Hi,

I found this board while I was looking for some information on religions and cults, due to worries over my cousin.

I'm not sure if this is the correct forum to put this in, so apologies if it isn't.

Is there a way of discovering whether a "religion" is actually a cult or a religion?

My cousin has recently started following a "Christian" religion but she won't tell me which one it is.

Go here and see what matches up with what you've seen of your cousin's situation.

[culteducation.com]

The 'cults on campus' section, 'influence and persuasion' and 'general groups' section have info about warning signs.

It is atypical for a Christian group to instruct members to with hold information when asked questions by relatives and friends--members of Christian groups and churches are glad to discuss the beliefs, hopes and dreams of their group.

Try to keep inviting your cousin to join you and the rest of the family, especially doing things that are playful. You dont yet know the nature of the group your cousin is in, but the first thing that fades away in any hurtful group or relationship is--playfulness. Controlling groups and people want to monopolize one's attention and energy and they want things to be predictable and on schedule. All control freaks whether in groups or in bad relationships dislike genuine humor and play. If your cousin starts losing his or her sense of humor, starts coming across tight and tense, and seems to be watching his or her words and behavior in ways that are atypical, thats a tip off.

If you're close enough to your cousin, give periodic reminders, 'If you get really sick and need a place where you can lie down and get some rest, call me and I will pick you up.'

That will quietly convey that there is still a safe loving place outside the group, a safe haven, that your cousin can count on. That can counter any possible teachings she/he may be getting that the world is a bad, evil place. Its a bit harder to really believe that if you're told you have someone in your life who has a spare bedroom and a pot of chicken soup on the stove.

Someone giving a cult education lecture said that one thing that helped her discover that she disliked her controlling group and wanted out was when she broke her leg working on a cult project and was sent home--the group was too cheap to pay her medical bills. Her family'd been worried about her, but they didnt try to argue with her because arguing would've inflamed her commitment to the group. Instead, they played lots of games of Scrabble, something the family had always done.

It was the innocent play and pleasure of laughing together around the Scrabble board that caused our friend to realize how tight and joyless her group actually was--and that she really didnt want to return.

Thanks for the information, but I am still not very clear on whether my cousin is in a cult type of group or if it's just a religion.

I have some information which she game me via email. If someone would help me, then please send a PM to me so I can provide the extracts (from her emails to me). It might be easier for someone who knows more about this sort of thing (than I do), to see the extracts.

Thank you.

before your PM priviliges activate.

If you can post material on the board from the e-mail that will enable our many readers to see it and increase the likelihood that someone can tell you more.

I cant guarantee I'd be able to identify what the group is. This message board is set up so the community can help each other. Many heads are better than one!

I guess so, even though I feel it would be a bigger invasion of my cousin's privacy. However, it's for her own good.

Her spelling and grammer is terrible so please bear that in mind.

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I had been became Christian few weeks ago (2nd time-mean God&Jesus came into my life and they took all my Sin and i had been forgiven by god all mistaked i made before and i was very bad and so i am now felt alot peace and happy) and i felt alot better than i was before. You remember i told you that i wanted to kill myself as i really got no where to live, fed up with life, people, worrying about future, and i dont see whole point me living in future. I go church every sunday and met new friends they are very nice&and we pray toghther and i pray too. (if you dont believe me than that up to you as you imaged what i would be like now??? alot worse and i could my life would be ended) (I will be sent you leaflet what happened about me and be honest it was SO AMAZED!!!) Soon I will be baptism next few week time or months or next year will let you know.

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I has changed, as god gave me holy spirts and is inside me and i felt alot happy and peace. anything happens now, later or anything i hoping for i have to pray to god&jesus and i will get my answer and i ask my mates to pray and is does work. i must trust god!!! i must not worry about anyting,friends and family only myself to focus to god for now and learning bible it is very difficult but i am learning and see people and talk about it and it is very good. You will get leaflet soon (not know when)about myself and what happened) Also i dont feel Nana, Chris and Angela around me, i may some feel watching me - only short time and i most feel only holy sprit, god and jesus where i can talk to them all time and whatever i need help.

