I had told my friend about MKP, since I have been through the weekend, and he was researching online, and found this site. It never fails to amaze me how the unknown can create such utter nonsense.

My weekend changed my life so much for the better. I have learned to take the time to slow down, smell the roses, be a wonderful father and partner, and enjoy life to the fullest. I have learned to stop using my head and start listening to my heart.

The morons who say that is "brainwashing" obviously have no idea what MKP is about. The heart is what guides us in relationships, makes us better husbands and fathers and lovers, and allows us to open ourselves to experiencing life to the fullest. This is not a bad thing! However, to people who are "in their heads" it is foreign.

I will never forget leaving my weekend, feeling the amazing amount of caring and love from those men, tears in my eyes because for the first time in my life, I had men who genuinely cared about me. I staffed a weekend a year later, and had tears in my eyes again - this time as I watched these men finally "get" what had been missing from their lives. People can fake almost anything - but I cannot deny what I felt, as both a "New Warrior" and a staffer.

I now live my life to it's fullest and enjoy every second of it as much as possible. Boy, that must be a bad thing if you read this forum.

If you are reading this and are thinking about going on the weekend, please don't let any of this horse crap dissuade you. For those who say that men cannot leave weekends, I have seen three men do it because they judged it "wasn't for them" so that is complete crap. For the lady who wrote about men touching each others' d*cks - I have been in at least 10 sweats up until this point and have NEVER had anyone say anything remotely close to that - FALSE. You can leave this training and never have another thing to do with MKP if you want - I have seen men do that, too. It is your choice what to do with what you get there.

Curious - if MKP is everything you make it out to be, and no brainwashing is taking place, WHY DO YOU THINK that your 'friend' (new recruit) was RESEARCHING MKP? How come your recruit didn't take you at face value? Do you think your recruit thinks that maybe there's more going on than what you are telling him?

If you're a potential recruit reading this, please make sure you that you DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH!

Twillia, I am the woman that wrote that. And no, it is not false. Do you really think you know what goes on at every NWTA weekend? No, you do not. You are so healed and nonjudgemental, yet you call someone else a liar? Yeah, you are one hell of a man with integrity.

You need to work on your judgemental shadows.

And of course, they did not lie to you about why you had to carpool, did they.

How about looking up property values of members, so they know how much pressure to put on a man about donating more money. No, they do not do that.

What about the suicides that have occurred shortly after coming back from NWTA.

What about what goes on in some Igroups. Shaving each other, massaging each other, wearing each others clothes, men holding other men in their laps like a child. These are suggested activities straight out a one of the MKP training manuals. Men having intimate behavior with each other that should, IMO, go on in a marriage or committed relationship, not with other men. And of course, the wives do not have a clue this is going on.

I could go on, but for right now I do not have the time.

How dare you come here and call someone a liar!!!!

What2Do - If you noticed, I did not call you a liar. All I said was that I have been in at least 10 sweats and never once did anyone physically touch anyone else - it's not part of the deal. Admittedly, I could have left out the "horse crap" reference - thank you for calling me on that.

And yes, I have spoken directly with, let's just be conservative and say 100 including my own brother, men who have been through weekends both in my community and other communities and never had any of the experiences you are mentioning. So I'd say if you count that, I could be considered a good source of information.

What2Do, you mentioned suicides after NWTA weekends. I have two responses to that: 1) Please give me documentation of this. Not friend-of-a-friend heresay, but documentation. 2) People have also killed themselves after starting to take antidepressants AND after starting psychotherapy or even being in it for a while. People in both categories are at turning points in their lives a large majority of the time. So should people stop taking antidepressants and stop going to psychotherapists? Wuold it be better to let them die in their own misery?

I can come up with all kinds of facts for things people do after they do anything. I bet there are at least 20 cases of men killing other people, robbing stores, or other things after they, say, go to their psychotherapy session once a week. Statistics can most certainly lie. So the fact that I know not one man who has had any of the things happen to him that are mentioned in this forum is just that - a fact. Your experiences may vary.

Lastly, you mentioned the shaving and laying in the lap subjects specifically. I have never seen the shaving one - I can tell you without a doubt that if shaving was suggested that I do that, I would leave I-Group immediately. I have, however, done the laying in the lap piece, and it is a strong, peaceful, safe feeling. My judgement is that women are alarmed by this, because up until now we relied on them to give us that comfort.

