Re: Werner Erhard's library 1970s -- quoted frm former volunteer
Posted by:
kdag
()
Date: October 06, 2016 08:52AM
Yes ~ this precision in speech was notable in some of the people I knew from there. One of the things that struck me the most was that I would have to listen very carefully for what they would NOT say. This would frequently tell me more than what they did say.
If I tried to pin them down and question them, I would get the run-around, non-answers, redirects, be accused of being paranoid, and they always pointed out to me how messed up MY thinking was. They would then proceed to do exactly as I had suspected and feared in the first place. This is a pretty typical behavior of narcissists.
If I tried to pin them down and question them, I would get the run-around, non-answers, redirects, be accused of being paranoid, and they always pointed out to me how messed up MY thinking was. They would then proceed to do exactly as I had suspected and feared in the first place. This is a pretty typical behavior of narcissists.
Language in Action by S.I. Hayakawa - Werner musta read this
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 31, 2016 08:52AM
Corboy dares wonder whether one author that could have given Jack Rosenberg (aka Werner Erhard) some inspiration was Ayn Rand (Objectivism, The Fountainhead, Atlas Shrugged.) Ayn Rand gave a lot of moral support to ambitious entrepreneurs who regarded themselves as superior beings and were impatient of moral and social restraints.
This is merely a hunch.
Corboy makes another guess that Rosenberg/Erhard read a book that was known and celebrated decades ago but is relatively little known today: Language in Action, later updated to Language in Thought and Action by S.I. Hayakawa.
This book introduced concepts from General Semantics to the general public and made
those concepts accessible. Korcyzbski created General Semantics and published Science and Sanity in 1933. Korcyzbski was convinced that the general public needed to learn how to understand language and communication at a deeper level; Hayakawa's book made Korcybski's work accessible and appealing to the general public.
Language in Action has has 5 successive editions and has never been out of print. With his avid interest in language and social influence, Werner Erhard, who kept a prized copy of Dale Carnegie's book 'How to Make Friends and Influence People' very likely read Hayakawa's book as well. And perhaps made it his business to go further and study Korcyzbski as well.
Now, remember that Werner Erhard called the first version of his LGAT est,
which means "it is" in Latin.
Here is an excerpt from an article on General Semantics. This is quoted at length as it may be helpful for anyone exposed to Werner Erhard's indoctrination system.
THe full text can be read here:
[communication.ucsd.edu]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2016 09:55PM by corboy.
This is merely a hunch.
Corboy makes another guess that Rosenberg/Erhard read a book that was known and celebrated decades ago but is relatively little known today: Language in Action, later updated to Language in Thought and Action by S.I. Hayakawa.
This book introduced concepts from General Semantics to the general public and made
those concepts accessible. Korcyzbski created General Semantics and published Science and Sanity in 1933. Korcyzbski was convinced that the general public needed to learn how to understand language and communication at a deeper level; Hayakawa's book made Korcybski's work accessible and appealing to the general public.
Language in Action has has 5 successive editions and has never been out of print. With his avid interest in language and social influence, Werner Erhard, who kept a prized copy of Dale Carnegie's book 'How to Make Friends and Influence People' very likely read Hayakawa's book as well. And perhaps made it his business to go further and study Korcyzbski as well.
Now, remember that Werner Erhard called the first version of his LGAT est,
which means "it is" in Latin.
Here is an excerpt from an article on General Semantics. This is quoted at length as it may be helpful for anyone exposed to Werner Erhard's indoctrination system.
THe full text can be read here:
[communication.ucsd.edu]
Quote
E. A reduction of the principal problem: the 'is' of identity.
The central criticism directed by General Semantics against most theories of language and meaning, and in particular against what it terms most metaphysical or Aristotelian epistemological systems, is what it calls the "is" of identity. Metaphysical systems argue that an invisible, immaterial order of forces, essential properties, qualities, and characteristics organize the material world, including human beings, entailing that any scientific system can, if it properly takes hold of this system, describe the material, physical world phenomena and human beings. Against this position, General Semantics argues that there is no singular, essential meaning to these objects. Unlike phenomenology, however, General Semantics does not collapse the distinction into, for example, the reductive method of describing appearances, becoming, etc. Rather, it posits that an objective reality exists in its vast spatial and temporal heterogeneity - the objective world at one particular moment in one particular place is never the same as in another moment or particular space. While the objective world is constantly shifting, the "verbal world" (which we can call the world of cultural production - of the uniquely human world of fabrication, tool use, etc) can shift and remain the same. Humans are "time-binding" creatures insofar as what they produce - "culture" - persists through time. However, to maintain a one-to-one relationship between a somewhat enduring cultural world and a constantly-in-flux objective world can lead, in the parlance of General Semantics, to serious semantic disturbances - that is, a non-alignment between the structure of the world and the structure of our language (or culture).
