September 23, 2016 12:51PM

after reading through the terminology, she used alot of these words after she returned up to break up. but I never heard her say these words before attending choices.

wow this have me pleasure and sadness at same time lol knowing now what she really meant

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
This forum powered by Phorum.