I am truly sad that you have the judgements you have about what I believe to be a phenomenal organization.

Oh, What2Do, I forgot to address your carpooling question. I did not carpool - I went by myself. One of the men who left the weekend early I staffed HAD carpooled - we had a staff member drive him home.

Please give me your rebuttal for that one.

Thanks

HelpUs...

I was referred to the weekend by a respected psychotherapist who's husband is an MKP member. I STILL did my research - as much as possible. My first thought was, is it a cult? Through my research I felt confident that it was not - and I am glad I made the right decision.

Of course people are going to research something like that. I research everything my doctors, therapists, and anyone else says! It's human nature to do so - especially my friend, who is a lot like me.

My judgement is that if we used research as a way to mark something as suspicious, then pretty much everything that exists could be considered suspicious.

Not sure what you were getting at with this one?

What2Do, you wrote: "Do you really think you know what goes on at every NWTA weekend?"

Hmm... Let's think about that for a minute. I'm a MAN, I have personally spoken with and am in contact with conservatively 200 men in MKP including my brother (who also went though), I have been through and staffed a weekend, and been to 4 graduations. I think I'm probably a bit more of an authority on what happens in the training adventure than you are - just a guess.

My judgemental shadow? OK, how about this... If you work on your shadow around judgement of an organization that you know virtually nothing about, I will work on my shadow around judgement of said person when they spout things that they present as data about said organization.

Deal?

Quote

It never fails to amaze me how the unknown can create such utter nonsense.

Welcome to the board Twillia. This has been a very interesting thread. Hope you've had time to read it. Just FYI I looked back through the thread. There have been 8 posters with positive MKP experience. 3 men with negative MKP experience and 6 spouses of men who went through with negative experiences. So I guess the other 4 or 5 people are the uninformed you are referring to. This looks to be a fairly balanced group of those with positive and negative experiences posting. Hopefully we can all learn something from each other[/quote]

Twillia, read your first post. You mentioned what happened in the sweat hut, then you said "False". That to me is the same as calling me a liar. I don't care how many men you spoke with, it happened. Lucky for our marriage, my husband was going to continue with MKP and the Igroup. That one incident completely turned him off.

I never said you have to carpool. I would guess you were requested to carpool like everyone I have spoken to. My husband was told there was no parking, so it was necessary. Yet, when he arrived there was a large field that would have held every car driven. That started his weekend of with a lie. A lie from a group espousing integrity.

Yes, two men also left on his weekend. No one offered to drive. They had to ask relatives to drive over a hundred miles to pick them up. I have never said anyone was forced to stay. However, they make it very difficult to leave. If a person was the driver, he would have to leave the men he brought to find a way home.

One suicide I heard about was a friend of a friend situation. The other I personally spoke with a family member. I have agreed to complete confidentiality, so I am bound by my word to not speak of it. I can only tell you the details are horrific, and, IMO point directly to MKP.

If you are comfortable with laying in another man's lap, so be it. I find it rather creepy myself.

You did not address the massage. I think the massages are done in the nude, as most massages are. Again, these men are not professional, and I also find this creepy.

You did not address the fundraising tactics. Where is the ethics and integrity in this?

There is another forum hosted by a former MKP member. He was a member for 3 years. He now hosts a talk forum to help members and their families who have been harmed by MKP. He tells stories of men calling their wives "f*cking bitches" in I group. I have heard of other men telling similar stories. And this behavior is to make a man a better Husband. Duh!

If you are happy with them, good for you. That is not the case with everyone. How does your wife feel about you being held by another man. Oh, I forgot, you cannot tell her of your intimate moments with other men. Since she probably knows nothing of what really goes on, she is probably happy that you are happy.

I wonder how she would feel about the nude dancing, passing of the dildo, cock talk where sexual behavior is discussed, intimate behavior normally reserved for a loved one being done with strangers. But, if you are like most MKP, she will never know.

I think your secret life with MKP is a betrayal of your marriage. I believe your first loyalty of sharing, intimacy, and honesty should be with your spouse. MKP wants to be first in your life. And it sound like they have gotten your loyalty. Each to their own.

I believe most women would be completely shocked if they took the time, like I did, and investigated what really goes on. I went to his graduation. There were not pictures of men naked. None of the leaders spoke of how profound the cock talk was. They did not have the dildo on display. IMO, there would not be many men joining, if the wives knew all of this.