It is this situation that produces the categorical error of the "is" of identity. General Semantics is not against all uses of the verb 'is'.. However, it is against the subject-predicate form of the verb "is" when its use seeks to ascribe an essential quality to some object, phenomena or thing in reality. More specifically, it is against uses of the verb "is" when it is used to affirm prior inferences about the world to new events, happenings, and phenomena. General Semantics, in other words, is against the facile routinization of thought and the habitual ascription of meanings to novel experiences - and language is a principle medium for such routinization and habitualization. "The 'is' of identity," says Korzybski, "forces us into semantic disturbances of wrong evaluation." (409) Because humans are abstracting creatures - they generate orders and orders of abstractions of things, from the most general to the most specific - the "is" of identity fallacy operates in confusion of orders: "If we are not conscious of abstracting, we must identify - in other words, whenever we confuse the different orders of abstractions, unavoidable if we use the 'is' of identity, we duplicate or copy the animal way of 'thinking,' with similar 'emotional' responses."(410)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2016 09:55PM by corboy.
Re: Language in Action by S.I. Hayakawa - Werner musta read this
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: October 31, 2016 09:56PM
I heartily recommend Language in Thought and Action to anyone who wants keep their minds nimble and alert. It is a terrific gift for students from 9th grade onwards, all the way to graduate school and beyond; it is just as useful for someone who wishes to be an effective instructor in any setting in any capacity.
And, this same book is likely to be helpful if you are recovering from Landmark Education, est, The Forum, Lifespring, Siddha or SYDA yoga or any other workshop, job training, retreat or "spiritual" event that leaves you feeling that something does not feel right.
To whet your appetite, Wiki Quotes has some selections from
Language in Thought and Action here:
[en.wikiquote.org]
Read the book and you will get a blazing good tutorial on how to think **about** language. You will also get an in depth look at how language can and has been used against us-- and how to keep this from being done to you.
You may also be able to recognize some of Werner Erhard's tricks.
By writing Language in Action, Hayakawa gave an influential and publicly accessible description of General Semantics, a theory created by Korcyzbski.
[www.google.com]
[www.google.com]
K's work has had an influence on those who developed neurolinguistic programming.
[www.google.com]
Clumsy citizen hunch by Corboy
Listen to the jargon used by Werner Erhard's disciples. Read their motivational
writings. Then remember that you are not inside the physical and social context
designed and controlled by Erhardian crowd managers.
It is not just the verbal context of Erhardianism that packs the punch; Erhard understood that the importance of creating a specialized social and physical context.
Hayakawa's book shows readers the importance of context in determining the meaning
we assign to words. Prior to Erhard, Marshall McLuhan famously stated "the medium
is the message."
Marshall McLuhan and Korcybski shared some common ground.
[www.google.com]
Erhard's genius was in recognizing that that physical setting, tightly regulated and to eliminate distractions from distractions, escapes most most people's scrutiny, yet places us in context which greatly enhances the LEC message by acting subliminally upon our bodies.
This Erhardian context, which many other LGATs have appropriated, does not
at first glance, look unusual.
It does not excite alarm.
It looks like an ordinary auditorium or seminar.
What is concealed is a physical arrangement that is a necessary ingredient
for Erhardian indoctrination.
A special context -- the context -- the context that is needed for
changing subjects' language in thought and subjects' language in action to
Erhardian thought and Erhardian action.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2016 09:50PM by corboy.
And, this same book is likely to be helpful if you are recovering from Landmark Education, est, The Forum, Lifespring, Siddha or SYDA yoga or any other workshop, job training, retreat or "spiritual" event that leaves you feeling that something does not feel right.
To whet your appetite, Wiki Quotes has some selections from
Language in Thought and Action here:
[en.wikiquote.org]
Read the book and you will get a blazing good tutorial on how to think **about** language. You will also get an in depth look at how language can and has been used against us-- and how to keep this from being done to you.
You may also be able to recognize some of Werner Erhard's tricks.
By writing Language in Action, Hayakawa gave an influential and publicly accessible description of General Semantics, a theory created by Korcyzbski.
Quote
Korcybski contended that human knowledge of the world is limited both by the human nervous system and the languages humans have developed, and thus no one has direct access to reality. The most we can know of reality is that which is filtered through and modified by is filtered through the brain's responses to reality including the language and words we use.
Korcyzbski's best known dictum is "The map is not the territory".
[www.google.com]
[www.google.com]
K's work has had an influence on those who developed neurolinguistic programming.
