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Firethorne
Interestingly, I think the whole purpose of these "Boards" could use a thorough re-examining by all of its users. My take thus far (and this is true of most of the net - not just here) is that nobody is convincing nobody. The anti-MKP folks cannot be convinced that MKP is anything other than what they think it is, and the pro-MKP camp continues to try to prove that despite some warts, they are not contributing to the ultimate downfall of society and marriage.

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Nobody seems to be listening and everyone appears to be talking.

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Nobody wins. Nobody.

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MKP will always be Evil.

MKP will always be Good.

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ginah
I guess I do not understand the ??lack of respect?? for these forms of therapy by people. This is not a great example but as close as I can think of. It seems to me, that allowing men or women, who have no real training in these therapies to "play with your mind", would be like going to a "Dr." who has had a weekend workshop to do surgery on you. Would you let someone who is not licensed to "diagnose", "do surgery" etc on you? If not, why would you let someone who is not licensed to "diagnose, "do surgery (emotionally), etc on you? Going and talking to your friends is not the same. The NWTA weekend obviously (per what I have read and per what my husband has told me), has men doing some very intense therapy with each other. I would be afraid to have someone not trained doing these forms of "therapy/education" on me as it seems it could be detrimental to your health.

If I am wrong with this thinking please let me know as I am trying to understand MKP better so I can be more supportive of my husbands needs. He has become much more "himself" and is no longer abusive as he was the first couple months after his NWTA weekend. We have talked much about this and his thinking is that he was going through a form of a "learning curve". In a way this makes since to me but still feel some
?confusion/pain/anger? in regards to his emotional status that first couple of months.

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ginah
Thank you Anidawehi for replying. I kind of thought that was the case but was not for sure and did not know how to put it into words. Now, with education such an issue within this country, I still don't get how MKP can legally "claim" to be educational when they are clearly doing therapy work. Seems like a loophole within the therapy vs educational laws.

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Anidawehi

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ginah
What makes MKP Educational instead of Therapeutic? Are their certain guidlines that has to be followed to be regarded as Therapeutic instead of Educational? Is it just MKP making that judgement? I would be interested in further understanding the distinction between the two. Especially, as for me, when I read their manuals it points me in the direction of MKP being Therapeutic more than Educational.
Thank You

I agree, ginah. It certainly appears that mkp is doing so pretty intense therapy based on Jungian and Gestalt theories. However, in order for the group to claim that they are doing therapy, they must go through a licensing and accreditation process, and they simply do not have the training to do so.

Now, I'm not a therapist, but my hubby is, and this is the issue to the best of my recollection. The mkp leaders themselves would all have to get clinical psychology or social work degrees and take the state licensing test and pass it to become licensed to claim to do therapy. Further, the mkp organization would have to go through the state (and sometimes local) mental health accreditation boards to ensure that they are meeting the minimum requirements for safe and ethical mental health treatment (and that their records are indicating proper diagnosis, treatment, and after-care). Also, psychiatrists must review and sign off on all treatment done by therapists without an independent licensure, which takes at least a graduate degree, about 5 years of supervised treatment, and another test.

Even though some mkp leaders may have mental health backgrounds, they cannot meet the rigors of state licensure and accreditation to legitamize their "treatment." Thus, the mkp could be held legally (thus, criminally) liable for claiming any sort of therapeutic benefit, as they do not have the credentials to be engaging in mental health therapy. Thus, they must label what they are doing as "educational," as anyone with a knowledge of something can educate another on whatever it is they may know (or think they know). However, as an educator with an advanced degree, I find this problematic, as the mkp should also be skilled in proper educational techniques if they truly believe what it is they are teaching and want to do a good job at it (and I mean training done by licensed educators, not just in-house training). And I don't recommend this just for mkp, but any others who plan on educating others. And my first recommendation for mkp is to recognize that a one-size-fits-all LGAT approach is not the most effective way to educate--nor does it promote independent and critical thinking. Any educational model research in the last 30 years will tell them that. So perhaps mkp needs to do more research on effective educational techniques? ;-)

Thanks for your question. mkp's slippery rhetoric here goes unnoticed by many.

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Anidawehi
Actually, I think that some true "rigorous," "honest," and "civil" (in your words) debate is going on here--maybe not in every post, but in many. For instance, FrankD and I have been debating for a week or two and he has actually made me re-think my position on several points, has helped me to fine tune my points, and has changed my opinion on several points. (For example, in my last post, I admitted that I do not think the mkp is "preoccupied" with money (as I now understand the word "preoccupied" to mean. In fact our discussion led me to look up the word in the first place. Consequently, as a by-product of this discussion, he reminded me that it's diffucult to make logical claims based on words we may fully understand. So thanks FrankD! :))

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Jwills
Mankind project is a non-profit asscation so of course it books are open for the public to see by law. I know the houston divison is not making millions LOL!!!

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Jwills
To talk a little about the cost i paid 100.00 and got the rest scholarshiped because i could not afford the training.

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Jwills
We have no "leaders" that tell us what to do"

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Jwills
There are only 30000 men on the planet that have done this training. Any person can leave at anytime and some do and thats thier choice and I respect that.

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Jwills
I probably wouldnt belive me though I am under intense mind control!!!!
and y LEADER told me to send this!!!

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Jwills
Honestly check the books out you'll see the millions that are made!!!!

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ginah
Jwills, I was wondering how you feel about the basic lies of omissin that MKP uses when recruiting new members and how you consider this as being an honest person in your life?