I normally do not post angry. However, your first post stating what I said was "False", really pissed me off. And no, I do not need to work on any shadows. If you want to hear what others have to say that may not be favorable to MKP, fine. You can take it or leave it. No one is trying to change your opinion of them. But do not call me a liar.

Yes Twilla1 ...... Trust your Brother, Trust your Brother,
Are you married or have a girlfriend? If you are then you are a deceitful liar! Flat out! Not telling is the same as Lying! For instance I go to the bar with my girlfriend , Meet a Handsome Guy who starts to buy me drinks, then I dance with him all night long, then hop a ride with him to the next club and maybe give him a goodnight kiss and come home to my Husband who is waiting up and when he asks how was your night with the girls, I say great! We had a wonder night! And leave it at that. Then I would be a great MKPer! When you feel the need to leave something out or don't revealed what went on just because nobody ask or say I swore to my girlfriend not to tell! So I give minimal details, this would mean you are hiding something or lying!

If not and your gay, (which is fine if your gay)
then I guess that weekend would change your life, and you would just love the laying your head on the lap thing! The whole male bonding thing! Friends for those who have none! Pretty much makes you feel you do have friend, who will do anything for you! Yeah right!

Its funny how your listening to your heart can justify in your mind all the lye's. Being a new warrior and staffer, I would think would give anybody a rush because you get to be in charge! The Big shot! The Healer! The one who all the newbies listen too! The Messenger! Boy who would not be on cloud 9?
(Funny how all these MKPers like to play THERAPIST! LIFE COACH, WITH NO QUALIFICATIONS! Must Makes them feel powerful! Ever wonder why the shadows never end and there are always more therapy exercises?
Oh, bty sleep deprivation, And waking men up in the middle of the night, causes disorientation and lack of thinking skills! (Kind of cultish!)
Waking to beating drums, (rhythmic drumming is to put you in a numb state of mind and keeps you from focusing on your own thoughts! (Kind of Cultish!)
limited food with no protein (Not good for thinking skills, but that is pretty much what the MKP to want, so you just go with the flow! (Kind of .............)

Also talk to Dad on this forum, his son is one of the MKPers who left the MKP and committed suicide! And why would you compare psychotherapy or antidepressants if so many Mkpers think it is not a therapy group?

Oh, the whole comfort thing is a bunch of crap! Your father can give you hugs and you wife! I have never had a problem with my Dad or the Men in my life,
giving my brothers or brothers in laws affection and have never had a problem with witnessing their affection or showing their emotions!
The men in my life don't rely on women to give them comfort! We just give it more, because we are just that Women, with woman hormones, just like in the cave man days!
That is just a line that the
MKP want you to think!
I guess up until now I should throw the thought of Men make women feel safe out the window?
Because just like the women and the comfort thing! Its the fact that Men do make us feel safe, because you have Testosterone and thus you are stronger! But hay, up until now, I guess we should start applying your ways and no longer feel that men give us security !

Because that isn't that how we were taught to believe?

The women are alarmed because the MKpers feels its ok to get comfort from a bunch of guys you barley even knew. Not to mention think its ok? I guess next time I go out I am going to lay my head in some mans lap, whom I don't even know (of say I have spoke to him 10 times)
and tell him how I feel, then never mention this it to my husband and if he finds out then oh well, he should not have any problems with this right? I mean what is good for the goose! I can tell you this would never never fly with you men!

Do you think the I groups would let you come over to their house, if you did not belong to the MKP anymore?
I mean this is once a guy you trusted right? Should make know difference right?
Funny how the MKP tell men that women love powerful men, yet much of what they do is sooooo weak and un powerful! Probably a turn of to most women!
Next you'll be playing dress up in woman's clothes, which is ok, if your a cross dresser!

We Virtually know much about the MKP here, you don't have to have gone threw it to know about it! The posters that are women here have gotten the information threw MKPers who quit, or our husbands and they nothing to gain by revealing what happened to them thus making it credible! These men have more integrity than those who are still involved with the MKP!
These men have figured out that a lie is a lie is a lie! And to come forth and share this shows their strength!

I agree with what to do, I don't like to get nasty with the post, but the simple fact that you feel its ok to be a liar yet call somebody else one makes is for one to go off on!