[www.google.com]
Clumsy citizen hunch by Corboy
Listen to the jargon used by Werner Erhard's disciples. Read their motivational
writings. Then remember that you are not inside the physical and social context
designed and controlled by Erhardian crowd managers.
It is not just the verbal context of Erhardianism that packs the punch; Erhard understood that the importance of creating a specialized social and physical context.
Hayakawa's book shows readers the importance of context in determining the meaning
we assign to words. Prior to Erhard, Marshall McLuhan famously stated "the medium
is the message."
Marshall McLuhan and Korcybski shared some common ground.
[www.google.com]
Erhard's genius was in recognizing that that physical setting, tightly regulated and to eliminate distractions from distractions, escapes most most people's scrutiny, yet places us in context which greatly enhances the LEC message by acting subliminally upon our bodies.
This Erhardian context, which many other LGATs have appropriated, does not
at first glance, look unusual.
It does not excite alarm.
It looks like an ordinary auditorium or seminar.
What is concealed is a physical arrangement that is a necessary ingredient
for Erhardian indoctrination.
A special context -- the context -- the context that is needed for
changing subjects' language in thought and subjects' language in action to
Erhardian thought and Erhardian action.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2016 09:50PM by corboy.
Re: Language in Action by S.I. Hayakawa - Werner musta read this
Posted by:
kdag
()
Date: November 01, 2016 11:41PM
corboy,
I think you hit the nail on the head with language being key. By redefining every word, they can seemingly make certain concepts less offensive to their adherents than they would be to the general population.
I have a somewhat different take on Ayn Rand. She certainly lacked empathy but, from what I remember reading, she was a rugged individualist. LE is full of group think, which she would have abhorred.
I did not agree with everything she wrote, (it's been 30 years since I read it), but as I recall, she wanted people to think for themselves, as opposed to LE, which seems to want just the opposite.
It is unfortunate that cults have sprung up in almost every type of religion and spiritual path. I have tended toward the metaphysical since I was 12 years old, and know many metaphysical types. The majority keep it to themselves, and don't try to convince other people of anything, let alone try to recruit. This would go against the general philosophy of most. These are not the ones who make the news, (most Muslims never make the news, either).
I think you hit the nail on the head with language being key. By redefining every word, they can seemingly make certain concepts less offensive to their adherents than they would be to the general population.
I have a somewhat different take on Ayn Rand. She certainly lacked empathy but, from what I remember reading, she was a rugged individualist. LE is full of group think, which she would have abhorred.
I did not agree with everything she wrote, (it's been 30 years since I read it), but as I recall, she wanted people to think for themselves, as opposed to LE, which seems to want just the opposite.
It is unfortunate that cults have sprung up in almost every type of religion and spiritual path. I have tended toward the metaphysical since I was 12 years old, and know many metaphysical types. The majority keep it to themselves, and don't try to convince other people of anything, let alone try to recruit. This would go against the general philosophy of most. These are not the ones who make the news, (most Muslims never make the news, either).
Re: Language in Action by S.I. Hayakawa - Werner musta read this
Posted by:
corboy
()
Date: November 02, 2016 07:45AM
In Language in Thought and Action, Hayakawa tells us that we are not directly taught the definitions of most of the words we use.
We learn most of our vocabulary by hearing and then reading words used in their usual contexts.
We acquire much of our working vocabulary in this way, by osmosis. This is why
the best language training courses include 'immersion' -- students live for
extended periods surrounded by native speakers of the language they want to learn.
When asked, each of us may define a given word or set of compound words slightly differently, but
most of the time there is enough of an overlap that we use language and successfully communicate.
Werner Erhard found a way to use this against us. He created a new context
for the abuse of language but made it resemble an ordinary teaching situation.
An LGAT looks reassuringly normal. It doesn't have gaudy flags, massed military marching in goose step.
The real action upon subjects is invisible but no less effective.
Effective enough that a lot of Landmark trolls arrived on the Rickross dot come message board and continue, now and then, to visit CEI today.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2016 09:53PM by corboy.
We learn most of our vocabulary by hearing and then reading words used in their usual contexts.
We acquire much of our working vocabulary in this way, by osmosis. This is why
the best language training courses include 'immersion' -- students live for
extended periods surrounded by native speakers of the language they want to learn.
When asked, each of us may define a given word or set of compound words slightly differently, but
most of the time there is enough of an overlap that we use language and successfully communicate.
Werner Erhard found a way to use this against us. He created a new context
for the abuse of language but made it resemble an ordinary teaching situation.
An LGAT looks reassuringly normal. It doesn't have gaudy flags, massed military marching in goose step.
The real action upon subjects is invisible but no less effective.
Effective enough that a lot of Landmark trolls arrived on the Rickross dot come message board and continue, now and then, to visit CEI today.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2016 09:53PM by corboy.
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