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soon will try look other job.my mate said to me trust god, as he have plan for me and best job that i can do but i have to be patient!!

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I dont understand what mean by this "They say that God helps these who helps themselves" well i felt better today as i belive god&jesus made me better when i talked to them. Sound like to me you dont believe god etc. (i do believe bible too). Many people who from my mates and met at church they said "God know what best for me and god have plan for my future!"

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you go ahead believe whatever you want, but i afraid that i do not believe what you believe in. People who live now they never reborn in pasted. you only reborn in heaven or hell etc. behind that god made us and made this world,light and dark, jesus etc. i believe what other people said and way i learned by talk with people and read bible.(i know it true) god has plan for my future. i do not belive science etc (of course might something happen, you can either believe something happen or you can trust god-jesus will come back for us) people who are Christian they will go heaven and people are unbeliver they stay on earth. i heard and read bible. No one can create before you was born. (and now i am new child of god)

Do you really want to know this:

over last 2years, i was about going to kill myself and fear is going to happened. I told someone that i am going ahead doing since i moved flat. next things my mates told me they had been prayed that i did not know about, and they pray that to make sure i got accommodation. god is true and he caring, protected me and now i became full christian and soon baptism (giving me new life) and that god and jesus and holy spirt is with me all my life.

Now, I don't have a problem with her beliving in God, and following a religion, but the reason why I'm unsure as to whether it's a destructive religion/cult or not is because I asked her face to face what sort of Christian religion is is, she wouldn't tell me.

Also, it seems that she doesn't understand the basics, (for example, God does help those who help themselves) then how can she expect to understand the rest of it?

Also I told her that while the Bible speaks a lot of truth, some of it is symbolic, for example, the creation of Adam and Eve, the creation of the Earth and so on is symbolic because we all know that it couldn't have happened that way. It took millions of years to evolve as humans for example (according to science), and how can the Earth be created in seven days, when we know through sciencific research that the Earth wasn't created in seven days? She reckons that science was wrong, and that it happens exactly as the Bible describes it.

If you notice, when I said to her that God helps those who help themselves, she thought that I sounded like I didn't believe in God. In fact, God is a major part of my life - I have a great love for Him. I felt offended by that, and told her that I felt offended.

Now, what's she's coming out with might be just part of the dogma from the religion, or it might not be. I was baptised as C of E as a baby, and know something of the religion, and I have read the Bible from cover to cover as a child. I chose to stop following religions of any kind because although there were some things I agreed with, there was a lot of things I don't agree with. Instead, I am spiritual, which is more universal (some see it as a religion, but I don't. I see it as a way of life) - I try to live my life as best as I can, without hurting anyone. Sadly, my cousin seems to think that I'm wrong (I might well be or I might not be!).

Basically, I'm trying to learn more about my cousin's religion, whatever that might be, so I can educate myself, as I am more open minded about other religions as well as my own way of life. I also tried to explain to my cousin what my way of life - spirituality - is about, but she didn't want to know, saying it was completely wrong. It's as if what her church-going friends are saying is the absolute truth, and everything I'm (and everyone else) saying is a pack of lies. :(

Here is a link that can help you identify abusive churches:

[abusivechurches.org]

Here's a suggestion: your cousin probably has you pegged as skeptical. If there is someone else she cares about who is also concerned about her, work up a ploy to persuade her to send that pamphlet. Have the other person pretend to be in distress. Make noises about being at the end of his or her rope. People love to be helpers and that may persuade your cousin to take action and send that brochure. Make it clear that you want printed literature, because often that gives clues.

Once you have that literature in hand, call your diocese and tell them you need the name of a cult watch program--some organizations are more active in the UK than in the US.

