No, not at all.

Apparently you have not done much research.

See [www.culteducation.com]

The term "brainwashing" is a popular term to essentially describe what can be understood more precisely as "thought reform" or "coercive persuasion."

See [www.culteducation.com]

Also see [www.culteducation.com]

To be precise thought reform is a process that culminates in undue influence. That is, people affected by the process then do things not in their own best interest that benefit those wielding influence over them through such persuasion techniques.

The net result can be cult tragedies such as the Manson murders, Jonestown, Waco, Aum gas attack, Soloar Temple suicides, "Heaven's Gate" suicides, murder/suicides of the Movment for the Restoration of the Ten Commandments and 9-11 suicide operatives of Al Qaeda.

See [culteducation.com]

We can see influnece in wider society through such persuasion as education, advertising, propaganda and indoctrination, but thought reform or "brainwashing" represents the most extreme expression of persuasion.

See [www.culteducation.com]

To better understand the basic principles of influence you should read the classic book by Robert Cialdini titled "Influence."

See [www.culteducation.com]

Again, these basic principles are taken to extremes in a thought reform program.

Hopefully, this will help you to better understand "brainwashing."

That is, if you are actually interested in understanding this process, as opposed to simply posting arguments and/or "flames" here.

The process commonly termed 'brainwashing' and 'thought reform' very often includes interventions that target the subject's body, not just his or her belief system and emotions.

We have learned a lot about the importance of social interaction and belief systems in conditions of undue influence, but we do not always investigate the physical conditions in which undue influence is exerted--how subject's's bodies are treated.

As a result a very important part of the recipe for undue influence often escapes scrutiny.

The good news is that this component--the body/mechanical portion of the undue influence recipe can be readily identified once we understand its importance and know what to look for.

This is useful both in designing research protocols--and applying rules of evidence in law.

We may never understand why we changed our beliefs in a certain situation, fear we were foolish or weak. But if we can identify some simple but important ways that our bodies were thrown off-balance and caused us to regress and become more suggestible, then that situation may become less mysterious and we may understand that something was done to us--and be able to prevent this from happening again.

But the secret is to become aware of our bodies and that the condition of our bodies will either strengthen or hamper our capacity to identify undue influence.

We live in a culture that tends to emphasize mind and devalues the body, so unless we develop special interests, we do not usually pay attention to our bodies, and are more likely to focus on belief systems and social interactions.

Mind and body are intimately linked. Doing certain things to bodies will have a powerful effect on people's minds.

Keeping people up past bedtime, room arrangements that are very uncomfortable, limiting bathroom breaks -- all of this may escape notice, not seem significant, but can throw people's bodies off balance and make them more suggestible.

Highly educated intelligent people may be especially vulnerable because years of higher education often lead us to focus on verbal material and to ignore our bodies and physical environment.

Persons who have studied techniques of undue influence have already identified some components which target the body. These may include but not be limited to:

1) Social isolation and secrecy (identified in Philip Zimbardo's Stanford Prison Experiment), which Robert J. Lifton termed 'milieu control'--that is control of the physical and social environment in which people are being influenced. In such a situation--subjects either are denied access to the full range of information and viewpoints about a group and are given only what the group wants them to know. This makes informed consent impossible.

2) Some groups use sleep deprivation and confrontation. Stress and sleep deprivation directly affect both body and mind and make it much more difficult to access and apply critical thinking skills--much the way an overheated computer tends to shut down and 'crash'.

Sleep deprivation is very important. The January 26, 2004 issue of Business Week had a cover story on the prevalence of insominia and sleep disorders. A lot of people are not getting sufficient sleep.

[www.businessweek.com]

Many people are unaware that they have conditions such as ADD/ADHD or bipolar disorder. They be especially vulnerable if they run short on sleep--which can be an issue if they are persuaded to attend some types of Large Group Awareness Trainings or marathon encounter groups. This article is from the mother of a child with ADD:

[borntoexplore.org]

Though the articles do not mention the role of sleep deprivation and undue influence, all this suggests if in which they're further deprived of sleep, persons already short on sleep (ask most parents you know!) are likely to become especially vulnerable to indoctrination and undue influence.

Educating people to protect themselves from undue influence will reach a new level of sophistication when we can teach people to pay attention to how their bodies are being treated, as well what patterns of social interactions are taking place.

When we have been unduly influenced by an intervention that has placed our bodies off balance, we cannot 'think our way out of it'--the recovery process has to include attention to physical healing as well. When we are sleep deprived, critical thinking is disabled. As long as we are sleep deprived we cannot apply critical thinking.

Drug addiction is a condition that affects body as well as mind. Recovering drug addicts have told me that when they were in the grip of their habits, their critical thinking supported the habit.

In a condition of undue influence, where the body is placed under sufficient stress, critical thinking can be co-opted by a group that uses undue influence. Critical thinking is like a tree--with enough skilled effort, that entire tree can be uprooted, then transported, roots and all, to another location and replanted.

The point of cult awareness is to make sure our own capacity for critical thinking remains in our own soil and isnt transported elsewhere.

