Hello,

I have witnessed loving support and a great deal of intelligence in these forums. It's very impressive.

I am wondering what I can replace Landmark with? Any pointers?

I attended the Forum a month ago because I wanted to have a breakthrough about why I am so darned lazy in life. I feel if I stopped being lazy, I would have friends, a romantic relationship and money.

I like the other people who are attending the 10-session follow-up seminar. For someone who has been so socially isolated, and felt so problemed in life, it feels really nice to casually know a lot of people who are supportive of me getting my life together, even if they're just acquaintances.

I am also a big fan of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy concepts. Funny how Landmark doesn't ever refer to the small parts of their philosophical patchwork by name, since then you could research it by yourself -- and that's dangerous to their business model.

I have never accepted the Absurdist philosophy presented by Landmark. I still have my meaning in life intact! I'm fortunate to have meaning.

I doubt they are true absurdists. It's a lie. Now I realize they probably want everyone to have no meaning in life, so they can replace that meaning with pro-Landmark activity. And claiming absurdism also lets the organization off the hook for a myriad of tricks.

I have not invited anyone ever. When asked, I say, "I've made a prior committment to let my life speak for itself." :)

I have not volunteered. I'm lazy, remember. But volunteering in a for-profit organization is ridiculous! From reading many of your posts (containing personal experience), it seems a lot of damage is done in the ILP.

Other tricks I've picked up on...

They proclaim integrity, but it's mainly used by them to get you to make pro-Landmark commitments / control you.

They proclaim personal responsibility if something goes wrong in your life, but if something goes well, they want to claim credit. It's all because of your participation in Landmark.

So, thank you all for enlightening me. I now realize no seminar will solve my problems. But I still have problems. What-do?

Define lazy or explain why you think you're lazy, please. I have the sneaking suspicion you are not.

Why not volunteer for a nonprofit?

Remember, many of the people you met at Landmark are trying to comply to Landmark's rules and not necessarily trying to support you in getting your life together. They just don't want to be humiliated by Landmark if they get caught thinking for themselves.

LEC is clever at inculcating a sense of obligation, a sense of craving where before you would not have had that sort of craving or sense of obligation.

LEC is parasitic. Its like asking "What can I replace my tapeworm infestation with?"

Tapeworms dont contribute to your health. Instead, they drain nutrients from the host.

The only people who seem to benefit from LEC are persons who already have wealth and social skills and would probably have been just as successful without LEC. Only thing LEC gives is a shared jargon, and then its only beneficial for persons who have surplus financial and social resources to begin with.

You do not owe LEC one single thing.

Remember you paid LEC several hundred bucks, otherwise you could not have attended that seminar.

You gave up your privacy and put personal info on the form and perhaps discussed very private and intimate things about your life.

Did the people who ran that seminar tell you anything about what measures they would take to safeguard all these private and personal things you disclosed?

They owed you protection of confidentiality. Did they tell you that and disclose how your confidential info would be protected? In the fiduciary professions (law, medicine, psychotherapy, accountancy) there are stringent laws covering how records not only should be kept but what protections must be given to safeguard clients confidential information--firewalls for websites, file protection, use of secure shredding facilities when out of date records are disposed of, etc).

At the very least, in addition to paying that money, you gave up a whole weekend. You may also have had to pay for parking your car, which some cities is not cheap.

Hope (who has been through LEC herself) is right. Volunteer for a nonprofit. Better yet, do something you enjoy that can also serve others.

LEC wants to earn a profit through getting people who have already paid to attend those seminars by donating their free labor, and working until they drop from exhaustion or until they have annoyed or driven away their friends and family members.

Thellis,

I might add that I pestered them for and received a full refund because they did not deliver.

Thellis,
Several years ago I had the opportunity to take a Dale Carnegie training course- Effective Communications and Human Relations. This 12 week course had a profound effect on me by boosting my confidence and increasing my motivation. I saw the same effect on many of my classmates who were very reserved in the beginning but bloomed by the end.
There was no requirement to recruit friends and family or pressure to take additional courses. I also learned many practical techniques and methods that I still remember and use to this day.
The course is expensive and I admit that my attendance was sponsored and paid for by my employer. Anyway just a suggestion since you were asking for an alternative to help you with your life.
Good Luck

Thanks for the responses, everyone!

Hope, how do you recommend I request a refund?

Seeking1978, thanks for the recommendation. I've found the course and bookmarked it for future reference. I intend to take it.

[forum.culteducation.com]

I had trouble with the empty and meaningless part of the Forum too. I gave myself freedom to do what I want after the Forum - surrendered to myself and myself only. For about 3+ years, I did the worst imaginable things to my marriage.

I did this before the Forum too, albeit at a slower pace and more covertly and less brazenly. After the Forum, I lost all regard for my commitment to my wife and did anything I could get away with, and got away with a lot.

That was my initial impression of 'empty and meaningless.' In the ILP, all I found out is that nothing changed and that I was still the same asshole I was prior to it. I refused to surrender to another person, and had it my way, all the way. You don't like my way? Take the highway!

Nothing while I was doing Landmark helped me surrender. Maybe I "did it wrong". What did work, is giving my life over to God. People have many Gods, so to be specific, Jesus Christ. Only then I began to experience power and repentance from my sinning.

Landmark did nothing but show me that I could remain an asshole and be fine with it my entire life. Maybe if I had actually gone through with the ILP as it was intended to, I would have experienced something else, but I botched that too. Probably on purpose, as I did everything else. Surrendering to their way of being... at the time, didn't seem to be the right calling for me.

My suggestion is that you begin to replace Landmark with being an authentic Christian. That will take you to where you want to go - probably not in the way you want to, but it will, if you are willing to surrender to Christ. This can be even more challenging than a Landmark course, I warn you, however, it will be at a pace that you can handle. In my view, after you do the Forum and the Advanced Course, you should -run- to the church and look there for solutions to your issues on tried and tested truths that have not changed for eons. Use your Landmark "knowledge" to comprehend the Judeo-Christian value system and start to surrender to it. Only then will you experience freedom, real freedom, meaning and purpose, for even such blessings come from God.

I suggest against asking for a refund - not because they won't give it to you, but because you will trade whatever you got out of the Forum - however negative the experience was for you - for your old life. Remember, you signed up for it willingly, while thinking of a specific issue you want to address. Sometimes we have to go through the "negative" before we get to the "positive" side of things. If there was something that was bugging you prior to the Forum - that is what will show up the minute you ask for the refund in your life, with even more intensity this time around though, and won't let you be. You may feel relieved if you got your money back - which they will give you back, but you will be trading that for your old life, old issues, prior to walking into the Forum.

At least now you are a step ahead of where you were in dealing with life's issues - whatever those are for you... and I suggest you surrender to God instead of Landmark Education from now on, for all solutions to your problems.