Here is a list of resource centers

[www.factnet.org]

One in the United Kingdom is:

Cult Information Center (CIC)
web site: [www.cultinformation.org.uk]
location: BCM Cults
London WCIN 3XX England
telephone: 0870 777 3800
fax: 01689 830 860
contact: Ian Haworth

CIC is an educational charity providing advice and information for victims of cults, their families and friends, researchers and the media. CIC was founded in 1987 and became a registered Charity (No. 1012914) in 1992. It was the first educational organisation focusing critical concern on the harmful methods of the cults to be granted charitable status in the United Kingdom.
CIC is concerned about the use of deceptive and manipulative methods used by cults to recruit and indoctrinate unsuspecting members of society.
CIC believes that these cult methods present a threat to the well-being of the individual and the family.
Consequently CIC sees the need for gathering and disseminating accurate information on cultism and aims to meet that need.

The interesting thing is to find out what process your cousin went through. Its possible she was not suicidal when she encountered her recruiter, then went through some wild group exercise in which she was made to feel sad, then made to feel ecstatic, persuaded she was worse off than she was, then persuaded she was better off.

Or perhaps she was depressed when she met these people and is terrified her depression will return if the ecstacy fades. If she is persuaded to leave, her family MUST be able to provide counseling so she will have the necessary support to deal with the sadness and puzzlement that so often remains when the group induced ecstacy fades.

Meanwhile, concentrate on getting the brochure and try whenever you can to include her in family activities. If she needs money, its usually advised not to send it because often the funds are given to the group and so long as a member is a milch cow, the group is more likely to keep them.

If your cousin needs clothing or other kinds of care, send non refundable gift certificates, boxes of home cooked goodies and repeat that you alway have a spare room for her whenever she needs to visit.

Once you find the name of the group, alert the Church of England diocese in whatever area your cousin was recruited--their clergy should know which groups are active in the area so they can educate parishioners.

OK thank you for your information. I will do my best to get that leaflet from her. The problem is, she lives about 100 miles away from me. Also she asked me to go to her baptism, then when we spoke again, she said not to worry about attending the baptism. Strange. I'm not skeptical of any genuine religion as I respect other people's beliefs, but I am skeptical about this one because it doesn't sound right to me. I'll remain a skeptic until I'm proven wrong. Her Mum and family are against this involvement that she has with the "religion". I haven't actually spoken to them yet about it (things are a bit frosty between myself and my aunty), but I plan on speaking to her Mum about it, as she might have more information about the whole thing.

SpiritualSoul
I too am new to the board so I am still trying to figure out how to post :)etc etc.
I was reading the extract you posted and have a quick question,has she expressed that she is now Born-again ?maybe she does NOT have a religion but a personal relationship with Jesus Christ.She seems to be a "new person" and maybe that is why she is not being understood.
Thank-you in advance

You see, that's another thing. I don't think that is what's happening exactly. If it was just a personal relationship with Jesus, then I wouldn't have a problem with it, as I have one too. It's the fact that she thinks that everything the church-going peeps she knows are telling her is the absolute truth, even to the point of denying science itself. So in other words, she thinks that for example the world was created in seven days etc is exactly what happened. Also, she refers to her "old" self as bad, when I know for a fact that she was not a bad person in the past, she was just like a regular teenager, never been in trouble with the police, doing drugs etc. So where did this idea that she was a bad person in the past come from? Reading the extracts, I get the feeling that it came from the people she goes to church with. I'm very perceptive, and can read in between the lines, and my instinct is telling me that not all is as it should be.

After reading your posts I would have to say I have had a related experience. Personally, it sounds like she has accept Jesus Christ as her savior. This could shed some light on why she feels like a new person. When I accepted Christ, I too felt like a new person. Everything from the past seems "worldly" and bad. It makes a person feel like they are closly connected to God and creates a feeling that they can always talk to him no matter what. The religion I belong to still believes that the world was created in seven days. The Bible does not specify whether these "days" as we define then, as being 24 hours long. But if one believes that God is Almighty and the most powerful being, then one can't place limits on his power, no matter what science says. This is where faith comes into play. If we had a scientific reason for everything, what would be the point of faith? Faith is a belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence as defined in the dictionary.

With all that said, I would still try and find out what religion it is she is practicing just to be safe.