I posted an old article from 1997 everyone should read. It's on afl, or here's a link:

[etext.lib.virginia.edu]



Ellen

Quote
maidynfall
is that as absurd a question as it sounds?!

i took the forum last fall, and am currently in a seminar. i'm getting quite a bit out of my education (indoctrination?), but remain what i consider to be healthfully skeptical. generally, my life is the same; i.e., i'm not incessantly doing landmark-ish stuff, pressuring people to come to an introduction, or blowing off non-landmark friends. no one's remarked, "you're different, in a peculiar way."

is it possible to keep this in perspective? what are the signs i'm going too far?

Since I am new to this board I'll start with an abbreviated background. I did the est Training in 1975 at the age of 18. I left est by 1983 after a couple years earlier I started questioning whether est was acting on it's ideas and then whether the ideas where sound. I've investigated est/Landmark since then through reading, introspection and did some seminar sessions in Landmark in 2002. The seminar session I did in 2002 was the Landmark Forum in Action series to compare to the seminars I did 25 years earlier, observe the particpants interactions and seminar leaders methods.

My response to your question is to identify the ideas you are given in Landmark courses and by other Landmark graduates. Evaluate if those ideas are effectively put into practice. And evaluate the ideas themselves -- are they workable and consistant or contradict themselves. If you want you can present some of the content in seminars you are dealing with and we can evaluate their efficacy. Or feel free to email me.

-- Caligari

I like to think of the term "brainwashing" as living in a bubble, without methods or means to think, perceive, and act freely-with an open mind. In my religious experience growing up I read the Bible along with a textbook called Science and Health, a key to better understand the Bible. As we all know there are many religions out there that interperate the Bible - from interpreting it extremely literately to taking messages and applying the message to fit their own lives. I never considered myself to be brainwashed, however now, looking back at my life now & with the assistance of my fiancee - (who broke me out of my bubble) it has been made clear that the religion I grew up in brainwashed me.

in addition to examining ideas and contents of belief systems, pay attention to the physical setting in which you were exposed to the information, and whether you were able to get sufficient sleep.

If your body is thrown off balance by lack of sleep, poor diet, stress, uncomfortable postures, this is going to affect your mind, along with confusion induced by certain belief systems.

There are reasons why interrogation methods all over the world utilize uncomfortable physical postures, isolate people so they cannot get outside information, and disrupt their sleep patterns--all of this tampers with the 'hard ware' of the brain and body---and eventually disrupts the 'software' of critical thinking.

and throw in a little hypnotism that u arent aware of and
there u have it. thats why its called brainwashing.

Well, I guess I'll pay my 2 cents -worth here....now remember I ave not been 'Influenced" myself but watched what happened with my mate for 22 yrs...
again, if she was getting a cold I could tell, if she had had a bad/sstress-filled day at work...I knew (physical & sensing clues)...

After she started LEC...she was not at all who she really was...there was a cassette tape playing when she "talked" plus the tranced (IMO) stare...

I sensed that really, she had no idea what had happened. If someone is washed, hypnotized (sp?) or both how could they be aware?

The marketing people of consumer-oriented societies know about the subtle ways of influence. How many of us men/women have used the back door of influence to get what you really wanted on a date? Us Humane folks, really hear only what we want to hear...thus the ease to be fed what someone else wants us to hear (political folks included) so, if you could possibly feed/lead someones thinking/brain patterns down your - own path..."imagine the possibilites..because you did not affront them directly..their heads "bubbled it up" (My witness experience) themselves

What a great marketing/business maneuver eh? suck 'em in/zombie-'em/get'em recruitin'/GET MONEY!!!!

My personal experience during 2 LEC guest-nights provided a sober view of the "zombie-ism" and hard-sell tools!

Watching my ex drift away slowly on a LEC raft in a ocean fog enabled me to see really what was taking place, perhaps unlike most of you who "have suffered and endured", possibly giving me a unique vantage-point...but hey, what the heck might I know?

P A X

Quote
corboy
in addition to examining ideas and contents of belief systems, pay attention to the physical setting in which you were exposed to the information, and whether you were able to get sufficient sleep.

If your body is thrown off balance by lack of sleep, poor diet, stress, uncomfortable postures, this is going to affect your mind, along with confusion induced by certain belief systems.

There are reasons why interrogation methods all over the world utilize uncomfortable physical postures, isolate people so they cannot get outside information, and disrupt their sleep patterns--all of this tampers with the 'hard ware' of the brain and body---and eventually disrupts the 'software' of critical thinking.

While physical conditions are significant, they are imposed through ideas like "integrity". The ideas put the values such as "keeping your agreement" above your rational determination to not sit in a uncomfortable chair, sleep sufficiently, etc. The concepts enforce the physical conditions and if properly questioned will eliminate them. Since the person would figure out to leave.

-- Caligari

Quote

While physical conditions are significant, they are imposed through ideas like "integrity". The ideas put the values such as "keeping your agreement" above your rational determination to not sit in a uncomfortable chair, sleep sufficiently, etc. The concepts enforce the physical conditions and if properly questioned will eliminate them. Since the person would figure out to leave.

-- Caligari

A downward spiral. Physical discomfort, confusion and lack of sleep lead to acceptance of concepts like "Integrity," which reinforce the belief that you should accept or dismiss the physical discomfort, which leads to more discomfort and more acceptance of such beliefs...and on and on.

glam